Small dog advice

[user1460471313]

I have finally managed to convince my husband to allow us to get a dog and I am researching breeds. I would prefer a smaller dog. We had Lhasa Apso’s growing up which were very happy on their own during the day but also not hugely intelligent and very yappy. My research keeps bring in me back to a miniature/ toy poodle or some sort of poodle cross. Havanese and Maltese look suitable also but I’m concerned about their ability to be left alone. We generally work from home but would like the ability to go out for a few hours. I also want minimal shedding and yapping. Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated! 🙏

I am starting to think that you might be right. I did love our Lhasa’s and they were absolutely fine on their own which is important for us. How have you found your dog in terms of training? I don’t remember ours being able to do much at all but potentially this was due to a lack of effort from my parents!

I also like the suggestion of a Havanese

She’s ok training wise, but it’s very much if it’s to her benefit, she’ll do it 😁. But she’s eager to please really and we adore her.

We’ve recently bought a holiday home on caravan/mobile site and she’s adapted really well for an old girl, and even there, she’s now ok being left for an hour or so, if we pop to the supermarket. Basically she’s a doddle.

I had dogs growing up, Dalmatian and standard poodle and my mum says she’s far easier!

@wheresmysanitythe cavaliers have longer pointed noses than the kc and we had 4 when I was growing up. No major health issues, all died of old age between 12 and 16. None had separation anxiety but we did have 2 at one point

Get a pair to keep each other company - an only child or having a sister. Twice the cost but twice the fun!

We have two dogs, Rio and Lio, and they’ve been such a lovely addition to our family. I’d suggest choosing a breed based on your lifestyle, grooming needs and temperament. Have you considered a Bichon Frise, Cavalier King Charles Spaniel or Miniature Poodle? They can make lovely family companions. Bichons are generally friendly, Cavaliers are often affectionate, and Miniature Poodles are intelligent. I'd recommend meeting the breeds in person and researching their grooming and exercise needs before deciding.

I have a cockerpoo who would fit your bill. From a well known breeder, has an excellent temperament, doesn't shed, highly intelligent and social. Because of her background she did have a head start. However do not underestimate the stress of the puppy stages.

issue with cockerpoos and crosses is they don’t breed true.

genetics says only one in 4 will be none shedding. One will shed like a cocker, two somewhere in between- which can actually be a big problem as the coat mats as they have two different coat properties.

add to that ethical breeders are extremely hard to find, and unethical ones have many tricks to fool inexperienced buyers. “Well known” doesn’t mean ethical. Many puppy farms are “well known” because they churn out hundreds of puppies.

care to share your breeder? The better known “good” breeders are the more information people like the o/p have when choosing a puppy.

My sister has a cavalier. Sweet dog but does like company.
While some dogs are more clinging that others training then helps enormously with this. I started slow and built up and my dogs were perfectly ok if I had to leave them for a few hours. I’d come home and they’d be snoozing on the sofa.
My friend had the same breed and pretty much trained it to have separation anxiety! Making a big fuss when she went out, a big fuss on her return, he hated it when she left even if there were other people in the house. Start early and build up slowly.

@Yetanotherone12 100% agree

In over 18 months of being on MN, not a single person who has said 'I got my cockerpoo from a great breeder' has actually used a great breeder. When they go into detail and describe them...there's always something that screams 'red flag.' Last time it was a breeder who was breeding her dog every year, for four years - completely unethical when you think of the strain on the poor dog.

For anyone interested, the 'obvious' signs of a bad breeder are;

• no health tests.
• over breeding
• breeding to young
• breeding to old
• not giving the litter adequate attention when raising them
• pressuring families into giving deposits before puppies are even born
• no aftercare.
• not asking families any questions about their suitability for a home
• always having puppies available or multiple litters a year (even one a year is too many tbh)
• breeding for colour/particular appearance (Merle's in Collies, 'Cream' in Goldens etc).
• dogs not able to fulfil the function they were bred for.
• they have little knowledge of both breeds (in the case of crosses) or limited knowledge of their own breed. They make generic comments about 'great with children' but don't warn you/make sure you're aware of the negative traits of the breed (all breeds have 'bad' behaviours - and any prospective buyer should be well aware of them i.e., Goldens are prone to serious resource guarding issues, which can make them a risky choice if you have young children and no experience of the issue).
• they let you visit far too soon after the litter is born or, in the converse, don't want you to visit them at all or don't let you see the whelping box etc

