MMR (Sorry I know this is a repetitive topic!)

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I have looked into the positives and negatives of MMR, and I know there is no "medical" knowledge of it causing autism and allergies, but along with the large amount of online cases, I know three seperate people know have said it has been a trigger for their child going from ok, to suddenly worsening with an existing condition, or developing a new condition. (One a kidney issue and long list of allergies, one just autism and one autism and allergies)
All three occured within weeks of MMR, and I know logically that it could be coincidence, but theres a part of me saying what if.

DD is due to have her MMR (now basically) but we are already postponing it until her being the correct "due date" age.
I am just wondering if anywhere has unbiased information, everywhere I've looked into seems to either say it is dangerous and shouldn't be given, or there is absolutely no risks.
Is there a "helpline" to phone that would have advice?

And also what are the options about having her vaccinated at a slightly older age?
If I waited until she was 3-5 would she only need 1 lot of MMR instead of the 2?

I am going from the back -

age does not influence reaction to MMR. So you should do two MMRs independently of which age you give the first.

You can start the MMR any time you want after age 11 months. The risk is that until you give it, your child is unprotected against M, M and R. I would want to give the last shot before puberty, because the risk of joint pain from the rubella component go up for girls after puberty.

I am not sure there is a hotline. The NHS has this page, all about the MMR www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vaccinations/Pages/mmr-vaccine.aspx

As for the anecdotes - that is just what they are. My husband suddenly spiked a 40 degree fever starting only about 5 hours after a cancelled flu shot appointment. This was the first time he ran a fever that high in 20 years and it came absolutely out of the blue. It went on for 3 or 4 nights and he had the flu shot the week after with no problems whatsoever. Now, I am obviously pro-vaccination, but nothing would have kept me from believing this was an adverse reaction. The human brain is wired to detect coincidences and interpret them as causal whether they are related or not.

And of course there are adverse effects of MMR. Many children get a fever (not as many as with the real diseases, but many - about 1 in 8000 will get a febrile seizure from MMR), many will get a rash, some will get diarrhoea. In very rare incidences (about 1 in 1 million shots or less) a child may get encephalitis (that is a 1000x lower risk than with the measles). Allergies are not caused (or triggered) by MMR, autism is not caused by MMR, kidney issues are not caused by MMR.

Have a read of the NHS site and maybe talk to your nurse? Good luck with the decision.

The "establishment view" (which I agree with - both my children had MMR - both fine):

HPA on why they say MMR is safe

2012 survey on why the mainstream consensus is that the idea of an MMR / autism link is not supported by the facts

You will find it difficult to get any source accepted by both sides - they have such different preconceptions they don't interpret facts the same way.

I think the best advice I can give is to take the views of anyone alleging bad faith on the part of others with a truckload of salt. It's perfectly possible to be either sceptical of vaccines or very pro vaccines without implying the other side are somehow knowingly complicit in the deaths or suffering of children.

I will duck back behind the parapet now

PS agree with Catherina especially on pattern spotting. My PFB was repeatedly sick immediately after her first MMR. "Argh vaccine reaction" I thought.

Then I was repeatedly sick. As was DP. Because it was gastric flu & not a vaccine reaction.

But for an hour until I started puking I was all ready to report the reaction (as anyone should report suspected vaccine reactions)

I also know three people (one is a friend of my sister's, whom I haven't met) whose children had adverse reactions to MMR which triggered (in their parents' opinion) loss of speech and autism. It is hard to ignore anecdotes like this when you know the people involved.

I delayed our third child's immunisations because of this, as people do not develop autism after about 30 months. She was much healthier than her brothers, though this is probably a coincidence.

She is now fully immunised. As far as I can remember, there was one booster she didn't need because of her age.

The MMR is not infallible - nothing in medicine is, but it's a much better bet than not being vaccinated. Lot's of people report events related to visiting the doctor and attribute it to the doctor, but it's coincidence. If you want a statistical look at vaccinations look at Ben Goldacre. He's looks at the actual stats and data. He has no sympathy for a lot of what goes on in medicine, but he supports vaccination unequivocally.

For what it's worth, if MMR were as dangerous as the anti vaccine campaigners believed, there would be MILLIONS of severely autistic children with bowel problems. As it is, old fashioned diseases are being sidelined and autism rates have not shot up.

Actually autism has shot up in recent years, whether thats due to better diagnosing or a genuine increase is still under debate.

Op if your worried I would advise having the single jabs spaced out as opposed to not having any protection.

Current scientific consensus is that (1) there does seem to be a genuine increase in autism (2) it does appear that environmental factors could be a player (3) numerous studies have indicated that vaccines are not the driver here.

See my earlier link for the vaccine studies and here for a more general take on
Autism and environmental factors