Lucy Powell - Oracy

[mids2019]

The education Secretary wishes to put more emphasis on piracy as well as the written language. While I think superficially it's a great idea I do wonder that if we start marking spoken language in a significant way we would bias against the working class and those with English as a second language? I love in a deprived town and there is a distinct dialect including phrases and mannerisms which reflect the locality but I am sure would not constitute 'food's spoken language.

Is this a postiv e step or an attempt to get working class kids to talk like middle class kids?

Oracy

I don’t believe in the class system. The definitions are so vague and inconsistent it’s become pointless. Spelling and grammar is important but speak how you wish to speak.

So how does the concept of oracy work and what is Lucy advocafing. I think she is suggesting private school children benefit from better communication so skills through increased opportunities to display them but I am not sure about this aegument.

Oracy is a great skill.

As is adapting your speech to the audience/situation. We all do it subconsciously.

For instance, most of us don't speak in the same way during a job interview as with our mates down the pub in our hometown.

Oracy in this case would be a school subject, a learned discipline. To apply practically when needed. I don't see why it would stop people from talking in their usual dialect or register when in their own environment.

It's a bit like saying that writing with correct grammar and syntax is somehow bad for pupils.

I love the idea of piracy lessons
Will it be a parrot for every kid and the phonics system is to be slimmed down to 2 phonemes - "ah" and 'aye aye'?
Seriously, we've bern here before with phonics and it was taken out of English GCSE because it was used to boost marks for kids whose writing was not good enough to pass.
In primaries oracy is and always has been a big thing!

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You’re conflating two different things. Policing of slang and regional dialect ALREADY happens in schools to an extent, though there’s increasing research and understanding of the damages of this.

Oracy (an area I’ve taught in for years) really isn’t about elocution, it’s about self expression, empowerment and creativity. It also encompasses listening, something heartily needed to develop critical thinking, empathy and collaboration for young people.

I am very much in favour of this - oracy is an essential life skill, and I almost can’t believe it’s taken until now for it to be taken seriously as part of the state school curriculum. Most employers, in whatever industry, want young people who can explain themselves, present well and can handle a difficult conversation. Oracy - taught well - isn’t just about how you speak, it’s about listening deeply, thinking on your feet and adapting your communication skills to different circumstances. And in the age of A.I, I think all of those skills are going to become even more important: we’re not that far off A.I being able to produce a passable essay in seconds, but A.I won’t be able to talk and listen for us.

This.

Regional slang and accents won’t be a disadvantage.

It’s about landing your point in an eloquent and accurate way, however that’s done and in whatever dialect.

Young people are increasingly struggling with basic interactions. Holding eye contact, conversational skills, not mumbling in an anxious manner and giving one word answers while looking at their hands.

OP oracy isn’t the same as elocution you know…

Yes agreed. Doesn't that make the concept of oracy somewhat subjective in that eloquence is something of a personal judgement. Can you be a good communicator without eloquence is a good question (Donald Trump?) and I would argue many associate communication in general with eloquence rightly or wrongly.

is Lucy picking up the fact middle class children in private schools are often eloquent because of parental/power influence and has reached the conclusion that only if working class kids spoke/debates in the same manner there would be an increase in social mobility?

Some may say this a bash at autistic children? I am not saying you don't have a point but there will be parents of children with social anxiety that perhaps don't want beaten with the stick of poor oracy.

Kids already do a speaking assessment at GCSE (although it doesn’t count towards their grade).

One wonders what Powell will remove from the curriculum to make way for more talking. The curriculum review has been delayed.

Ok so how do we help these kids live the independent and fulfilling life they’re entitled to? Because all these ‘baby steps’, allowing them to crash out of society and lowering the expectations to rock bottom doesn’t seem to be helping? Plenty of ND people are actually really eloquent BTW

OK there are no easy solutions here but some people are poor at communication because of SEX and maybe that has to acknowledged.

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But if the grading frame work is clear and rigorous, then surely oracy is only as subjective as - for example - essay writing. I don't think this is about getting working class kids to speak more like middle class kids at all, it is about giving them the tools to learn how to express themselves in their own way. Most private schools have a strong culture of oracy, most have debating societies and frequent opportunities to speak publicly. If an oracy curriculum is delivered well in state school, then all kids will get those same opportunities - that doesn't mean them being taught to sound like private school kids, it means them getting the same opportunities to hone thier own voices.

I think this is an interesting point but equally there are neurodiverse kids for whom written communication is extremely challenging. That doesn't mean we don't include those skills in the curriculum: it means we need to teach those skills in a way that is adaptable and inclusive. The same will surely be true of oracy.

Many children start school with poor levels of speech and communication.

speech can be unclear, many struggle to communicate effectively. Lots of primary schools do a lot of work on helping young children develop their speech and their communication more generally and I think it’s good that this is being recognised.

at the older end of the education system lots of teens are incredibly uncomfortable holding a conversation with an adult (such as expected by any customer facing role, or in a job interview) or doing presentations. Anything that helps with that has to be a good thing.

too much of older schooling is sit down and work in silence which may develop academic skills but does nothing for the social skills kids need in work.

I would take a punt that ND people are probably on average a little bit more eloquent and interesting in general speech than NT, but it’s unlocking that and decreasing the anxiety via exposure. Baby steps just doesn’t seem to work, hence the millions of threads about anxious teens in their bedrooms who won’t even converse with their parent aside from pushing notes under the door.

Oracy is a fantastic skill. I have no issues with this. I think it is vitally important and will give pupils confidence in social situations and in the workplace! Not sure why people are always so scared of an education system that wants to improve people’s lives and life skills! As @MidLifeMeh01has said, oracy covers so much and as an adult I know a few people my own age who could do with learning these skills!

Okay, that's a new possibility- do you mean, female students used to feeling forced to stay silent in class by their pushier male classmates, who wouldn't be able to break out of this if faced with a male assessor? Or those poor lads who can't ever seem to find the right words and stay schtumm so as not to get laughed at by the girls, who wouldn't be able to demonstrate their true ability given a female one?

Unfair to EAL and ND I did immediately imagine would be the clamour against the proposed changes, but actually not this.

(I did sort of assume that it was a typo for SEN, though...?).

Oh god typo. That was meant to be SEND.......woops. Can MN remove the post or can I edit it?

Others have replied to your main point and I agree broadly (oracy != elocution).

What I've been thinking for some time is that I would like pupils to be able to choose drama instead of English lit at GCSE. Currently, most schools make English literature compulsory (because of Progress 8) so drama is only an option subject competing with many other options. In my opinion, drama teaches many of the same skills as English literature + additional, more important skills and would probably be more useful to more pupils than English literature. I would like to see the definition of Progress 8 change to reflect this, so that pupils can keep their current number of options but can choose drama on top of it (if they want to).

From experience, I think teaching oracy as an integral part of the wider curriculum can really help with selective mutism. Having rules to follow, demonstrations of what good looks like, a chance to practice in safe space, lots of low stakes opportunities so if one is missed due to anxiety it’s not a big deal etc has been very helpful.

These are the sorts of baby steps that work, and this plus medication and therapy and lots of family support have got dd to the point where she can usually manage to speak to strangers in shops and quite often put her hand up in class and get some words out. With another year or so I think she’ll manage a presentation to a small class on her favourite topic. Hopefully in a few years she’ll manage a job interview - that’s what I want for her, by the time she’s 18.