AIBU to be concerned about no TAs in Year 2?

[Whatwerewetalkingabout]

Maybe I am unreasonable I don't know, but I was shocked yesterday to find there was no TA in either of the Yr2 classes at DCs school. The teacher seemed a bit stressed out already, 30 in the class. For a bit of background school classed as "outstanding", Laurus Trust Academy, several pupils in class on SEN pathway but no help as obvs on waiting lists being 6 year olds.

Last year there was only 1 TA who was shared across Yr1 had a dedicated TA in reception. I also here rumour teacher had to buy some library books out of her own money to replace unreturned books from last years pupils.

I know the school won't get much in the way of pupil premium because of the catchment, but there are still kids struggling in class with SEN and many of the parents including myself are not high earners 20% tax rate, just average, although obviously privileged to be in a "naice" area.

I really don't know what to do, should I speak to the head, to my MP? And there's always PTA fundraisers going on, which I always donate to when I can, but the lack of essential resources has really shocked me.

Suprised to hear most classes have no TA's. Both mine had 2 in reception and 1 every year since (they are year 3 and year 6). Oldest had a 2nd in year 1 also. Classes were around 20 in infants, now 25-28 in juniors. Village school, mixed intake of affluent village families and children from next village which is more deprived.

I think its really hard for teachers to manage a mixed ability class of 30 without one. There is a child in DD1's class who spend half his time running out of class or throwing stuff, so the TA is usually with him. On the day she was off DD says they leant nothing as teacher had to keep running off after this child. A child who speaks French was asked to run their French lesson whilst teachers ran after the child.

Christ where do you live that you still have a TA in each primary class?

I’m in Cambridgeshire and none of the schools I’ve worked in/talked to friends recently can manage to afford that.

School funding in general has been reduced over this parliament. Our girls school used to have 2 in any class over 25, 1 in any class under. Now no class has more than 1. Lots of the funding is being directed into supporting the children in the schools ARP as the funding the council gives the school doesnt cover need. If a mainstream class is short staffed the children learn less. If the specialist class is short staffed then there us a risk of child/staff injury, so that gets prioritised, which is fine on odd days, but when it's most of the time, it's an issue as learning is impacted.
They survived year 1 of this parliament with no cuts due to running at a surplus and using that. Year 2 they managed to keep to budget by some staff being on mat leave and not covering that. Year 3 they are going to be in significant deficit and there will be redundancies.

Luckily DD1 is leaving at end if this year. We are considering moving DD2 to private if things don't improve, which I don't expect them to - we had saved some money over last 7 years for an extension, but that will likely now go on school fees. She has ADHD and is really struggling in the noisy classrooms, but is very able otherwise, so is getting lost among the disruptive children, who previously would have had sessions with TA's to help them regulate, but no time fir this anymore sadly.

As a previous Laurus Trust teacher I would say that their schools are better resourced than most and that the teachers are well equipped to deal with the needs of SEN children in their classes. Perhaps, most importantly, in LT schools there is a culture amongst staff of doing the absolute best for the children in their care and going above and beyond to support them all to achieve their potential. Unfortunately, large classes, lack of financial support and resources and large number of unsupported SEN children is the norm in mainstream education now.

Schools have no money. DC1 is now in Yr12 and the TA which would have been in her Yr2 class was made redundant just before DD started in Yr2 (so ten years ago). Since then, schools have less money but are expected to do even more with it - not all pay rises have been funded; utility bills have soared; the amount of children with SEN is increasing and schools have to fund some lf their support out of their own budgets. As I said, DD is starting 6th Form and is getting 10% less teaching time per subject as they have tried to balance the books by bringing in more pupils and creating extra classes so the teachers are now spread across them.

Tbf, you're lucky these days if your child's class has a qualified teacher!

How do schools with no support staff cover the playgrounds during lunch breaks?

Are there still midday meals supervisors coming in?

Our teachers and TAs have a rota for it. But it’s only a few of them each lunchtime - mostly the kids are just running around.

This is definitely the norm. The school I work at only formally have TAs per class for reception and year 1. Across the rest of the school there are TAs that are shared between classes or 1:1s. There are meant to be general roles in year 2 where I work but myself and the TA in the class next door can't do this as we are in unofficial 1:1 or 2:1 roles where there are children that don't have an EHCP (yet) but need an adult.

