A bright child will do well anywhere

[User3542564]

I keep reading on threads that a bright child will do well anywhere. I'm just curious as to whether people honestly believe that about all schools? My DC are still in primary, but our nearest secondary has an English and Maths pass rate of 5% and a Progress 8 of -0.98. I cannot see how a bright child could do as well there as they would in a school with just average results. Am I missing something? It's been made into an academy, several changes of SLT over the last decade and just gets worse.

Or when people say a bright child will do well anywhere, do they actually mean will do well in any nice middle class school with above average results?

A bright child will likely cope better anywhere and may still get "good" grades, but definitely won't achieve their full potential in a poor quality school.

Depends on what friends group they end up in that has the biggest impact.
Otherwise yes, well driven children with high aspirations will do well anywhere if they are provided with resources and support at home.

It's also worth considering why the grades are low (demographic of the school meaning lots of behavioural issues/disruption, or poor quality teaching or high teacher turnover) and the impact that would have on any child's school experience.

I believe that they will do well - but perhaps not achieve their true potential.

Bright children need to thrive in order to perform optimally and good teaching. Just like all other children.

A bright and motivated child will do well anywhere. The risk at a low performing school is a bright child can be a big fish in a small pond and not need to do much to stay at the top, so motivation can drop off.

A bright child could also get bullied to the point of being suicidal. It depends on the teachers, the HT and the other kids.

5% pass rate? That seems astonishingly bad.

No, I do not think a bright child will do "well" there. They will not have the peers around them to support learning etc.

I disagree with this.
A bright child may do OK in any environment but if they are in classes with disruptive kids and teachers spend most of the lesson managing behaviour then that bright child may not reach their full potential.
Cohorts of peers should not be underestimated. If their peers don't value education then this will end up rubbing off.

I think this is one of those comforting sayings that is probably true for a small number of kids - but there's no way of knowing if it's true.
My bright kid would not have done well at a tough school.

I dont believe this. I dont think it matters how bright you are if your learning is constantly disrupted and you have a string of nom specialist teachers. It's also of little use if you are bright but have other hurdles like sen or poverty to feal with. It might mean you do better than others in you school, but not compared to bright chikdren who have teachers and lessons.

But the thing that irritates me most about this phrase is most chikdren are not bright. Most are average and many are below average. They still matter. What use is it to me if bright chikdren are fine anywhere, when my chikd has learning difficulties.

DS is bright but a bit more open to peer pressure than I would like and can be lazy, he will only get the GCSE's he is capable of because of the school he is at.
DD is bright but anxious with social anxiety and a fear of large and noisy groups, she only did as well as she did because of the school she went to

So no, I don't agree with that premise

I attended an inner city secondary school and was top of my class with zero effort for two years. Moved to a suburb school in year three, and suddenly had to work really hard to be in the top 3 in any class.

If I had remained at the original school I’m sure Uni would have been a massive shock. It was difficult enough adjusting to the higher standard in the good school.

They'll cope, but they'll likely not 'do well' - for example at my old school, everyone got put in for the middle maths exam paper, meaning that not a single A was earned, as it was impossible on that particular paper to get one.

Ds in a good secondary school and very bright got 13 GCSEs at A*. No school sixth form so went to local college and it all went pear shaped. Lower expectations from college and a less academic way. He contributed to his issues without doubt as did we as we were used to him being encouraged to do well. He got there in the end.

It’s nonsense that just gets trotted out. Being “bright” is only a part of the story of achieving success. Being happy, confident, and motivated are just as important. If those needs aren’t being met then it’s very unlikely a child is going to achieve their potential. Some schools can kill the motivation and confidence of some kids.

At a school with serious behaviour problems, where the teachers spend most of their time on crowd control, I think a bright child is unlikely to reach their full potential. The exception might be if they are very motivated and good at self-directed learning.

My youngest is exceptionally bright, he's also dyslexic and has ADHD. With the right support he hopefully will be able to demonstrate his knowledge on paper, without it he'd be lucky to get his name on exam papers before zoning out.

There is much evidence to suggest that this is not true (look at research regarding minority and disadvantaged groups). And I suspect that not everyone that repeats the mantra believes what they say. A child needs to be nurtured for his or her true potential to be realised. If a school fails to do this it doesn’t matter whether a child has natural abilities it is unlikely to be reflected in academic attainment. That’s why a parent should trust their instincts (despite what others may say – particularly on public forums) and push to get their child into the best school possible, or fill in the gaps that the school leaves. The children that tend to do better are those that are within quality educational establishments and in homes where education is valued and actively pursed.

My very bright DC went to a non-academic school, he got a mixed bag of GCSEs from 5 to 9, I have no doubt that he would have got all 9s in an academic school. So he did 'well' compared to most children, but quite a bit off what he could have achieved. Basically he switched off and coasted. I don't think not having a string of 9s is going to make any big difference in his life, but he was quite bored and frustrated at times.

no i dont agree. I have two 'gifted and talented' DD's and without the motivation and support from their school, i know they would have been average, because they had no one to push them.

i also noticed in the school they went too, because they were 'bright' they got lots of support and were almost bullied by the school itself to provide great reulsts, but their friends who were less gifted were pretty much left to their own devices. ALL children should receive the same support, not just the ones who can make the school look good.

Being bright is only part of the story. I think it's kind of in thirds.

1/3 being bright

1/3 access to 'good' schools

1/3 home environment focused on learning/development, extra curriculars, lots of cultural activities

i agree.

Pass rate of 5%?
Do you actually mean '5% get both english and maths at grade5+'? (Which is still pretty low).
What are the figures for previous high attainers?

Absolute bullshit. I was a straight A* pupil leaving primary school. After five years in a crap comp, I left (escaped) without a single GCE/CSE. That was because of bullying, both verbal and physical, constantly, which the teachers completely ignored and victim-blamed me. I basically went down a grade each year until I crashed out. I was constantly withdrawn and disengaged in lessons because I'd be worried about how I'd be bullied at the next break, or worried what the bullies would be doing behind the teacher's back during the lesson. After a few year, I started to truant. I also started to hide during breaks and lunchtimes. I became suicidal.

So, no, a bright kid won't do well anywhere - if the school and teachers are crap, you've not a hope in hell!

After leaving I got my O and A levels from a mix of self study and evening classes, I then went onto professional qualifications, became a chartered accountant and also now have a masters degree! Amazing how well I recovered once I'd left that hell hole!