Please help dd is clearly in so much pain

[TinyDiamond]

Dd is 6 weeks and ebf. Pretty much since my milk came in she has been very sick after feeds, quite alot up to an hour afterwards and nowadays she is incredibly distressed when she is sick aswell. She will have periods of calm followed by periods of screaming and writhing in pain and there's nothing I can do to stop it. She needs to be kept upright, preferably over a shoulder for at least 40 minutes afterfeeds too.
I saw the gp at 2 weeks regarding this and mentioned reflux, he told me nope too early and to carry on as I was. I then saw him again last week as she had a bad cold-said same thing. I am aware that only gaviscon is initially prescribed anyway and I have no way of administering it as I cannot get anything out with a pump and do not have the time to hand express.
Last night she had a period of screaming in pain that pretty much lasted from 6-10, my mum said this could be colic...any thoughts on that? I just feel so sorry for her and I'm knackered too with frequent feeding taking up to 30 mins then keeping her upright afterwards it hardly leaves any time before it all starts again.
Sorry it's long advice appreciated

You poor things, you must both be exhausted. My DD (10 months) was FF but wanted to advise you to see a different doctor.
I saw 3 doctors between 8 weeks and 11 weeks as she was clearly in so much pain during feeding. The 1st doctor told me "well babies cry dear, you're just very tired", 2nd doctor "well she might be a bit colicky", 3rd doctor "there's clearly something wrong" and prescribed her the solution to her problem.
It's always worth seeing another doctor if you can as some are so much more sympathetic to this stuff than others.

posted too soon... meant to add - with my DD, the solution to her problem changed her in one feed. She had never slept more than 2 hours in a row and was being constantly held as putting her down upset her so much. That night she slept for 8 hours and continued to do so (teething and illness not withstanding). Mothers instinct is a powerful thing and if you know there is something wrong, you have every right to pursue a solution for your child.

Please go back and see another doc.

I'm afraid there is only one doctor at my surgery so no option of seeing anyone else..have made an appt for Monday and will refuse to leave until he takes me seriously. What should I ask for?

Tell them you want a paediatrician referral. Make a note of the symptoms as they occur and times. It is not right to leave a baby in pain and if he thinks it's too early for reflux (which is bllcks btw and I know as reflux can start from birth and protein intolerances from 4-5 weeks) then what exactly does he think it is?

The normal course of meds for reflux is gaviscon, ranitidine, domperidone, omeprazole depending on what works. Even getting gaviscon for me was hard work.

Is she refusing foods? Are you getting her weight checked regularly? When did she start showing discomfort?

Other things with reflux symptoms are protein intolerances from dairy, soya and sometimes wheat. This tends to manifest in runny nappies and worst in the early hours of the morning. Reflux sufferers seem to be worst in the evenings. There is another line of thought (that I definitely don't subscribe to) that reflux is only an issue if the baby is losing weight which would get you a quick referral. So it's ok to leave them in pain..

Ask for gaviscon, stand your ground and if he says it's not reflux, then he should have some other ideas. I refused to leave with a screaming baby and they got some ideas pretty quickly after that..

Come on the reflux support thread if you need any advice.

Oh and DD is ebf but we mixed the gaviscon with water and gave it in a bottle before a feed.

Although I think I lucked out with seeing a fab doctor in the end, who was actually sympathetic to what I was telling him I also kept a diary in those weeks of feeding, hours slept etc... to prove that my DD was only sleeping 6 hours in 24 etc.. Maybe something like that could help you state your case more clearly.

If the doctor really won't listen perhaps ask if he can observe a feed or if your HV can do it and stay around to see the aftermath of the 40 minutes post feed.

Or is there someone who could come with you.. you may be completely level headed but i know I was fairly emotional in those early weeks plus so exhausted that I wasn't at my most articulate. A friend or your DP might be better at explaining on your behalf?

So I am sitting here in tears after returning from the doctors. He didn't take me seriously one little bit and actually seemed amused at the fact I was breastfeeding. Completely unsupportive of it said I must be over feeding her if she was being so sick. I told him I wasn't sure what he meant and he said 'you know, how many ounces?'
I said I havent got a clue as I'm breastfeeding and he sort of smirked and said 'oh well now that makes everything a whole lot harder doesn't it'
Also spouted some bollocks about how the health benefits are only relevant for the first 3 months anyway and after that there's no point!!!! Also asked how long I planned to do it for, I said I don't know yet ad he said well I have patients who are still breastfeeding their 2yr olds-I think they're mad though!
I am Shocked by his responses am I right I thinking this is incredibly unprofessional behaviour?

He flatly refused that she has reflux, says she's just too full and get this, his advice is that I should try to cut feeds down by 5 minutes so she doesn't get so full. Also said maybe her screams are because she isn't satisfied enough. Conflicting much!
I am so, so upset and angry. The last 7 weeks have been complete turmoil with Tongue tie, thrush and ongoing latch problems I feel like we have just got to a pain free point and now my gp is telling me it all completely pointless.
Now I hve screaming writhing baby still and there's nothing I can get to soothe her. What on earth do I do now?

Take her to A & E? Sounds extreme but you will see another doctor and if she is obviOusly distressed etc maybe they could refer you (and you can tell them about your experiences with this rubbish doctor)??

Poor you TinyDiamond have you tried speaking to you Health Visitor?

:( :( really, really unhelpful, confusing and distressing, tinydiamond.

You haven't mentioned your health visitor. Is she supportive and understanding?