I'm a year 2 teacher. I have a TA for a 1:1 non-verbal student and that's it. It is due to lack of funding and it absolutely has an impact. I have 29 other students (including another with an EHCP), some with only the most basic understanding of phonics up to extremely capable students. It is impossible to meet all their needs, listen to everyone read regularly, challenge and support all. I've been teaching for nearly 25 years and this is the first time I haven't had at least some adult support in the classroom. When I first started teaching I often had at least two TAs in classes that had far less need than they have today.

To add to previous responses, some areas also get more funding per child. The neighbouring county used to get about 20% more per child than the county I worked in. Also, experienced teachers cost a lot more, which is why they are sometimes managed out for spurious reasons. A class TA is an absolute luxury in many schools now and has been for at least a decade. I'm always surprised when people are surprised by it.

This doesn’t surprise me at all-we only had TAs in EYFS in my last school.

Our primary school has one in every class, even year 6. Has done for years. Large primary with a good reputation for SEND. Interestingly in an area with one of the lowest funded education authorities in England.

@PurpleThistle7 That's shocking. Teachers cannot, and should not, be directed to work or supervise children over their lunch breaks! They need to be saying no.

It also depends on the number of high needs students in the school who require 1:1 support. It can take two years or more to get an EHCP in place and during the whole of that time the school has to deploy an adult who may otherwise have been classroom based. If and when an EHCP is issued, even the highest band of mainstream funding won't pay for a full time 1:1 LSA. Even if the child absolutely can't manage without an adult with them at all times, the LA will wriggle out of wording it this way in an EHCP.

My school seems to have lots of high needs children. There are two or more in every class except for one and therefore we require more of our staff to be used as 1:1 support.

School funding is now a race to the bottom. I've been a governor in one of the worst funded areas of the country and the national funding formula has gradually brought other areas down in line to the same as our local funding. That means that you've motly got a combination of areas saying 'we've never had a TA in each class' and 'we used to have a TA in each class, but now they are only attached to children with EHCPs'.

The only bit that puzzles me is the outlier schools that still have floating TAs, how can they afford it?

We have a fair number of TAs at our school, but we are in a very deprived area so get quite a lot of Pupil Premium funding. I have 4 children with EHCPs in my class and another pending.

DD’s school have TA’s in class (not attached to a specific child) she’s in year 2. They have an active PTA and we also get asked for a fiver in an envelope at the start of the year for glue sticks, whiteboard markers etc. They’ve just installed solar panels & a storage battery over summer so that will hopefully release more money back into the school down the line. Reading other posts, we’re seem to be pretty lucky.

Even if your child has an EHCP, the funding is diluted to share across not only other EHCP pupils but also other pupils. School will take the funding and pupil premium and still fail the children it's been allocated for. It's an absolute travesty. Nobody wins except the CEO heads of MATs. In my opinion, school are happy to sacrifice the SEN kids that are not disruptive to the NT kids that bully them whilst also taking away the support they've been promised.

Primary teacher of 26 years. Sadly, this is the new normal.
The only additional adults in our school are 1:1 TAs and they are very much needed to work with that child and their needs - behaviour, non-verbal, etc
What parents really don't understand is that a school receives an amount of money per child that is enrolled - just over £5000. If a child is pupil premium, the school receives an extra £1550. This MUST be shown to support that child - not entire class. This hasn't really changed.
The difference is the EHCP funding. School must fund the first £6000 toward each EHCP from budget. In reality, that means the child's full funding (£5000) plus £1000 from another child's fund.
In my class, we have 6 EHCP, it works out like this:

Income
31 x 5000 = £155,000

Outgoings
EHCP contribution school must pay
6 x 6000 = £36000
Total awarded to class before any other deductions
£119000

From this money, the school needs to pay the teacher, TAs, SLT, ppa, building and maintenance, running costs, equipment etc. It may seem a lot but all adds up very quickly.

In short, not nearly enough to pay a class TA.

Before anyone says the 1:1 can help other children, the children they work with have very complex needs and still none have full time 1:1 so definitely cannot support any other children.

This is most definitely not an anti EHCP post. These children need and deserve this support. The issue is where the money comes from, and the reality of how this has quietly changed.

When you wonder why teachers strike: this is the main reason. Not pay!