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Original poster

Muirfield Golf Club votes against women members

23 replies

whattheseithakasmean · 20/05/2016 07:16

Link here Apologies if there is a thread elsewhere and I have missed it, but I am horrified that in 2016 clubs are still allowed to exclude women. Apparently private clubs can set their own rules, but surely that can't extend to breaking the law? We have equalities legislation, how can you be exempt from some pieces of statute? If I murdered someone in the club, I wouldn't be exempt from the law, so how come they can break equalities legislation? I don't get it.

OP posts:

madamginger · 20/05/2016 07:20

Lots of club exclude others, there are women only golf clubs too. The guides exclude boys, the WI exclude men.
I don't agree with their decision but I'm glad they can't hold the open again, but neither can the women only clubs.

peggyundercrackers · 20/05/2016 07:28

I don't really see the problem here, as pp said there are lots of women only clubs. I'm sure there isn't a queue of woman waiting to get into this golf club so not sure it really affects anyone...

I think the idea that we all need to be accepting and all need to buy into the idea that we all need to follow the rules of this pc world is more damaging than a private club regulating its members.

homebythesea · 20/05/2016 07:55

No breaking the law - private clubs exempt

In fact a majority voted to allow women, just not the 2/3 majority required by their rules

They did it in full knowledge they would be banned from holding The Open

Nothing to see here OP!

Original poster

whattheseithakasmean · 20/05/2016 08:35

No breaking the law - private clubs exempt I noted that fact in my OP, what I did was question it - how can a private club be exempt from the law? So you would be cool with a golf club that was no blacks? I suspect racism would suddenly change the picture, but we are just meant to tolerate institutionalised sexism.

And yes, many many female golfers are very unhappy about this, so it is not OK.

OP posts:

homebythesea · 20/05/2016 08:36

How can a private club be exempt from the law? The clue is in the word "private". If you don't like the rules of a club, it's not compulsory to join!

Original poster

whattheseithakasmean · 20/05/2016 08:38

So a 'no blacks' club in the UK in 2016 would be fine with you? You would just accept the KKK, because you don't have to join?

OP posts:

kinkytoes · 20/05/2016 08:38

I see both sides of this but at the end of the day if women only organisations are allowed to exist I can't see why men only ones shouldn't too. I can see benefits to both.

Agree they shouldn't host a major competition though.

situatedknowledge · 20/05/2016 08:39

It is absolutely not ok. I was delighted that the R&A took a stand so quickly. Not hosting the Open will make it a much less attractive club to be a member of. I do wonder why they don't go the way of Troon and have a parallel ladies club?

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 20/05/2016 08:44

I was slightly outraged when I heard this, but agree with kinky I think. If women only clubs exist it should be the same for men.

80sMum · 20/05/2016 08:50

I agree, OP, that if it were "white people only" type of exclusivity then it most definitely wouldn't be allowed!

DrDreReturns · 20/05/2016 08:56

So following that logic the WI should be forced to admit men etc
BTW I think the golf club should admit women, but there is a place for private male / female clubs imo.

homebythesea · 20/05/2016 09:33

The KKK or organisations like it do exist OP. I don't happen to like it but there you go. I do not believe that private groups of any kind should be told how to run their affairs, including with regard to membership.

Golf clubs that require a £10k joining fee exclude the poor. Similarly gyms that have women only swimming hours exclude men. There are numerous examples of gender discrimination in the private arena, and don't get me started on the religious ones. But, as I said, the key here is "private"

ProfessorPreciseaBug · 20/05/2016 10:14

There is an inherent contradiction in the system.. We value freedom of association and describe it as a basic human right... Yet such freedom of association is also the freedom to discriminate... and it can't be any other way..

What is right is that the R&A have decided that Muirfield does not comply with their (also private) rules and have acted to strip Muirfield from the right to hold the Open. So yes, Muirfield can behave like a bunch of pillocks and it will cost them deep in the purse...

In the end the financial damage will show itself and either the pillocks will change their mind, or go pout of business.

homebythesea · 20/05/2016 10:24

Muirfield only gets the Open once a decade or so I believe so actually may not really affect their finances.

situatedknowledge · 20/05/2016 13:09

Most clubs only get it that often. The cache that goes with being on the list is enormous, and a huge financial boost for the whole area. I come from a small town that also occasionally hosts, and the impact on the area is staggering. Not just for the weeks of the Open, but year round from tourism as a direct result. American tourists especially are desperate to say they got round in XYZ.

But it is all going to be OK. Peter Alliss has suggested that women who want to join could just marry a member.
Words Fail Me

cdtaylornats · 20/05/2016 14:07

There are 10 women only golf clubs in Scotland, I hope you will all join me in condemning them for their sexist attitude.

peggyundercrackers · 20/05/2016 14:26

cdtaylornats sorry was that a tumble weed blowing through?

homebythesea · 20/05/2016 16:21

Lol at peggy !

prh47bridge · 20/05/2016 17:56

So a 'no blacks' club in the UK in 2016 would be fine with you

That would be illegal. There is no exemption for associations regarding race. However, any "single characteristic association" (to use the wording in the relevant Act) can restrict membership to people who share a particular characteristic provided the characteristic concerned is not race.

The WI does not have to admit men as members.

Singles clubs do not have to admit couples.

Clubs for the elderly do not have to admit young people.

The Scouts and other youth organisations don't have to admit adults as members.

Clubs for the disabled don't have to admit able bodied people.

Clubs for the LBGT community do not have to admit people who are not part of that community.

And so on.

I think Muirfield's members are being silly. But they are perfectly entitled to take this decision, just as women-only golf clubs are entitled to exclude men from membership.

HouseOfBiscuits · 21/05/2016 11:04

In fact a majority voted to allow women, just not the 2/3 majority required by their rules

I wonder why they've chosen 2/3 as the majority they require. I guess there's nothing stopping them putting a 99 per cent majority as a requirement if they wish!

MorrisZapp · 21/05/2016 11:08

DP is a golfer. He was guffawing at the R&A taking a stand.

They admitted women members in....

2014

prh47bridge · 21/05/2016 11:56

I wonder why they've chosen 2/3 as the majority they require

It is fairly common for an association to require a 2/3 majority for changes to the constitution. I may be wrong but I doubt that requirement was put in place specifically for this vote.

BombadierFritz · 21/05/2016 12:00

It'll be ok as being male is just a feeling these days. Just say you identify as a man and join.

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