MMR jab article in Observer today

[Helenback]

Have any of your read the article about MMR in the Obs today? My 13 month old is booked in for his on Wednesday and I thought I was okay about it but now I am getting jittery. Any advice welcomed!

I don't think the article gave any new information. This subject has been discussed at length on Mumsnet as you can imagine. The only really good info I have ever read has been on threads with JimJams - maybe you could do a search?. MMR threads usually kick off because it is a very emotional subject.

By the way, my son did have MMR injection.

here

no new information, if the MMR take up rate dropped dramatically after the inital scare presumably in a couple of years someone can do an analysis of autism in the vacinnated vs the unvaccinated groups?

Hi Helen - can understand your jitters, we went back and forth with our decision over whether to get DS1 vaccinated.

I can't offer any advice, but all I can say with regards to today's article, is that it really doesn't offer any new information or evidence to the debate either way.

agree with Hippmummy. The Observer seems to make it clear that it's a minority opinion even within the research team that the MMR is responsible for an increase.

The article is about a study that shows that autism is more common than previously thought. It does not offer any further clue as to the cause. Another thread about this here.

Hi Helenback,

My son had his MMR (it was delayed twice due to chickenpox and then some other viral thing) The day he was meant to go in he woke up with a high temp and covered in a rash, which looked exactly like measles in my book of illnesses. I was so worried that he might have caught measles and dh was saying 'is he going to be alright?' and I was really scared. I read everything I could about MMR and decided that in the end, you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't (as far as I could make out from the published info about THAT study, as some of the children had had the singles and 1 had had measles the disease, as well as those that had had MMR) There is info to support either side of the argument on the net and whatever you decide you will find something that backs you up. I felt that I would rather ds be vaccinated than take my chances. Good luck with whatever you decide

IIRC the general outcome of MMR debates on MN seems to be:

• Avoid it if possible if there is a history of auto-immunity problems or bowel problems in the family.

• Only a very small percentage of parents of children with autism believe that the MMR was responsible, but that obviously this is no consolation for those whose children were affected.

• The usual argument that most parents don't realise that their child is autistic until the time the MMR is due anyway is generally agreed to be a load of bollards.

FWIW my two boys are autistic but have been since birth. Both had the MMR but had no reaction to it. Dd has had the MMR and had no problems with it.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

When I spoke to my GP a couple of years ago about my worries regarding the vaccine he suggested I waited until dd was 15-16 months. He said autism will usually have manifested itself by then so you can feel reassured about having the jab if it hasn't IYSWIM. There may be no real evidence for saying that but it made me feel better and I did delay the appointment, she had it at 16 months and is now a healthy 3 year old. Obviously this presents its own risks (ie: if child is exposed to the virus before).

I'd read they did a more extensive study that disproved the original theory that MMR could cause autism. On that basis - and because there have been some small babies die from measles locally - both my dd's had the MMR jab with no side effects. You can have the jabs separately at a cost of about £300 I think..thats supposed to remove the risk (if it exists). Its down to personal choice and its always tough when its your child.

great summary coppertop. it seems to me that generally speaking people do not like subtlely in this argument at all, and I include the government in that.

That article does nothing more than add fuel to the fire imo. And really you have to question the motives behind any of these articles, or research. I refused the MMR at 14 as I didn't like the way it had been introduced or the hype about autism and I'd already had 2 of the diseases and a jab for the other! However when it came to ds I ummed and ahhhed and consulted allsorts of people, in the end I just took the plunge and did it. As one poster has said, you're damned if you do damned if you don't!! I've seen a grown man with mumps and it's not pleasant and that was what convinced me in the end!! My ds had the 3in1 jab and he suffered absolutely no side effects whatsoever and I know 7 other children who have all had the same jab with no effects either. I know that doesn't really help but I hope it might help along the way to your decision!!

Thanks so much for your thoughts on this. Actually my husband does have an autoimmune disease so I think I will seek further advice. I hadn't heard that this could be a potential issue. I know this is really emotive so thanks for sticking your necks out!

DD had seperate vacinations as there's history of bowel cancer in my family. We were neer NOT going to have her vaccinated, the choice was how to do it. It's been a pain dri ving back and forth to Eltham but I'm glad I did it seperately and minimised the (so called) risk. Which reminds me, I have a reminder from them to get her booster booked in!

If you're feeling nervous turn your TV off - Wakefield is about to be face the GMC so it will be all over the news for the next month.

Autoimmunity (family history of) is a risk factor for autism, but the biggest risk factor for damage from the MMR is bowel disease, e.g family history of Crohns. People who work in the field (and accept a link) reckon that 5% of autism cases were triggered by MMR, so not a huge number; it's not that common (Jimjams with a name change btw).

and now I really am signing off.

I have crohn's
I chose the singles

but I think you will find that there is also doubt over single measles vaccine where crohn's is concerned

Gess - so glad it's you. I often wonder where you had got too. Hope things are good?

My son was one of the unlucky few. He didn't have mmr until 18 months so the fact that he regressed violently was totally evident.
But he had some contributing factors ( massive anti-biotics as a babe, chicken pox in months before mmr and crap immune system.
Babt daughetr had no vaccines and is healthy near five year old with NO issues at all ( because yes I have looked very hard).
The missing bit from some reporting often seems to be how well these kids can do if you remove gluten and casein which sits excatly with Wakefields hypothosis. My son went gfcf without me knowing it was linked to MMR gut damage and has improved measureably.

Wakefield did not say that the cause of autism was the MMR. Nor was he saying that all children who are given the MMR will delelop autism. He was simply saying that for a small number of children, the MMR may have been their trigger. He did, in fact, say that he wasn't quite sure of the findings but that he felt the MMR programme should be suspended until more research was done.

MMR is perfectly safe for that vast majority of children. Though as your husband has an autoimmune disease then perhaps you should consider the options for your own peace of mind.

FWIW, DS has a dodgy gut and we gave him singles. DD seems right as rain on that front (though she's not had gluten) and we will probably give her the MMR, though delay it until she's 18mths. Can't swear that when it comes to it, I won't have changed my mind though!

Good luck! Like every other parenting decision, only you can make it and they're never easy.

Can I just ask what you mean by autoimmune disease?

My mum has autoimmune thyroid disease which has lead to hypothyroidism, and though my thyroid levels are fine `I have evidence of antibodies in my bloodstream. Should I be weary of the MMR for my DD?

Autoimmune disease are where you body attacks itself. I think they can either attack a certain part (organ) or all over. Things like rheumatoid arthritis, diabetes, coeliacs, crohn's.
Ther's often a strong genetic link.

dd is 2 now she still hasnt had the mmr, I'm just scared by all this hype. what exactly are bowel problems? for eg dd is very constipated on lactlose now. should mmr not be given then?

Meant to add; I really don't know whether MMR should worry you. You'll find lots of points of view to suggest both courses of action but only you can decide. Good luck.

Bump, if I were you, I'd go for singles, with your family history of auto-immune disease. It seems to be linked to autism and it is possible that MMR somehow triggers autism in susceptible individuals. All this is guesswork to some extent though - there are researchers looking into it but it's not a popular line of research and nothing has been established conclusively yet AFAIK.

Do make sure you get rubella, btw, important for dds (and everyone who can have it, too).

I'm not medically qualified and I could only make a decision for my own son, taking into account his own gut problems.