Does Ofsted reports really reflect how 'good' a school is?

[Fuppy]

I'm curious of your experience. I know teachers who prepare especially for ofsted, so when a school gets an 'outstanding' report, how does this compare with normal day to day school life and does it accurately reflect a schools worth?

I've been through a number of Ofsteds whilst working in a school office and in my experience 100% no. In one school all staff stayed still roughly 9pm the night before and the school was full of staff by 6am the next day. They scraped a good pass. That was the most extreme one I witnessed and imo they were an otherwise great school that I would've been happy to send my child to. Their results just weren't great due to their intake and the head was scared.
Others were in outstanding schools and those schools were in my experience always in Ofsted mode so there was less running around on the day but it wasn't a pleasant place to work or learn on a day to day basis as the head was obsessed with keeping her outstanding. It was still v stressful on the day, often with mass marking and display boards getting changed.
The best schools imo are the 'good' ones. Obv some are crap but from what I've seen they've always been able to strike a balance in what they are willing to give up for Ofsted and what they're not. They're often the ones that care the most about the children, not just the results and the Ofsted grade they get. Obv this is a massive generalisation and only my observation. But in answer to your question, I don't think any school behaves the same during an Ofsted. I think they can see major problems within the school but it is a very flawed system that will never guarantee a 100% transparent result, whatever grade school they're inspecting.

I think up to a point, yes. They can look at data trends over the last few years, look at performance management files, talk to subject leaders, go through books to look at work etc.

But the problem is, these things only tell you so much about a school and its teachers and leadership. They don't tell you if little Johnny was having a bad time at home and just screwed up his KS2 test papers so got a low mark. Or that the head is bullying those two teachers because she wants them out so is making life miserable for them. Or that Alicia needs an EHCP but her family have just come from Poland and don't speak the language and don't want all these meetings and discussions so aren't pushing for it and the teacher is just trying to do their best for her.

I used to think Ofsted was the enemy, but it's definitely the Government and their terrible education policies that don't actually help schools, teachers, pupils or families.

Hey,
I agree with @Dodgeitornot. IMO the best schools are the ‘goods’ not the outstanding ones. I’ve worked in a lot of schools over the years and have generally found that to get and keep an outstanding schools do things that are not always in children’s best interests such as putting exam pressure on young kids, finding ways of not admitting pupils with SEN etc....

I feel this very strongly to the point that when selecting schools for my kids I have discounted any with outstanding ratings.

In my experience it gives you a good idea of the level of education offered but nothing about what the school is like.
For example: I sent my child to an outstanding school and we had a terrible time there. My child has SN and the teachers were very negative with him. Instead of encouraging good behaviour and guiding him in to making the right choice, they would wait for him to be ‘naughty’ and then punish him. The head judged us and made us all feel rubbish.

I changed schools to the local school that at the time was rated as needing improvement. Thankfully this school were working hard on improving the school and parts have now been upgraded to outstanding and the rest is now good. The attitude from the staff is brilliant though, they are so positive and encouraging with the children. The whole school has a happy vibe and my children feel well supported there.

Well I'd say no seeing as I have had a complaint accepted by Ofsted because it raises serious concerns about the leadership and management of the school but they keep their Outstanding rating until the next inspection where my complaint forms the base of evidence. That my complaint is about failing to meet statutory duty and off rolling and that Ofsted inspected whilst the school were doing both makes me think that Ofsted aren't a particularly good judge of schools.

No I dont think so. Firstly the "good" category is so broad and something like 85% of schools are classed as "good" so the overall rating doesn't tell you much.

The report is a snapshot of the school on that day, so if something changes this isn't updated on the ofsted report. And the reports are done frequently.

I did part of my teacher training in an awful school - the kids behaviour was poor, management were non existent, not enough support for SEN students, most of the teachers I worked with were jaded and just not good. But all around the school were posters saying "we are a "
good school".

18 months after I left there (4 years since previous ofsted) it was reclassified as inadequate and I was not surprised. But in that 4 year period there were parents who sent their kids there believing it to be a "good" school when in fact it was on a path to being inadequate or already there.

When I was at school we were coached on how to answer the inspectors questions and the naughtiest kids conveniently had trips on inspection days so I'd say no...

I went to sixth form open evenings and one of them was boasting about their outstanding rating. The ofsted was done in 2008 when my daughter was 4!

They wouldn't be able to arrange trips for the naughtiest kids now as they are only told ofsted is coming the day before I believe

I also wouldn't send my kids to an outstanding school. Too much pressure on kids and students. The (secondary) ones near me claim not to be selective, but they mysteriously have fewer PP and SEN students than other schools around. They strongly encourage parents to have private tutors. I just dont think it's fair to put so much stress on kids.

Totally swerved our local outstanding as it just felt like a results machine. The good school that we chose is child, not system centred.

Thank you everyone for sharing your experiences and opinions. I'm curious because my only experience so far is being in a school as a pupil and then knowing teachers who work in schools but not yet as a parent. I'm soon moving house and it's something I'm considering with each area.

I've always worried about Ofsted results because I've seen how much more effort teachers have put into their work during a review, and the change can be significant compared to the average day.

I have heard some teachers talking about schools being put into special measures by Ofsted as a conspiracy to turn into academies and that academies are 'awful' and produce falsified results.

I have as a pupil experienced a school doesn't care at all about pupils, only their results and ones that care about their results and the pupils.

It feels like a different set of challenges and things to consider as a parent!