Honestly, miniature poodles are pretty much the best dog for 99% of families when it comes to first time dog ownership. They're intelligent (and easyish to train) but not too intelligent and won't run rings around you like a Collie or GSD would, they're not super high energy but can go for miles if you want them too, they have stable and robust personalities and typically good with other dogs, children and cat, they're typically quite loyal (even if just to one person). They have their challenges (separation anxiety, a bit of yapping) but consistent and good training can help manage those 😊

I also have a Havanese, he’s a really good dog. He only barks at the door bell/front gate/foxes. He doesn’t shed at all and we groom him at home. He can stay home alone for several hours (we rarely do that though). He is very friendly and good with other dogs, children and babies. He sleeps about 20 hours a day! Very undemanding breed.

A Dandie Dimnot terrier? Cute little dog.

Thanks all. I do seem to keep coming back to either a toy or miniature poodle. Does anyone have any advice on the difference between them? Obviously I realise that one is smaller!

Stay away from a x-breed if you are looking for consistent and predictable temperament. A toy poodle is smaller than a miniature.

https://www.thepoodlecouncil.co.uk/member-clubs

This site will help you with dog information and point you to reputable breeders who can assist with obtaining a puppy/dog and talk you through whether they are a good breed for you etc.

Here is why they also suggest not going for x-breeds: https://www.thepoodlecouncil.co.uk/say-no-to-crossbred-poodles

Hope this helps!

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks - while most of your post is excellent (and it may just be how you wrote it), but just a quick note that there is nothing wrong with merle in Collies! It’s a perfectly standard colour for the breed. Double merle breeding is, of course, an entirely different thing, but is banned in the UK so you won’t find it with reputable breeders.

Now, show me a merle French Bulldog/Chihuahua/Chow etc. and I’ll show you a mongrel, but merle is no issue in a lot of breeds.

@WinWhenTheyreSinging absolutely agree nothing wrong with Merle Collies. But, I do genuinely think colour should be the last thing anyone factors into breeding - temperament and ability to work/fulfil their breeds purpose are way more important - because as soon as people seem to start breeding for colour, they forget about the main reason for breeding (to make the breed better for future generations). I probably should have been clearer: someone who lists 'colour' as a primary reason for why they chose a stud (for example) is a massive red flag.

The sad problem is now lots of people are deliberately breeding Merle/Merle dogs to increase their chances of having Merle puppies so they can charge more (and sadly, whilst prohibited by the KC, some 'breed clubs' have actually endorsed it until recently - the Miniature American Shepherd club, for example - and sadly lots of pets4homes breeders still do it).

It's actually one of the things that bothers me most about Golden Retriever breeding right now - too many people breeding for 'English Creams' (a stupid American-ism) and thus ignoring risks around high co-efficient. They're specifically picking unhealthier studs because of the colouring of that dog which is just insane to me.

So yes, 100% agree! I should have been more nuanced, thank you for expanding! 😊

The only difference between toy and miniature poodles is their size.

I have a gorgeous toy poodle who is turning 1 next week.

He isn’t yappy at all- he does bark at the doorbell but that is quite useful!

Im a first time dog owner, and he has been v easy to train.

I was aware of their tendency to separation anxiety and built it up really slowly and he is quite happy to be left for 2-3 hours. I have crate-trained him, which is v divisive on here , but it has worked so well for us.
I can’t recommend the breed highly enough- he’s so cuddly and affectionate; loves a walk but it also happy with a day on the sofa if it’s raining 😆

He’s 4.5kg of love and curls- he doesn’t shed at all.
He adores being put in a handbag and brought into shops and being cooed over!

He is absolutely gorgeous 🥰
I think we will try and crate train, although I suspect I will find it difficult to not just bring the puppy into our room.