New to nannying

[LittleMilla]

Hoping you can help me. A girl from my son's nursery is interested in nannying for me. She has been looking at starting an early years Uni course from September but has just text me to say she's going to leave nursery regardless of whether she gets a place at Uni or not.

I need childcare for my ds2 from April - he'll be 9 mo. I want to keep my ds1 at nursery really (he's 3 in May) but might consider taking him out until sept when he will get free hours and I'm thinking of moving him to a preschool.

I cannot afford her solo and a friend of mine down the road is interested in a share along with her ds2 - ours boys are both the same age.

So, question is - how much should I be paying her? I'd mooted £9-10 per hour gross whilst she's studying. But what if she doesn't go to Uni? What is the going rate for a first nanny job?

Also (and I feel terrible saying this!!) I think she's pretty dyslexic as spelling etc is appalling on texts etc. she's so brilliant with young children I know that his shouldn't matter. But I can't help think I should worry about. Any thoughts??

Going rate depends on where you live. However, £9-£10 gross sounds pretty good to me for a first nanny job, it will be a lot more than she is earning at the nursery.

Check your contract with the nursery carefully though - they often have clauses to prevent you "poaching" staff.

How long term do you want this to be? If you need her to do homework etc in a couple of years time the spelling etc will matter. Also can she read books to your DC?

£9/10 gross, depending on your location is a touch low for a share, or of you're in London very low. The going rate will depend on her previous qualifications and experience too. There are obviously some differences but her previous work history is relevant, so a qualified resort worker with 10years experience can reasonably expect more than a newly qualified candidate.

You need to look at job rates in the area, her overall experience and qualifications.

You can start low and increase. Nursery may not be paying that much more than NMW though some pay more. So she will probably be happy initially with anything more than she currently gets, plus ever happier if it is increased following successful probation period, then again after first year.

Experienced nannies in some areas outside of cities are on £9-11 gross, so I would expect you could offer initially £7-8 and then increase from there.

When looking at your budget, keep in mind that salary is all year round, regardless of if you need the childcare or not.

Get help from a nanny payroll company with regard to a contract between you and your friend. It is important in a share that the parents have a formal agreement between each other so they know what happens if say one family want to go on holiday, one family wants to stop the share, who is responsible for paying for what, best way of sorting out taxation (two separate PAYE schemes, or one joint one).

I agree that you need to check your contract with the nursery, poaching staff is not something the owner will like. They may or may not have terms in the contract with regard to what happens if you employ a former member of staff within a certain time of that staff member leaving their job.

Consider practical things to do with the share... who's house, who provides what equipment, transporting children, food/nappies/etc.

Thank you all for replies so far.

I will look in to the contract.

I'd really like her to do the Uni thing if possible and ha thought about increasing pay as she progresses through her course.

In terms of length of time, I'm thinking until the youngest goes to school so probably 3 years.

She has responsibility for children at nursery - she was my son's key worker from 18mo-2. Reading isn't an issue. My husband is just a bit jittery and will say she won't "add much value" which I feel is harsh. She's very sweet, friendly, conscientious and caring. I know the boys will feel safe and secure which is key whilst they're small IMO.

Also get her to check her contract as I have worked at nurseries where it has been in my contract I can't work for nursery families for so long after either of us leaves the nursery (evening babysitting not included in that)

Would her uni course for with what hours/days you want, she may not know days/times till sept.

I wouldn't worry about dyslexia - she is obviously bright if university is on the cards. The only issue will be if she needs to help with homework, but if you are around to practice spellings etc then I wouldn't consider this a problem - most of her job is going to be caring for a pre-schooler.

How would she do uni course and work for you at the same time? I know sometimes it is possible but it may not be. Also she may need to do placement in various places as part of uni course.

She needs to look into course requirements and see if it is possible to work at the same time as studying.

Thanks for more pointers - I will ask her to check nursery contracts etc.

Her Uni course will be two days a week which works perfectly for me as I only need her for three days. I can also be pretty flexible as it's working on my own business.

Next job is to work out what to do with ds1! Went to a lovely preschool today and will find out in a month if he has a place. If so I think I might take him out of nursery (if we hire her) and that will give my friend a chance to decide if she deffo wants a nanny share. Her lo is starting nursery soon as we've only just started talking about it all and she's going back to work soon.

Just so much to try and sort out!!

9/10 hourly is really good, i am a nanny come from nursery and i'm not even on that.
There will defo be a poaching Claus but my boss and i done the same and kept it secret, doubtful the nursery would be prepared to fork out the court costs to sue either of you anyway!
And the dyslexia thing shouldn't be a problem when your child starts reception they will learn to read/write.

Bellabells - do you mind me asking what you're on? I had a look on some sites advertising jobs where we are (city in the SW) and they said 8-10 gross.

DH has just said we need to add on 13% for our own NI and so I don't think we could afford more than £8ph initially (as that would be £9 for us really).

Both boys at nursery would cost £95 per day. Don't know why but that makes me !

