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Original poster

Starting to have MMR doubts and panicking

179 replies

SneezingwakestheJesus · 28/03/2013 19:20

I had finally decided to give my dd the MMR and she has her appointment next week. But now I'm having doubts again and panicking. Her uncle has autism and his mum is utterly convinced it happened after the MMR. I know that study was a fake/discredited etc but I'm finding it hard to see past her, and other parents online, strong belief that the signs of autism appeared overnight in their children. And those recent court cases where parents were given compensation on the basis that the vaccines their children had may be linked to their condition worry me too.

What if some autism is caused by the vaccine in some way? What if there is a genetic predisposition to having autism and all it needs is a trigger? What if my dd has a genetic predisposition from that side of the family?

I know I sound paranoid but I'm really struggling with this. On one hand I could give her a vaccination that will protect her from diseases but isn't guaranteed not to harm her. On the other, I don't give her the vaccination but she may catch one of these diseases and may be ever worse off than if the vaccine did harm her. I'm so torn and muddled about it.

I just don't know what to do and I don't know what I expect from posting here but I can't talk to my family about it.

OP posts:
PhyllisDoris · 28/03/2013 19:27

Google what severe cases of each disease look like, and what the effects are on the people who have the disease.
The 3 diseases are making a comeback because people are not getting their kids vaccinated - big problem in Wales atm.
You really don't want your kids to get any of those illnesses.

KatOD · 28/03/2013 19:49

I can understand your concern, and of course it's for you to do what you're happy with.

To my mind the autism/MMR "research" was completely discredited as statistical scaremongering, so the choice is (a) get your child vaccinated and provide some scientifically proven protection to both your child and others they come into contact with or (b) don't vaccinate them and offer afore mentioned proven protection because of a worry about a completely unproven side effect.

issypiggle · 28/03/2013 19:53

i totally see here you're coming from my cousin is autistic and my aunt was adamant that it happened because of the the mmr.

i've decided that the risk of dd getting something is to too high not to take her.
in the long run i know a lot of people who are fine.

so dd is off for mmr 2 next week.

BettyBlues · 28/03/2013 19:57

www.wddty.com/keep-it-from-the-parents-what-the-government-doesn-t-tell-you-about-vaccinations.html

Your thinking is right. Vaccinations aren't safe for everyone.

Vaccinations are especially dangerous if your child has any kind of gut or digestive problems.

As well as constipation, diahreeah, bloating and excess wind look out for purple rings under eyes and hyper mobile joints.

yousankmybattleship · 28/03/2013 20:06

Just because one thing happens after another doesn't necessarily show cause and effect. Your Uncle may have started showing signs of autism after having the vaccination but that doesn't mean it caused it. Autism is often first diagnosed at about the same time that the vaccinations are given, but that is no reason to link the two. The research which did suggest a link has been widely discredited. I'd take excess wind over severe measles any day!

Shakey1500 · 28/03/2013 20:09

Massive problem with a measles outbreak in S. Wales at present as a pp mentioned. Better safe than sorry I say.

An ex friend refused to have her DS vaccinated. But that was more to do with her utterly bizarre conspiracy theories that there was a "control drug" in the vaccinations, as instructed by the government and a massive cover up Hmm Confused Hence the term "ex friend"

thehairybabysmum · 28/03/2013 20:26

There is a decision aid here aid
Which might help?

I think what the first poster says...google the effects of the three diseases.

Original poster
SneezingwakestheJesus · 28/03/2013 20:43

I've googled the effects before (just done it again now) and even though I can see the terrible side effects that could happen, I still can't decide. This is so horrible :( I know on one hand that I should do it to protect her but on the other I am so scared of her regressing and autism being triggered. Its hard because with the diseases she could get lucky and just be a bit poorly or she could go completely the other way. If it was the choice between triggering autism and death, the answer would be simple. Its just so hard to accept what science says when people are adamant their child changed overnight. And why do people get compensation for autism as a result of vaccines if it doesn't happen? How do I shake that worry?

OP posts:
sashh · 29/03/2013 06:00

If MMR cause or triggered autism then the number of autistic people in the world would go up.

Japan got rid of the MMR and their rates of autism stayed the same.

Diagnosis of autism is on the increase, but that is due to better detection. Eg I have a lot of Aspergers traits. I do not have a diagnosis but I could probably get one. I'm too old to have had MMR.

Yes your dc could get one of the diseases, and it could be mild. But it might not be.

And for me the clincher is that there is no cure for the diseases we vaccinate against. Treatment can be given but in the end it is your child fighting a disease on their own.

There is a poster on here who has two children with autism. One she 'lost' completely overnight. She says herself if it had been the day after MMR she would blame that, but it wasn't.

