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Original poster

Kitchen plans ownership

12 replies

papalazaru · 21/02/2014 10:03

Just wanted to canvass opinion on what is usual practice.
1 kitchen designer creates plans and lets you take them away to think over or
2 kitchen designer creates plans and you can only look at them in the showroom
It seems odd to me that if you pay for the design service you don't actually own the designs to take away.

OP posts:
OnePlanOnHouzz · 21/02/2014 10:39

depends if you mean a proper independent kitchen design professional who's working for you, and doesn't sell any products, other than the design service ... ( like I would work!) answer 1 yours to keep and pass on to whomever you wish !! because you have paid for the service.

or if you go to a place that makes their money by selling you the end product ie a kitchen - as then the design is often offered for 'free' but usually you can't ask for it to keep, as they have invested time into it. answer 2 you can look but not keep ( as you haven't paid for the service )

if they charged you to design - and they charge an unsubsidised price - then I would hope that you would be able to take the designs away to do what you like with them ! not many offer this service !!!!

for a free plan that you can take away go to a place like wickes/ B&Q / homebase - but they won't be as tailored in most cases - and often they are not 'designed to suit you ' more likely just planned to roughly fit the space . ok if you are doing up to let / sell or you just have no interest in kitchens !!!

OnePlanOnHouzz · 21/02/2014 10:42

did you pay for the design service ? what did you pay ?

Original poster
papalazaru · 21/02/2014 10:54

Thx oneplan. Here's my specific example.....
Kitchen shop 1 - have done a design and quotation for finished kitchen. No design fee paid and i have the paper plans to take away and mull over
Kitchen shop 2 - charge £75 for the design (refundable against the kitchen) and I can can only see the plans in the shop.

Intend to visit at least one other designer but I just wanted to find out how 'normal' example 2 is if you see what I mean......

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OnePlanOnHouzz · 21/02/2014 11:04

I see ! well £75 is a subsidised fee - not what it would actually cost to cover the time spent - so that's why they won't let you take the designs away .

You might be better off commissioning your own, totally independent design - then shopping around with one set of plans to truly compare like for like - and also to haggle down to the best possible price !

there are even companies online who supply product - that don't design - to keep prices down !

OnePlanOnHouzz · 21/02/2014 11:17

nb - did they make it clear to you that if you paid that you wouldn't be able to take the design away ?!? seems a bit unfair !!

kitchen companies often put a charge like this to minimise the 'time wasters ' ie people who have no intention of buying - just want a plan to take to the DIY shop ! it seems although you are genuinely looking they maybe haven't been as clear as they should have been !!

Belindabelle · 21/02/2014 11:28

In my (limited) experience you are not allowed to take the plans away until you have committed to buy the kitchen and paid a hefty deposit. After that you are given time to mull things over and make any changes to the final design.

Original poster
papalazaru · 21/02/2014 12:26

oneplan - K2 has made it clear ahead of the design appt that the plans stay with them. I suppose given the open nature of my dealings with K1 I was just a bit Hmm. That's why I just wanted to see what was 'normal'.

OP posts:
kmdesign · 22/02/2014 07:11

The real cost of producing quality plans is in the region of £500-600 assuming 2 days designer time.

Generally the only places that give plans away are the ones that produce rubbish designs, with the client sat next to them in 45 minutes and put ridiculous markups on their products to cover the cost of wasted time. Proper designs take a lot longer.

Studios that charge a token £50-100 for a design service do it to deter time wasters. There are plenty about. For that sort of money, the buyer usually doesn't own plans and the studio takes no responsibility for accuracy or suitability of plans for the space.

Usually, for a larger fee of between £200-500, the studio will allow you to take plans away to consider but the ownership of copyright may still lie with the studio unless they expressly allow you to own it.

Will they pursue you in court if you gave the plans to another company - probably not. But its a moral question.

OnePlanOnHouzz · 22/02/2014 07:59

brilliant explanation KMDesign !

Original poster
papalazaru · 22/02/2014 10:47

Thanks. That makes a lot of sense. I think K1 must be unusual as their plans are really good and we have gone through about 3 iterations so far - probably in for a 4th due to the awkward space and my requests!
I absolutely understand that good design costs money and is worth paying for. I'm not looking to get somethng for free.

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kmdesign · 22/02/2014 11:04

papalazaru - No insinuations intended here so please done misunderstand.

I know there are still good companies that give out plans for free and there isn't a formula that suits everyone. However, over the years the consensus starting to build within the industry is that quality outfits needn't feel compelled to try and match the offerings from the sheds who are only after selling as much product as possible without any attention to service, quality or design.

I run a kitchen design studio and we operate a hybrid model-
We dont charge for design in the first instance and offer a consultation and free initial design and quote. The client is then offered to take visuals etc away for a deductible charge, giving them the ability to see what is being offered and at what price. They can come back as often as they like to see, review and change the plans but take designs away only on payment of a design fee. About 60-70% feel that this is a fair policy and don't hesitate to pay to take away the designs. 95% of them end up buying the kitchen from us.

Original poster
papalazaru · 22/02/2014 14:07

Oh no kmd I didn't mean to sound as though I was being snippy. Was just writing on my iphone so being brief!
I like the sound of your model too as it gives you and your client a chance to know if you're on the same page and then allows the client to take it further and I can see why you end up with a high return rate.

Personally I like to have a plan and to stand in the space visualising what I have on paper. I'm not sure how easy this will be to do with a plan which I have to leave at the shop.
Anyway - I'll let you know how I get on. And thanks again for your insights.

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