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Preschool education

Get advice from other Mumsnetters to find the best nursery for your child on our Preschool forum.

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Original poster

Pre school claiming back fees for missed sessions for funded child...can anyone help?

44 replies

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:02

We were summoned to Preschool this morning and told that the LEA had withdrawn ds's funding because of missed sessions and gave us a bill for £240. I rang the LEA and they knew nothing about it. They said that the Preschool might be claiming it back to repay the LEA as a pre emptive measure for the next time they are audited.
I'm not happy that she lied top us and I'm not happy that we were given no warning. Obviously if I had known, I would have withdrawn him from the sessions we were missing most regularly.
Does anyone have any experience of this or know what our rights are?

OP posts:

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expatinscotland · 27/06/2008 16:03

don't know the answer, but am the parent of a child who will also be a funded child next year so bumping in case someone knows.

Original poster

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:04

Thanks

OP posts:

ScoobyDoo · 27/06/2008 16:05

Never heard of this, is this the 12.5 hours a week that is funded by the gouverment?

So you have missed some days? & they now want you to pay back the money?

happystory · 27/06/2008 16:08

I don't understand. Have you left the preschool? LEA give funding per child on regoister. If he doesn't attend for any reason (hols, illness) they still get the funding.

avenanap · 27/06/2008 16:09

They are funded by the LEA whether you use them or not. You are entitled to them, the nursery recieve the funding, you have a right to choose whether you take them up or not. Dodgy! As far as I am aware, when ds was at nursery they used the vouchers and knocked them off the total cost for his weekly bill. I would tell them to provide you with evidence from the LEA. If they fail to do this then they have committed fraud (obtaining money by deception).

meemar · 27/06/2008 16:11

Preschool have to tell the LEA at the beginning of each term how many funded children they have. The LEA pay the preschool for those children and if they don't attend the preschool have a duty to pay the money back.

She should have talked to you sooner, but you equally should have told the preschool that your ds was not going to use the sessions as they could have been given to another child.

Maybe you can pay the money back in installments.

ScoobyDoo · 27/06/2008 16:11

It all seems a bit strange, when ds was funded at pre-school, it did not matter if he was not there, they even said if he fancied a day off not to worry (this was when i upped his mornings to 5)

Ds was off for holidays, illness, lazy days, his place still got funded.

I would question this & ask them to provide more details.

happystory · 27/06/2008 16:13

Do you have a local Childcare Information Service? They may be able to advise.

MingMingtheWonderPet · 27/06/2008 16:14

As I understand it new guidelines state that the LEAs are within their rights to only fund children who actually attend the sessions that they are booked for. Holidays, sickness etc are allowed, but in some cases LEAs are able to refuse funding if the child is not attending.
Perhaps your pre-school is pre-empting the fact that they may not get funding for your DS's place.
However in your case the LEA soesn't appear to know about this so as the LEA suggested it is probably a pre-emptive measure.
Pre-school should definitely have warned you taht this might happen, probably best to speak to them and to see what their reasons are.

meemar · 27/06/2008 16:15

I think illness, holiday count as days which still get funded - in our preschool you have to fill out an absence note when they return for LEA record.

I think it is when the child is a constant no-show with no explanation that the LEA will refuse to pay.

avenanap · 27/06/2008 16:17

Shouldn't the nursery have used the funding at the times when the child was there as opposed to set times IYSWIM? They are still having funded sessions, but at different times.

happystory · 27/06/2008 16:21

With our LEA, the preschool have to let them know how many sessions a week the child is attending on a termly basis. But there's no communication between them and the LEA about the child's absences, unless, I imagine, it was long term.

Original poster

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:25

I think it is to do with new guidelines. We now have to fill out an absense sheet giving our reasons. Apparently the LEA said that the reasons were not good enough...though this is obviously not true.
As I've said, if I had had some warning I would have changed things.Meemar, he didn't not go to some of the sessions at all, it's just that there was a stronger pattern of absense on some days than others.

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meemar · 27/06/2008 16:25

avenanap - the LEA only fund for the sessions the parent puts the child down for. Is that what you meant?

So if they are registered for 3 sessions and consistantly miss 2 of them, the funding for those 2 sessions will be withdrawn because the preschool will have to record them as non-attending.

ScoobyDoo · 27/06/2008 16:25

Oh so maybe in this case the child has not being going on certain days every week or something?

Not sure how that works then, ds went most of the time just had the usual illness, holidays and couple of lazy days when dd was born!

ScoobyDoo · 27/06/2008 16:27

Sorry Berrie crossed posts with you, in that case i would question it further with the nursery.

Original poster

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:28

Yes it would be fair to say some of the absenses were fairly regular, I don't dispute that...I just think that we should have been warned.

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hatrick · 27/06/2008 16:29

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Original poster

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:31

He started making a huge fuss on days when dd was not attending with him. Mondays and Wednesday sessions were a bit hit and miss. I've been struggling with severe depression on and off and some days I just couldn't face the fuss and found it difficult to go out at all. This is something that I chose not to share with them on the absense sheet.

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avenanap · 27/06/2008 16:32

How much do the sessions cost? £240 seems excessive for missing a few.

That's what I ment meemar. When ds was at nursery I could change the days he was there and the funded sessions were deducted off the bill.

meemar · 27/06/2008 16:33

Berrie, i agree with you the pre-school let it go too long and should have explained this earlier.

Maybe you could discuss a reduction on the bill as you were unaware of the situation and they failed to inform you? Or work out a payment plan to cover it?

The problem with preschools is that they struggle for funds at the best of times and repayment to the LEA will have to come from their own funds.

PortAndLemon · 27/06/2008 16:35

Ask the nursery for documentary evidence that the LEA has withdrawn funding.

Original poster

Berrie · 27/06/2008 16:37

They cost about £6 I think but she is charging us for the full Ofsted rate of £10.41

She is charging for the full term whether he was there or not.

OP posts:

avenanap · 27/06/2008 16:40

Hmm. Ask for a copy of the letter from the LEA, find reciepts if you have handed over any cash, then ask them for copies of the breakdown of charges. Also request confirmation from the LEA in writing that they ar not demanding the money back from the nursery, then find another nursery.

meemar · 27/06/2008 16:42

What is an Ofsted rate?

There is an amount that the LEA give per child (where we live it's £8.50) and I don't know if that is standard or varies between regions.

I would think it reasonable to charge you the pre-shool rate (£6) only for the sessions he didn't attend, as presumably she got funding for the sessions he did attend? (I don't know the full facts on this though)

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