The silence is deafening

[saadia]

When will those who provide economic and military support to Israel speak up in the strongest terms and condemn the indiscriminate killing of civilians in Gaza. Obama, Cameron (peace envoy - ha) Blair.

It is an Orwellian nightmare. The 'Israel's right to defend itself ' mantra seems to be justification for wiping out Palestinians.

[Millipedewithherfeetup]

dailycaller.com/2014/07/22/9-things-you-need-to-know-about-hamas-straight-from-its-charter.

please read this.

[dawndonnaagain]

Millipede repetition of previous posts does nothing to strengthen your case.

[silveroldie2]

What Israel is doing is nothing less than genocide, supported by the US, UK and others.

Yes Hamas has fired a few rockets into Israel with very little loss of life. On the other hand Israel bombards Palestine with ballistic missiles, planes, tanks, helicopters, warships, and a wide array of other weapons resulting in the murder of hundreds of men, women and children.

Millipede your posts are so ridiculous they aren't worthy of a serious reply.

[Backinthering]

I have never heard of this Daily Caller that you post links to.
I've certainly heard of Jon Snow, of Channel 4 and of Al Jazeera. They are respected news agencies. I think I'll go with them rather than a random bit of crass propaganda.

[halfdrunkcoffee]

I'm too young to know the details of how exactly the state of Israel was founded

Have you never heard of history books or the web? Most people alive today aren't old enough to remember the 1940s but that doesn't mean they can't educate themselves.

[ElephantsNeverForgive]

Looking up the exact post war founding of Israel has been on my to do list for years, if anyone knows a shortish non biased account.

[dawndonnaagain]

Really Millipede you want us to read something that begins: "To understand Israel’s enemy in Gaza..."
Not biased in any way whatsoever, then.

[dawndonnaagain]

Backinthering It's a conservative online newspaper run by Tucker Carlson, a Jewish, conservative journalist.

[EhricLovesTheBhrothers]

Forgive me but if a group of people came and decided they had the right to create a new state encompassing my home and area, displace me from my home and exert control over my movements, based on the teachings of a 3000 year old text I wouldn't just say 'ok then'
I feel for regular Israelis and I understand why the Israeli people are so committed to the concept of a Jewish state but the execution of it appears to have been a total disaster from start to now and is only getting worse. Tragic.

[wordsmithsforever]

Really, the situation is not very complex at all. Here is an Israeli-Palestinian conflict 101, supplied by Jewish Voice for Peace. Just six minutes - not too difficult for us to understand.

jewishvoiceforpeace.org/content/israeli-palestinian-conflict-101

[wordsmithsforever]

And heartless comments from our politicians expressing support for the Israeli state to continue to "defend" itself when the IDF is killing so many defenceless cowering children makes us all unsafe.

I used to wonder why Muslim extremists were so angry - not any more.

At least now we've seen the images and they can't be unseen. None of us can claim that we didn't know what was going on.

The IDF must be wishing it had taken out the cell phone infrastructure before they started their "defence" against "Hamas".

[Onesleeptillwembley]

Sadly wordsmith I don't think they care who sees what. They've been getting away with it for years, and still are.
It's fucking disgusting.

[wordsmithsforever]

I've reported your earlier post Onesleep - the "Jews" are not in Gaza - the IDF is.

By the way, part 3 of the new thread on Israel/Palestine is here at www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/2143193-Part-3-Israeli-Palestinian-conflict?

My post is the first one of the new thread.

[wordsmithsforever]

Sorry, it's the second one of the new thread.

[timbucktoo]

What would Israels response be if Hamas had caused the same destruction in Jerusalem as there is in Gaza?

[donnie]

Hi Saadia . Here we are again.

Millipede = are you 8 years old? I can't think of any other possible reason for the ignorance and silliness of your posts TBH. My younger dd is 9 and she has a wider and more informed perspective than you.

A few years back, Saadia , myself and a very small handful were having the same discussions and being accused of all kinds. I have to say I am really heartened by the greater awareness on MN {and more widely} of what Israel is doing and has been doing with impunity for so long.

[saadia]

Hi donnie, depressing but not surprising that we are back here, but I would agree that the mood is different now.

Heartbreaking to think of the generations of Palestinians who have never known peace and stability. For me, one of the key differences is that Palestinians have nowhere to go. Many of the people in Israel migrated there, in effect choosing to live in a war zone.

[Poppet1974]

It's so heartening to see that the Israeli apologists are very much in the minority here and elsewhere.

[sooperdooper]

I think the silence among governments is deafening, but the general population are becoming more and more aware of what is really happening, social media is really making a huge impact in people finding out real stories

What keeps annoying me is there seems to be more anger focused at news agencies than there is towards the government!!

[prh47bridge]

a few rockets

So far this month Hamas has launched in excess of 2400 rockets at Israel. Over 1700 of them impacted in Israel. This is, of course, up from the figures prior to the escalation of violence. In June Hamas launched about 53 rockets and a mortar shell.

Perhaps the Hamas apologists on this thread would like to explain why Hamas is continuing to launch rockets whilst Israel is observing a truce. Of course it isn't that simple. And that is the point. The "Israel is evil" narrative on this thread is far too simplistic. A "Hamas is evil" narrative would also be far too simplistic.

Hamas' charter rejects any possibility of a negotiated settlement (Article 13). It claims Jews are planning to take over the world and that Jews were behind a wide range of events and disasters going back to the French Revolution. It justifies killing Jews regardless of where they are in the world and is clear that the goal of Hamas is to obliterate Israel. It does, however, suggest that only "under the wing of Islam" is it possible for Islam, Judaism and Christianity to coexist peacefully.

[saadia]

prh I cannot defend Hamas and I condemn as strongly as is possible all forms of anti-Semitism. I do not like the way that Israel came about but it is a fait accompli. I will say though that Hamas was not created in a vacuum. Both sides will need to talk at some point. IMO it is up to Israel, the original aggressor and the more powerful of the two to start complying with UN resolutions and with international law.

Hamas is what happens when a nation has lost all hope.

[oohdaddypig]

I have lost any optimism that this conflict can ever end.

The decision made post WWII has been catastrophic. Who can blame the Palestinians?

And yet, dare I say it, if you were in Israel's shoes now, would you take some!action? These are people a couple of generations down from the original settlers who are faced with an onslaught of rockets from Hamas.

But no one could possibly agree with what Israel is currently doing - I doubt many Israelis do either. I absolutely agree that governments need to take a stand.

But it feels utterly hopeless right now and it's always the innocents that take the brunt.

[oohdaddypig]

Stupid phone - there is not meant to be any utterly inappropriate exclamation mark in my post FFS