Primary school place if I didn't fill out the application form for dd?

[Reastie]

Just intrigued. dd will be going to school in September. We have her at a private school nursery and are intending her to go to the private school. On this basis, we didn't fill in the school application form of preference for her state primary school. assuming we have no sudden and unanticipated changes in finances this won't be an issue, but I have been puzzling to myself what happens with her state primary place. Will we get a letter on Thursday offering her a place at a school of their choosing (which we will then turn down for the private school) or how does this work in th is situation? It's been something I've been wondering for months but can't find anything online about this.

She won't be offered a place, she won't be on the system. It is opt in not opt out, at least at the moment. We home educated my ds for the first few years so didn't apply for a place and heard nothing from anyone about it.

You won't get anything. So far all my friends who applied to private schools for their DC did a state application as well, especially those who were waiting on assessment results. When they got given a state place, they rejected the offer, we're asked where the child was going instead and gave private school details then.

Ok interesting. I've heard nothing from my council about form filling etc for school places so if I wanted to apply for dd I've had to look up everything myself. Which is all very well but I do wonder to myself if I were new to the country or a non interested parent etc and hadn't applied for my dc to go to school what would happen then, which is why I assumed all children would automatically be given a place somewhere and then accept or turn it down, and the turn down places would then be waiting for people who were appealing the places they'd been given.

OP - round here there are loads of posters put up saying something like:
"Was your child born between 1st September 2010 and 31st August 2011? If so then they will be starting school September 2015. You need to apply for a place by 15th January. See xxx for details"
These posters are anywhere where parents of pre-schoolers are likely to hang out, e.g. nurseries, playgroups, doctors, library, soft play.
So they don't proactively send info, but there is info around nudging you.

Oh ok, that info has completely passed me by then!

The council has no reason to know if, for example, your child has moved out of the area to live with grandparents or whatever. It's viewed as your responsibility, same as registering with a doctor etc, though there are posters etc!

Was there no information at your ds's nursery?

I think it is in the interests of the government to make state schooling an opt in process, then they can get away with fines for term time holidays and the like because it was the education option the parents signed up for.

I'm also not sure that the computer systems are joined up enough to know exactly where each child lives after they are registered at birth, not every family claims child benefit, there is no obligation to register with a GP and children aren't included on the electoral role - even discounting data control issues.

Hazey nope, nothing at her nursery about the school form, but then I suppose they assume she will stay with them.

Still makes me think though, I'd you had a negligent parent then a child could just not go to any schooling for goodness knows how long before anyone might find out.

Absolutely.
The best way to 'home school' (or not) without check up is never to register for a school in the first place, I believe. And you also have to not go to doctors or hospital as they often want to know the school. And not come under the radar of SS.

Our local authority has a local agreement with the health authority, and all birth data (i.e. name, DoB, and address) is shared, so that they can run checks after Reception admissions, and mop-up those that haven't applied.
Of course, they can only use the address that the health authority had at birth, unless you specifically tell the LA your new one.

They put posters up in nurseries (day-care type, not those attached to independent schools), GPs surgeries, local chemists, health centres, arts centres, libraries, etc etc.

Private school nursery have no reason to tell you about state school application, they want you to continue paying them for education.

Tbf, it may well be that the LA don't send posters to private school nurseries. My private daycare had one up that I assume the LA sent.

But private day care know they will lose all their charges to other settings at age 5 or earlier. A private school will be hoping to keep them till school leaving age.

"The best way to 'home school' (or not) without check up is never to register for a school in the first place, I believe. And you also have to not go to doctors or hospital as they often want to know the school. And not come under the radar of SS."

No it isn't. The best way to home school is either not register at all or to deregister. And if you don't want visits, refuse them when offered (although that is not necessarily a sensible thing to do). And you can still be registered with doctors and so on- you just put "home schooled" in the qppropriate box. You don't have to be "under the radar" to home school- whatever the tinfoil hat brigade tell you.

So does that mean there are children falling through the net because their parents, for whatever reason, do not register their children? I find that worrying.

True, UniS, but doesn't negate my other point which is that the LA may not send them posters.

Parents don't have to send their child to school they just have to ensure that they are educated ... That can be at home.

Often health visitors will "reveal" unregistered children when transferring care to school nurses.

Its not just schools who have a responsibility for children's welfare. If a child seems to be neglected they should be observed by other professionals, and members of the public.

Most chaotic families do send their children to school (at least some of the time) - as it gives them a break (and the children a meal).

They take children's details from GPs here and send letters out. I (wrongly) assumed it was the same everywhere.

Every year there are no doubt a few people who miss the application deadline because they didn't see a poster, ring their local school or council to enquire about the process etc. I imagine almost all of those people end up with a school place before September because they ring someone by June or July at least. LAs have limited budgets and have to gauge how much additional spending would be required to reach a small proportion of people and whether the change in outcome is worth it.

The only place I've seen posters round here was ... at school. The HT also put an explicit reminder in the newsletter before the January deadline that you have to apply for the siblings too, it isn't automatic.

No posters in the library, GP, etc. It would have been very easy to miss here, particularly if you have only a hazy idea of when your child starts (how many threads on MN asking just that?!) and you start thinking about it in the run-up to their fourth birthday.

all my friends who applied to private schools for their DC did a state application as well, especially those who were waiting on assessment results. When they got given a state place, they rejected the offer, we're asked where the child was going instead and gave private school details then.

Round here where there is huge pressure for school places, anyone intending to stay in the private sector doesn't reject the offer (so long as it is for an acceptable school). They accept it and keep it "in hand" right up to September. Then if they do have a sudden unexpected change of circumstances they have a backup option, and if all goes to plan they just let the school/lea know on the first day of the September term that they don't need the place after all. This is quite a good thing for the rest of us as it means there's a decent chance of getting a place in a preferred school if you didn't get the offer you wanted and are on a waiting list.

Also not every child attending a private preschool attached to a private school gets a school place when the time comes. If the school prides itself on the academic achievements of its pupils, the preschool is on the lookout for any preschooler who might have additional needs and the parents get a nasty experience in the summer term when they are firmly told that this school isn't going to be the right environment for little Jonny to thrive in.