Outside of London/the SE, I would say £8 gross is fine for a first nanny job, though if it does become a share you should offer more. In Bristol for example, staff in a private nursery are likely to be on £6.20-£7 an hour (less if under 21) and nannies from £8-£12 (if very experienced).

Remember to factor in things like a payroll company, kitty, mileage, holiday pay, food and heating costs too.

Sure I do 10hours a day 4 days a weekend I only take home just over a grand a month I also have the youngest for the full 4 days, I get 15grand a year but I have numerous nanny friends that do similar hours that are on well over 20grand a year.

Thanks all for your help. We've agreed £8ph gross to start and assuming she does her Uni course one day a week we'll increase her salary as she progresses through.

She's going to be contracted for 36 hours a week.

Couple more questions, if that's ok.

1. We'd like to use childcare vouchers ideally. She's done a bit of research and thinks that she'll need to be ofsted registered. Is there anything else we need to do?

1. Do you have to use a payroll company? DH is an accountant by trade and seems to think we'll be able to sort it ourselves with HMRC

1. What's the norm for numbers of days holiday?

1. From sept my ds1 will start preschool. Plan is for him to go for three days and have fourth with her and his brother. I'm hoping for a nanny share for ds2 on the three days with another baby and she'll maybe pick up ds2 and the other baby's brother from preschool and have all four for maybe an hour a day max. How much extra should we pay her when she'll have all four children?

1. We're thinking of offering her a 2/3 month notice period after a probation period. Is this the done thing? It's more to support her as my DH and I know that it often takes a while to find a good family etc. he's also on 6 months notice

Think that's it for now. Please chuck in anything else that I might not have thought about!

Thank you x

5.6 weeks holiday is the legal minimum - this can include bank holidays or you can have her work bank holidays and give her other days off. If she is always going to do 4x9 hour days a week then it works out at 23 days holiday a year - be clear in your contract who chooses holiday.

I think you'd need to look at 20-50% more on the nanny share days.

A 3 month notice period sounds excessive to me - that's going to be very restrictive for her if she wants to move on to a new job.

1. Assuming you are in England, she will need to be Ofsted registered (£103 annual cost) She will need to have training that they accept, paediatric first aid, nanny insurance. A DBS check will be done as part of the process... now costs extra, think around £56.

You will need to contact your voucher provider and let them know her Ofsted registration number, then you need to set up payment system... it varies, aim for automatic monthly payment around middle of the month, so voucher money is in nannies account by month end.

1. Do you have to use a payroll company? DH is an accountant by trade and seems to think we'll be able to sort it ourselves with HMRC

No, you can use HMRC online tools and create your own payslips. However you may need to know employment law as well as tax law. A lot of info is online at sites such as Acas.org.uk and HMRC's website.

Your DH will need to setup a PAYE Scheme where you or you and him are the named employers. If he he used to doing payroll then it is fairly simple.

1. What's the norm for numbers of days holiday?

Minimum holiday entitlement is 5.6 weeks. I suggest you offer a little more than that if you can. Keep in mind that if you go away, then you still pay your employee (they take it as annual leave). If they don't have enough annual leave, then you still pay them. So keep track of how much annual leave you dictate and how much you grant them to take.

1. No idea, shares are complex. Certainly something extra, perhaps as much as 50% extra as has another families needs to contend with. This may be a reason to at least get advice from a nanny payroll company, as setting up the tax side of a share may be more complicated. It also complicates taking annual leave as there is another family involved to co-ordinate dates. You should also have a contract between you and the other family.

1. Notice period sounds rather long. If they wanted to leave earlier, would you enforce the notice period? If you wanted to end the agreement earlier, would you want to pay out that much in lieu of notice? Perhaps start with a months notice and increase by a week for every full year worked?

Thanks both, really helpful advice.

So is that 8 gross just for your family if so n she is happy with that is it worth getting into a share??

Nannies are paid the same for 1 or more children you don't need to increase rate when she has older one.

Maybe get clarification from friends if they want nanny share if so agree a salary maybe 10/hr gross split between u m whose house on which days n agree a kitty n groups u want children taken to.

Good luck

Hi i have been working in nurseries for 5 years now and in the school holidays working along side a childminder. I have worked with all different ages babies to 10 year old.

I have all my qualifications in childcare level 2 and 3, deaf and awareness certificate preschool stage, recent first aid, recent crb check and i have now applied to become ofsted registered as i am now a first time nanny.

Its in the Bromley area with all my experience and qualifications what should i be on an hour ? hourly rate ? i will be doing 60 hours a week soon 5 days a week. What am i entitled to ? please help many thanks.

Be aware that from April you will be liable for sick pay for a nanny with no prospect of reclaiming it. This could mean up to £2500 costs if the nanny is unlucky enough to experience serious illness/operation, a broken leg etc. Plus of course the cost of additional childcare.

See my thread elsewhere on this topic: "Stealth tax for working parents?...."

This is such a shame because a nanny can be a brilliant option. Good luck in weighing up the risks.....