Daughter unable to progress to Level 3 after GCSE resits

[ThisTealWarrior]

Hi all, my daughter has successfully completed Level 1 and 2 of a vocational course. The sticking point are her GCSEs. Third attempt, got the results yesterday and has again received a 1 and a 2.
Her tutor has contacted her yesterday and said that due to these results she cannot move onto the Level 3 which she hoped to do.
DD is saying that it was never made explicit to her that she couldn’t progress without the GCSE passes. I had parents evening back in April and the tutor said she thought it would be a good idea to move onto Level 3. No mention of this being under the condition of a 4 in either/or both Maths and English. DD is saying that the tutor had implied that she could still move onto and just retake the GCSEs again. I emailed her today and she said her DD to come in on Monday to look at another course, presumably another Lever 2.

My DD feels blindsided as never expected to not be allowed to move on. She is much more practical than academic and is very upset. Do we just accept this or has the tutor been negligent in her communication so there are grounds for a complaint.

just thought I would get some thoughts on this? Thanks all

Has she been offered Functional Skills as an alternative? The exams can be sat during the year rather than just November or June and tend to be more practically orientated tests.

No she hasn’t, they are saying GCSEs or nothing.

If she didn't think she needed GCSE why was she taking them?

Sorry, I only know about English, it's tough alright.

Just sit them again?
How many times does she expect to sit them? It comes to a point that if you don’t have the grades you don’t move forward. Sadly a pass in English and Maths is pretty much a gateway to future life nowadays.

Yes I get that, but what happens to the young people who are repeatedly unsuccessful. Are they just supposed to get an unskilled job or no job at all and that’s it?
Seems unfair when they are doing well in a vocational course.

The government say that they have to take them.

I work in a college. Was the tutor aware that your daughter only had a 1 or 2 in maths and English? Was she doing maths and English last year and were her predicted grades that low?

All our level 3 courses, as diverse as Animal Management or Dance would need GCSE 4s in English and maths to progress. Honestly, by level 3 even mainly practical subjects will likely have a written theory element to them which your daughter would really struggle with if she is only working at a 1 or 2 in English.

However, I would totally have expected her tutors to have been directing her to lower level courses, maybe side stepping to the same level in a related subject, instead of progressing to the next level of her main course. It is bad if they have been setting her up progress without knowing her likely English and maths grades.

I would also definately be expecting an offer of functional skills for grades as low as this - level one, which would help build key skills for a year before attempting GCSE again.

I know of people who kept resitting and never achieving them. My daughter has SEND and achieved a 1 in English and u in maths. She is at college and I always stated there is no point in resitting as too much of a jump to get to a pass. I would insist on functional skills which are equivalent. My daughter has done the functional skills 2 in English and is able to move onto FS3. Maths will take her longer but they are equivalent to GCSEs and employers will accept them.

I’m not sure what the communication is like between the English and maths departments and the tutor. She actually did get a 3 in English when she sat the exam at school but has got a 2 on a resit.. The 1 is in maths and that is consistent. She has improved though as she got a U at school.

Did you not Google the entry requirements for the Level 3? Considering they are supposed to be an A level equivalent, I think it’s fairly obvious that if you can’t pass GCSE maths and English you won’t be able to progress onto the level 3.
At post 16 I’d also expect students to research the requirements themselves.

Did she previously get a grade 3 in Maths and English? If she did funding dictates that a student has to re-take GCSE rather than move over to FS (there are exceptions). For those caught in the constant GCSE re-take cycle, Functional Skills is the best option (for English at least). If the college do FS (not all colleges do) ask her tutor why she wasn’t offered FS previously. It’s at the college’s discretion as to whether they take her on the L3, it isn’t a funding requirement to have E&M grade 4 only to be taking them alongside. Is it a course with lots of written work or very little?

The tutors should be checking these grades as a matter of course before recommending progressions. I think you could definately complain that this wasn't done. However, she won't be able to go on to a level 3 course with those grades at all. There's no point complaining about that because the entry requirements are clear. Also to be fair, they are about the level of writing expected on the course. If she is getting a 2/3 at GCSE English, she would likely completely drown in the written element of a level 3 course and fail the course.

Admittedly a few years ago but my DD did level 3 btec in Business. She got a grade 3 in English gcse and 2 in maths. She was bright but dyslexic. She started on the level 2 btec, but they moved her up after a few weeks. She eventually got level 2 in functional skills, which wasn't quite a gcse level but good enough.
I think you need to really go and advocate for her and look at other colleges as well.

