My new nanny's previous employers are refusing to give her payslips/P45!

[honeymoo]

Hi
My nanny starts with us very soon and is leaving her job shortly. |Her current employers are being ultra difficult and refusing to give her the necessary paperwork she is entitled to. On ringing Nannytax she has been told that they've paid the necessary tax so neither of us can work out why they are being so awkward.

Is there any legal come back on them? Surely they are obligated to provide payslips and P45? IF they don't give her the paperwork, how does that affect us tax wise?
Any advice appreciated. she is our first nanny so we are slightly wary understandably.

I think she can fill out a P46 (?) if she doesn't have a P45. Are you using a payroll company? They should be able to advise you.

I suspect the nanny tax people might NOT tell her what the client has paid in tax. Even if it's related to her employment the account is not with the nanny it's with the employers. This would be for privacy issues. What did nanny tax say to do? I guess the P46 would be the only way to go.

I think she had to tell them the amount they were supposed to pay it on and when she apparently corrrectly confirmed it, they said that they had paid. All they need to do is download the docs, so it really is weird. I thought employers HAD to provide this stuff!

So what does P46 mean, presumably this won't put any additional tax burden on us? We are going to do it through our own company payroll (Self employed) but don't have the experience in all this.

None of this will put a tax burden on you - do you mean it might effect the amount of tax the nanny pays, eg emergency tax code?

I think if you get the P46 and fill it all out, it won't be a problem for her.

Be careful - nannies aren't normally run through companies because they are considered a benefit and so you still have to pay income tax on top of their income therefore losing any benefit of running their employment through a company.

thanks chit chat.

yes exactly what I was concerned about Rita. If they haven't paid up fully for whatever reason, will we be clobbered? I really need to get the gross amount sorted for the contract.

I suggest she calls ACAS or the legal advice dept from her nanny insurance.
(all proffessional nannies should have insurance)

Asking them what letter she needs to send to demand the paper work that they are legally obliged to give her.

If they have done it all correctly i cant see why would point blank refuse? and if they havent she can inform them that she will be reporting THEM to inland revenue to investigate.

I cant see how you could have to pay any of her tax from them. Make sure the gross salary is on the contract you have with her.

So long as you put gross in the contract and pay her correctly etc (which im sure you will) the issue is between nanny and her old employer.

If you have agreed a gross wage then the tax code won't be your problem.

I didn't know they were meant to have insurance... is that true?

You don't have to have insurance unless you're Ofsted registered. Many nannies choose to have insurance regardless though.

as rita says

It is a requirement if you are ofstead registered.

But in the 21st century IMO any nanny would be mad to nanny without nanny insurance..... its only £70ish a year / £6 a month, so really not worth not having

I will ask. can't imagine sueing my nanny though! what does it cover?

She will not get a p45 from her current employers until she actually finishes. From your post it sounds like this will be soon but has not happened yet. This is because her employer needs to pay and deduct tax from any holiday pay or other contractual amounts due.

This should not affect her starting with you. Sometimes it can take a few weeks for p45 to be issued depending on payroll runs. Again as long as you have it before end if her first month it does not matter.

You should be able to work out a gross amount even without her details. Use one of the on-line gross up calculators.

I believe it covers a child being injured due to negligence, or a child damaging someone else's property while in her care.

You say now that you wouldn't sue, but if your child was severely injured because of her and needed expensive, life-long care for example, you might change your mind.

also covers nanny if for example she accidently over dosed them in medicine....

if for example she falls down the stairs carrying baby and baby is severly injured...
in the same way the people can claim for their injuries when in a car accident they havent caused themselves, children can claim for injuries if their nanny was responsible.

all sorts, many probably that you wouldnt even think of.

i know of a family sueing their nanny (a while back) when their child was playing in the sandpit in the childrens park. Child was badly cut by some hidden glass that was buried in the sand pit, and rightly or wrongly parents sued nanny for not supervising child properly.
Given that they won the case and nanny insurance paid the claim, perhaps they were right to sue?

Their employer has to provide a P60 at the end of each financial year. So does the nanny have their P60 for 2010/11 tax year? That is a major document that the nanny should have got and should have kept.

However this is not something that I feel you should be overly involved in... it is between the nanny and the employer. You as their next employer are interested in knowing what taxcode so start them on... that can be done using a P46 which you can download from HMRC or have sent to you by HMRC or your payroll provider.

The nanny has spoken to their employers payroll provider, so has obtained some information from them. If they have never had any payslips, then the payroll company may be able to reproduce them but they may only be able to go back a certain amount of time. Is the nanny needing these payslips for something like a mortgage application? If you are offering advise to the nanny perhaps ask them if they got a P60 around April/May time... if not, then they should get in touch with their employer and ask for that document (the payroll company would have provided it).

To summarise...

She won't get a P45 until after she has finished work and received her last payment - this is because you are only allowed to issue one P45 and it cannot be corrected once issued so it cannot be prepared in advance.

If she hasn't received it by the time you are due to pay her she will go on to an emergency tax code which will probably mean she will slightly underpay tax (if she is paid monthly and leaves part way through a month), but this will sort itself out once the P45 arrives.

The employer IS obliged to give her a P45: if they are using NannyTax then NannyTax will file it electronically with HMRC anyway, but this is nothing to do with you, it is between your new nanny, her former employer and HMRC.

Please tell me that you have agreed a gross wage?

Any payslips she should've received already? Unless it's for the final salary, which she won't receive until it's paid along with her P45. As mranchovy says, she won't get the P45 until her final payment from her old job has been paid

She can fill in a P46 in the meantime, you can download it from the HMRC website - I just started a new job and had to do the same as I won't get my P45 through until after my final pay comes through at the end of the month

im not sure if this transfers over but... was employed a few years ago by a company (nothing to do with childcare) they refused to supply my p45 for months after i left. I contacted the tax office and they sent the employers a formal letter giving them a specific amount of time to supply the document or there would be consequences. (i don't remember the amount of time or the consequences, it was YEARS AGO)
have no idea if that is helpful