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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

School wants my sons appointments to be made at different time so absence stats look better

24 replies

2babyblues · 03/12/2009 11:18

Hello,

Just wanted some advice about out of school appointments. My son has had a speech therapy appointment nearly every week this term at 9.30 and I can usually get him into school by about 10.45 on these days. The reason they are this time is because I have to get my mum to look after my 2 year old during these appointments. My mum lives about 45 mins away and she can't do afternoons.

The school has now told me that I need to make these appointments in the afternoon or preferably after school. I explained about needing my mum to look after my other son and they suggested that I book his appointment at around 11am so that he had been signed in at school first so it doesn't affect his and their absence statistics!!!! I said that this would probably mean he misses more school than if he had it first thing. They didn't seem to care as long as the figures were ok. They also said he had missed lots of school this term due to his operation.

I am really annoyed now I have thought about it. Anytime he has had out of school has been for a legitimate reason and I have always taken the paperwork in. He has never even been taken out for holiday.

Another thing I thought was that some schools have speech therapists that come in so then it wouldn't even be counted as an absence. It was the school who referred him in the first place too.

What shall I say next? I don't want to make the appointments at 11am as I think it is more disruptive for him and I don't see why I should really. I also don't see why their stats should come above what is more practical for my son.

OP posts:

MissAnneElk · 03/12/2009 11:23

To suggest an 11.00am appointment to make their stats look better is outrageous. What age is he?

Original poster

2babyblues · 03/12/2009 11:23

He is 5 and in Year 1.

OP posts:

islandofsodor · 03/12/2009 11:25

Speech therapy appointments are like gold dust in some areas. Explain to the school that you have to take the times available within the contraints of your childcare needs and that you will not be altering the appointments to suit them.

FabIsVeryHappy · 03/12/2009 11:26

It isn't really the schools fault that you have no child care but they are being unfair saying it is about numbers.

My children have had to have appointments at the hospital and where possible I do it out of school times but sometimes it just isn't possible.

Can't they see that if your son gets the help he needs it will make things easier for him and the teachers.

Original poster

2babyblues · 03/12/2009 11:26

Exactly, and I not even sure I could change the time if I wanted. Thanks for answering.

OP posts:

Addictedtothepc · 03/12/2009 11:27

I think you should go in and have a chat with them, explain why you feel the current time is more suitable.

I wouldn't be swayed by a school trying to improve their Stats, focus on what's best for your child that's what's really important.

RustyBear · 03/12/2009 11:35

I work at a junior school, sometimes in the office & for anything like this the secretary puts in a code that means it doesn't get counted as an absence - I forget what the actual code/definition is, but it's the same as visiting a secondary school or any other 'educational' reason.

MollieO · 03/12/2009 13:42

I would have thought being late to school once a week is neither here nor there for their statistics. Maybe they should be concentrating their efforts on pupils who are either playing truant or whose parents don't bother to ensure they go to school.

I can't think of anything polite that I would say to them in response to their demand request.

GrungeBlobPrimpants · 03/12/2009 13:50

That is a ludicrous situation, OP.

A lot of speech therapy is actually the result of referrals FROM schools - if difficulties develop in phonics/reading then SALT intervention may be required - and there are long waiting lists too. So if you do speak to school, tell them that this absence will probably be boosting their SATS (if they still exist by then) in a few years.

I've had to take my dcs out of both primary and secondary for othodontic appointments, SALT and opthamlmic. I have never, ever had any problem at all.

pantomimecow · 03/12/2009 16:49

just smile and nod.

mrz · 03/12/2009 18:09

I can understand a school asking if appointments could be made for afternoons rather than mornings from an educational point of view but not from an attendance issue. Medical appointments don't count as absence in my LA.

Insider333 · 03/12/2009 23:45

I'm a teacher. You son IS FAR MORE IMPORTANT than the school's attendance statistics. Just goes to show where your son's school's priorities lie. Look after your son.

CertainAge · 04/12/2009 07:08

It may not have to go in their absence statistics. They may be able to code it as 'educated elsewhere', or somewhere like that. Basically, there are some categories of not being in school that do not count as absenses.