As for things happening just after an event well

How many of those children whose parents claim it was MMR that triggered their autism had

Been fed milk as babies
Had worn nappies
Had been given breakfast that day
Had traveled in a car
Eaten a banana

Yet the parents never think of anything else as baing a 'trigger'.

AndMiffyWentToSleep · 29/03/2013 06:06

The research linking MMR was fraud - it has been completely discredited. There is no link between autism and MMR.
The MMR researcher was being paid by those hoping to make money from selling three separate vaccines. You can read about it in the British Medical Journal.

PhyllisDoris · 29/03/2013 10:21

I strongly urge you to have your child vaccinated OP, even if you pay to have the the 3 vaccines separately.

specialsubject · 30/03/2013 19:59

please, please ignore the anti-vaccination conspiracy theory nonsense. Please listen to people such as sashh and AndMiffywenttosleep.

please get it done.

Original poster
SneezingwakestheJesus · 30/03/2013 20:27

I know it was fraud but its hard to see past the people who believe their child changed overnight when they had it done. I can understand it just being coincidence as that's when signs of autism may start to show but its down to the week or night after the MMR for some children that show massive regression and its hard to ignore that. And I can't understand why the courts have awarded compensation if it doesn't happen. Or why there are funds for vaccine damaged children. I'm so muddled :(

OP posts:
NaturalBlondeYeahRight · 30/03/2013 20:32

Every doctor I know (4) has vaccinated their child with the combined jab. That's good enough for me.

TreeLuLa · 30/03/2013 20:33

Sneezing.

The car ride to the Doctor's surgery to get the vaccination is more likely to kill or injure your child than the vaccination itself.

It's up to you, but I know that the evidence for preventing potential harm to your child weight heavily in favour of vaccination.

Welovegrapes · 30/03/2013 20:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

hermioneweasley · 30/03/2013 20:37

The "doctor" who led this incredibly small"study" has been completely discredited and has been struck off for his part in anti MMR hysteria.

Get your child vaccinated and fall to your knees in gratitude that you live in a country where not only is it encouraged and available, but it's free.

Original poster
SneezingwakestheJesus · 30/03/2013 20:38

We'll be walking treelula but I understand the point you are making.

I just feel stuck between two potentially crap outcomes. If she does react to it, she could regress like her uncle did (according to his mum who strongly believes it happened overnight) or she might be fine. If she doesn't have it, she could catch the diseases and be damaged or die, or she might be fine. But she might never catch the disease in the first place. This is the hardest decision I've had to make in my life. If I hadnt met people who believed that it had changed their child and if her uncle wasn't autistic, I wouldn't question it but I have and he is, so I do.

Its hard knowing that either way if anything bad happens, its my fault.

OP posts:
FrustratedSycamoresRocks · 30/03/2013 20:44

My dd is autistic. She was showing autistic tendencies long before she had the MMR vaccine.
But even with an autistic dd, I'd take the chance with my next DC because the alternatives (like a severe case of measles and some of the possible consequences of that) are worse.

Tabitha8 · 31/03/2013 19:01

So many people keep saying that Andrew Wakefield was proved wrong or that he was a fraud, or whatever. Are those allegations against him actually true?

sashh · 01/04/2013 07:44

Or why there are funds for vaccine damaged children

This was set up in the 1960s when there was a higher chance of a vaccine causing brain damage. Interestingly it was the measles vaccine, the single shot some people who oppose MMR give tot their children.

No one has been given compensation for MMR damage. There was a case in Italy which was reported as MMR damage when in fact it was a very complicated case with a child with complex disabilities and where it could not be proved that MMR had no part in the child's health worsening.

This was in a civil case, not a criminal one where the burden of proof is higher.

Are those allegations against him actually true?

Yes, He has been struck off the medical register for gross misconduct.

Welovegrapes · 01/04/2013 07:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheFallenNinja · 01/04/2013 07:56

I implore you not to make a connection between a compensation payout and medical fact, particularly one reported in the daily mail.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield has all the references

DuttyWine · 01/04/2013 07:59

I second the poster who pointed out how lucky we are to have free vaccinations . Dp's cousin has autism his mum doesn't think it was caused by mmr... My aunt is deaf, definitely caused by childhood mumps.

aufaniae · 01/04/2013 08:09

Yes it's rubbish that you have to choose between two possibilities, both of which seem to have risk attached. But that's the way life is unfortunately. no intervention is 100% safe.

However, the risk of catching measles mumps or rubella is much higher than the risk of any vaccine damage.

The link between measles and death is proven and real.
The link between mumps and deafness, for example, is proven and real.
The link between rubella and birth defects, for example, is proven and real.

The link with autism is at best unproven, and at worst irresponsible scaremongering perpetuated as it sells papers/advertising space.

Vaccinating your DCs is less risky course of action to taken than not vaccinating.

The MMR saves lives. It's a no-brainer.