I think it can be helpful to read the Ofsted report but agree that it’s only a part of the picture. I also wouldn’t say there’s necessarily a correlation between the rating and how much of a hot house somewhere is.

generally found that to get and keep an outstanding schools do things that are not always in children’s best interests such as putting exam pressure on young kids, finding ways of not admitting pupils with SEN etc
An outstanding comp secondary school near me has told prospective parents in the past if they enquire about SEN provision that another local comp is good for SEN so they should consider going there

I think there are quite a few outdated views here. You cannot spend hours preparing for Ofsted the week before. Data is frozen before they visit.

They look at the progress of DC over time. Not in a flying visit to a classroom. Any poor teachers should be on the radar of the Head and being dealt with - for the sake of the DC! They look at school web sites to check on policies. Writing them the week before is useless. They will have looked at benchmarking but this data is available to the school long before Ofsted turn up. The school must be doing something to improve if they are constantly having DC not making good progress.

None of this is a snapshot in one day. Therefore they know in advance which schools are likely to be RI or worse. They then look for evidence during their visit. This will either confirm their stats or show a school really means business, knows it’s weaknesses and has everything in place to improve.

Around me the outstanding schools have a rich curriculum, lots of clubs, happy excellent teachers and a caring ethos. Exam factories they are not. The parents are far more concerned about the 11 plus. They engage the tutors. I would never discount an outstanding school but I would one that’s been RI and worse repeatedly. You just know it’s difficult for them to recruit, sustain high quality education and that choosing such a school is a lottery.

Few teachers can prep for Ofsted in a meaningful way. Heads should expect high standards all the time. You cannot magic up good progress by prepping for a visit.

I also meant to say that RI schools can and do improve rapidly. If it’s a one off and there’s a new dynamic leadership I would not write a school off. Repeat offenders are another thing!

I think the comments are usually fairly accurate but some of the overall judgements can be confusing. For example, one school in my area had a better report for when they were good than their report for being outstanding.

I think with outstanding schools I would take a look behind the scenes a bit more. One school in my area is outstanding and is technically one of the best schools for progress, but then the curriculum is very narrow, staff are under pressure, most students don't get an opportunity to study a range of subjects, ebacc coverage is minimal. Staff are stressed so there's almost no enrichment. Entry points are low and they push students away from academic subjects, they are good at persuading parents that some students might be better suited to another school etc.

Another outstanding school has a lower progress score, but better pastoral care, an excellent SEN base, broad curriculum, happy staff, offers a range of opportunities to all, is willing to do what is in the best interests of students and argue later if Ofsted want to challenge it.

Both on paper outstanding but I'd only send my child to one of them

No. Classic example; a school near me last properly inspected 2008. Given an Outstanding report. School dined out on this report and was hugely in demand. This school has massively declined in recent years. The fantastic headteacher left and was replaced by an awful one. School is now an academy and has suffered lots of cut backs including pastoral support staff. There's very high staff turnover. Less and less demand for the school and lots of children leaving mid year. School is not achieving anywhere near as good results.
Yet it's allowed to coast along on the back of an 11 year old inspection.
I've also heard of schools locally suspending troublemakers for the duration of the inspection.
I would take all Ofsted reports with a huge pinch of salt and also check how recent they are.

Not always.

I've worked as a teacher and TA and schools always put on a big performance during inspections so normal school life is never actually seen by inspectors in the first place. Also many inspectors have never taught.

It's all just a big box-ticking exercise imo and it causes teachers a lot of unnecessary stress and worry.

What a joke.

I agree that there are some outstanding schools that are just that and have a nice balance of everything. I think this is much more commonly achieved in a 'good' school though. Bare in mind that what Ofsted wants also changes. A great example of that is the KS3 2 year curriculum. DDs school does this in a great way (I know some schools don't) and Ofsted last came and commented on how broad and great the curriculum is. They won't be saying that again. Has the teaching changed? No. Has what Ofsted deems as good changed? Yes.
A good head won't now change the whole curriculum just to fit in with ofsted but one in an outstanding school may, not really caring about how that will effect their pupils but their Ofsted grade.

I'm not saying all outstanding schools are assholes, but a lot of them do care a hell of a lot about their ofsted grade. I'm sure the about health and happiness of their students and staff does cross their mind, but in my experience not as much as their potential decrease in ofsted grade.

Short answer, no.
My child has been in an outstanding and requires improvement..... The outstanding was shite and failed him and treated staff and children like shit.
Iv dealt with Ofsted from a child care perspective. They're inconsistent, dated and not at all capable of grading teaching abilities within schools.
They do know how to put the fear into teachers though

I taught in an outstanding school. By the end of the reception year the children each had endless completed exercise books - including 3 A4 handwriting books - to take home. Reception is meant to be about learning through play - research has shown this is best for young children but of course often values the formal approach so that was what was pushed.

A local Outstanding school has been caught red handed off rolling and Ofsted went in the following week.

There is a loophole with outstanding schools, they can go for 6 years+ until their next inspection, how is this allowed?

In my last post it was meant to say 'ofsted' not 'often' in last sentence!

No. In my experience schools prepare especially for Ofsted, in poorer schools you may even see special lessons for the benefit of Ofsted that are more detailed than the normal lessons and tick all the boxes, they may send the disruptive kids on a leave of absence so they don’t drag down the ratings, etc. For example we couldn’t afford paper for the kids to work on so everything was done on the computer, but when Ofsted arrived we made a special effort to have paper that week because Ofsted would mark us down for being on the computer all the time. And we certainly didn’t have time on a regular basis to do lesson plans as detailed as the ones we showed Ofsted.