Thank you that is all really good advice. It certainly wasn’t made clear to my dd or myself that there was going to be an issue with her proceeding. Good attendance and good practical skills within the course she was taking and no indication along the way that she couldn’t progress. I went into the college 3 or 4 times at the end of the year and at no point did any of the staff raise an issue with me.
I have already emailed the tutor raising my concerns and asked how we appeal the decision and make a complaint.
It looks like you have edited your post so my response doesn’t make a lot of sense!

If your DD only got a level 2 in English I think she would be swamped by the amount of written work on a BTEC level 3 course. My DS did BTEC level 3 in Sport which was equivalent to 3 x A levels and there was huge amounts of written work assignments. He was set 2 or even 3 assignments at once too. At level 3 less is practical and more is theory.

Sorry I edited my post and took too much out! Many students complete a L3 Extended BTEC without ever attaining the magical 4 at GCSE in E&M, especially in art based subjects. If she wants to go to uni (and it’s an art based subject) they will often ask for a 4 (or equivalent ie L2 FS) in either E or M. Alternatively, if they really won’t back down on the L3 she could do another L2 and FS. If they won’t let her do FS (I’ve seen now that she got a 3 previously in E) you can enter her privately for L2. There are lots of free resources online (I find Edexcel is clearer for English). The college have dropped the ball in terms of realistic progression for your DD and I really would fight (if you, DD and her tutor) think she can keep up with the written work). Also, a grade 1 or 2 at GCSE English isn’t always an indication of a ‘level’ of English. Lots of students find accessing the paper difficult and havn’t been taught how to hit the assessment criteria. If you add in dyslexia it’s even harder, unless you’ve been taught how to hit the assessment markers where your strengths lie.

A grade 4 in English and maths is a standard entry requirement for a level 3 courses. This should be on all information, college website etc. Colleges do not get funding for 16-19 year olds doing FS - this is standard in England and is why many colleges do not offer FS.
A small amount of googling would have provided this information. A grade 1 in GCSE is a significantly low grade. I would be recommending looking for employment as moving to a 4 after several attempts is unlikely.

What? Where are you teaching, if you are teaching. Students shouldn’t access a L3 course without English and maths at grade 4. Not many unis will accept FS and if you can’t get a 4 in E or M then, to be honest, you should not be at university.
Depending on age if she has completed a L2 course there will be no funding for another L2 course.

OP make a careers appointment and speak to someone who knows the colleges in your area and the local job market. Some of the advice on here is mad.

With a Level 3 in the course she would then be able to go into employment in the chosen field. Most job adverts we have looked at say Level 3 required, very few say Level 2.
We will discuss with the tutor on Monday. I’m not sure what the response will be. I suggest from the email she sent know earlier it will be a no and look at something else. Seems a shame to have to do a completely different thing at L2 which is what is being suggested.

One of the other reasons grade 4 in maths & eng lang is a requirement for level3 is timetabling.

Totally agree with others re FS English - DD took a year out (complicated reasons and has ehcp) and did it privately. Once back at college when we had the proof she had passed she was allowed to drop English. The FS is far more accessible.

However also agree re written requirement for level3 being quite high, with need to create well structured reasoned writing.

Also agreed you have been failed by all of this not being clear.

If she has a 3 in English she can pass it even if she dropped to a two this time. She may be doing a different board and might not have had great teaching in college - but a given.

I would get a tutor, make sure she is with the best Eng teacher at the college and make sure she is getting and using every helpful access arrangement she is entitled to. If she hasn’t been assessed that is the first thing to get sorted.

They can admit her onto L3 at their digression - the maths won’t happen but the English could and I would press them hard to allow her to work on it while she gains her English.

Functional skills and another level two will do but they are less useful.

Has she been in college for 2 years now?

What course is it? Is she ready for work? Or an apprenticeship?

I would be very surprised if she wasn’t told about entry criteria for L3.

Yes college for 2 years. Course is beauty therapy. Apprenticeships require GCSEs!
She has a weekend job in a cafe.

I am waiting for the tutor to confirm whether she has told her of the entry requirements. According to my dd it was said to her that it would be good if she could pass but not required as she had passed her beauty course.

Level 3 qualifications are difficult, even if they seem like an “easy” subject like beauty therapy. Does she have any identified additional needs- dyslexia/dyscalculia? It’s not to say she isn’t bright but if she struggles with written/theory type work and has identified learning needs, there is help and reasonable adjustments available.

Can she do functional skills maths and English instead of GCSE? They are the the equivalent quals but often are more accessible and straight forward than GCSEs.

Nothing diagnosed but definitely some learning needs. She was given extra time in exams as assessed to need it. The maths teacher said it was she was speaking a different language to her so suspect dyscalculia.
I’m not sure if FS are offered at her college.