Your GP does not understand about bf and is clearly confused about how it works.

One thing you may not have considered is 'over-supply' which can lead to the symptoms you describe. Mothers with this have babies who tend to gain weight very quickly, but you have not mentioned this.

But if you can find a supportive healthcare professional, someone who can help suggest appropriate meds, if needed, then this would be a step in the right direction for you.

Oh no op I'm so sorry what a knobbed he sounds.

Can you change to another practice? What about the walk in centre?

Very, very luckily my health visitor is coming over this afternoon to see us anyway. I have already spoken to her about the symptoms and she was understanding but told me I needed to see my gp to get something prescribed. I think I may just have to change practice as I can't deal with going to him for anything else of we have even further probs with bfing.

Tiktok, yes I do hve oversupply, have been doing all the right things afaik such as expressing off the start of every feed until flow calms down, always feeding uphill etc.
Even along with these measures dd is so uncomfortable.
Weight gain has been great she gained 2lbs first week, 11lbs 2nd week and last time I had her weighed shed hit 11lb, was 7lb5 at birth is 7 weeks old today.
Plenty nappies wet/dry but are quite unpleasant at the moment but prob due to the fact that her first tooth popped through yesterday. You can imagine the week we've had at ours with reflux, 6 wk growth spurt and teething too. I am SHATTERED

Over supply is best treated by clock that causes probs the way you describe is best treated with block nursing, tinydiamond - far more effective than the expressing at the start of each feed (what a faff....) or feeding uphill (worth doing but won't make much difference).

To block nurse, you only use one breast in each period of 3/4/5/or even 6 hours. Each time you feed inside that period (start off with, say, a 4 hrly and if it does not work, extend it) use the same breast. Watch the other side for lumps and bumps and if you absolutely have to, gently hand express a tiny amount

If you have not been doing this so far, try it starting from now :) Give it a couple of days to see if it has an effect - it reduces production, which ensures your baby is not overwhelmed, and really can help the symptoms a lot.

With that sort of weight gain, I would say you had a huge over supply. Not a bit surprising your baby is struggling to cope - but it can be fixed :)

delete 'is best treated by clock' in my post - don't know why those words are there!!

Ok I understand the using each boob for longer thing. Although if I do that now the other one gets very engorged and sore and quite noticeably bigger (I don't have very big boobs anyway). The other thing is that last week I dropped one feed (11pm ish) that I express just once for in the morning (both sides) and dp gives a bottle feed so I can get more sleep as she usually wakes up again at around 4ish. How would it work if I was only using one side, I probably wouldn't be able to express enough off one boob only for her bottle...also as I generally go from about 9.30-4am without bfing wouldn't that badly affect the side that I had not been using most recently before bed if I was block nursing. It would be bloody full that's for sure.

Tiny - the unused breast may well be the way you describe at first, but this dies down. Just gently hand express a little if you need to at first.

If you want to try block nursing then can I suggest incorporating expressing into the block nursing period ie express from one side only (maybe on more than one occasion to get sufficient). The way you are expressing at the moment may be adding to the over supply.

Ah ok that makes sense. I have just fed on the left (the side that I have more of a problem with -think hosepipe out of two holes) so will stock to that one side until 5 pm ish then swap over. Would you say I should always block nurse like this forever or will it just be a while until things calm down. Also, when I swap sides after a few hours will I still need to express off the spurting/leak into a towel to start with or will this reduce too?

Some women have to block nurse for a long time, others not. You will stop spurting after a while - once the production line is dampened down things settle :)

Tiny - I'm wondering why no one suggested block nursing to you before....who told you about feeding uphill and expressing at the start? They missed the most crucial bit out!

It was the infant feeding coordinator and it was 2 weeks ago now. For the first 5 weeks I was literally seeking out my own help as I couldn't believe how difficult it is to find help with bfing. It was ME who diagnosed our thrush and ME who picked up on her Tongue tie despite being seen by many 'professionals' since birth am then telling me all sorts of useful things like 'stick with it it will sort itself out' and 'look how small her mouth is she won't be able to latch properly yet' and 'yes, your nipples should definitely be that shape when she comes off'. Words fail me.
Thank goodness for the Internet basically

If/when your difficulties resolve, write and tell them your story, tiny. They need to know!

Marking my spot to come back when I have time. Much sympathy - I had this problem and tiktok rescued me! Will be here later to offer a bit of support's it's dreadful :(

Hi and sorry, it's been a long day. I just wanted to say that (obviously) your doctor is a clueless moron so I think going back to your infant feeding coordinator would be best. Mine phoned my GP and got him to prescribe reflux meds and they helped lots, but controlling the oversupply in the first place was what made most difference.

It is awful to see them so gassy and sore though, I went through this with both of mine and nobody could help first time around. It was just termed colic and I was told it would stop at 2 months, 3 months, 4 months etc - he was nearly 6 months until it abated. If only I'd known that's what the problem was :( I will regret what he went through forever. You're doing so well to persevere and seek out help and this will get better with the right advice.

Between tiktok and the feeding coordinator I got things under control much sooner this time and I am so grateful to them both. DD just turned 1 and we're still feeding, and before you know it that will be you too :)

So since the advice earlier I fed off left 1pm until 5 and then right 5 onwards. Only fed twice on right side though now and will do again once more now. After that I'll go to bed and all being well she won't wake again until 6... That means I won't have fed on the left for almost 12 hours. This is gonna hurt! I think I'll sleep on a towel aswell. Wish me luck.