Pogleswood · 04/12/2009 07:28

I would be annoyed by the school's focus on their figures rather than what is best for your son.Bringing a 5 year old into school and then taking him out again is going to be more disruptive for him,and I wouldn't be that keen on having an after school appointment either,if your DS is likely to be tired(alright for a one-off,but difficult regularly)
And the speech therapy is really important for him,isn't it - not something you are doing for fun.
I wouldn't have mentioned the childcare - just said this was the time we'd been given!

ABetaDad · 04/12/2009 07:32

2babyblues - I agree with others but I do think you need to put something in writing to record the conversation and your formal response. I would write to the Head and say something like the following in order to protect yourself.

"Dear Head

Further to our conversation yesterday about my son's absences. Please confirm that you are satisfied that speech therapy is a legtimate reason for my son to be absent from school and that you are in receipt of all necessary paperwork confirming the reason for his absence. If not, please tell me what paperwork you require.

As I told you, I need to have the early morning appointment times so my mother can look after my other son. I do not intend changing the times of my son's appointments in order to make the school absence figure look better as you have indicated you would prefer.

Yours sincerely

2babyblues"

That way the content of the conversation is recorded as you understand it, you have confirmation of the paperwork being fully in order and you have something to refer to if the matter is escalated to the local authority.

yellowvan · 04/12/2009 07:39

Don't tell them about childcare etc, just say that's the only time they could give you.

Buda · 04/12/2009 07:44

Can't they just register him as in FGS? Esp if he comes in by 11?

Sounds totally 'jobsworth'.

I kept DS off yesterday morning as he had 'tummy ache' which miraculously cleared up by 9.30 when he realised it was no fun at home without Playstation or computer so I took him to school. I spoke to teacher and said I would sign him in late in the register and she said not to worry that she had him down as sick and would just change it.

Surely your son's school can register him as 'ST' (Speech Therapy) till 11 and then as in school?

RustyBear · 04/12/2009 12:31

You can't just register him as in if he's not actually there because the registers are checked in a fire drill/alarm & need to be accurate. But you can put in a code which doesn't count as an absence - or at least counts as a medical absence. If it's OFSTED they are worried about, when we had our inspection in the summer, the figure they worked on excluded medical & educational absences.

Original poster

2babyblues · 04/12/2009 13:50

Thanks for your help. I think I will arrange a meeting with the deputy head.

The school did refer him in the first place and he did have one ST appointment at the end of the day and it had to be cut short as he was too tired and wasn't cooperating! But as I said my mum cannot usually look after my youngest in the afternoons and it is not easy to rely on friends on a regular basis. There is no point taking my 2 year old along as he would cause havoc and the whole point of the ST would be lost.

I think you are right in that it should be counted as educational anyway, especially as I know some children have ST actually in school.

My son is getting a new speech therapist soon so I don't even know what choice of times there will be. If there is a choice I will arrange a similar time as before as that is what suits us. What can they do, arrest us??!!

He also has other appointments that have to be taken in the morning as that is the only time the consultant at the hospital runs their sessions. Luckily these ones are less frequent!

Thanks for all your replies. I am not going to worry about what they say as I don't really have a choice and want what is best for my son.

OP posts:

bellissima · 04/12/2009 14:35

Surely it's far less disruptive for him to have the apptmt and then go to school rather than school-apptmt-school?

In other words I agree with just about every other poster on here.

CertainAge · 04/12/2009 17:12

They can't just register him. They have to follow the Education Act. They aren't being deliberately awkward.

bellabelly · 04/12/2009 17:20

If a student arrives at 10.45am, it should be recorded as a LATE in the register, not an absence, for the morning session.

It will not count towards their absence figures as it is not an absence for th ewhole morning, it will count as a late arrival and will show up in their figures for lateness. Perhaps this is why they are angling for afternoon appts, that way the entire afternoon could be counted as Medical or Educated Offsite and would not show up in their figures at all.

As others have said, they should be thinking about what is best for your child, not what makes the school's absence/lateness figures look better. However, as a teacher i can really understand the pressure schools are under to look their best with these things.

Addictedtothepc · 04/12/2009 18:37

I would avoid an afternoon Speech Therapy Appt at all costs - dc's are too tired to concentrate on a one hour therapy session to get the best out of it. First thing in the morning always worked best for us.

TotalChaos · 04/12/2009 18:46

having had a son in salt in school time, completely agree with other posters. there is a special code they use to record this absence, so am puzzled they are raising it as an issue. would imagine salt if asked would be only too happy to say that they can't arrange appointments around school's convenience!!

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