France announce a levy on SHEIN, TEMU and similar imports. AIBU to want the UK to do the same?

[AsMuchIn]

AIBU to want the UK to do the same as France, who are imposing a levy on products bought from SHEIN, TEMU, etc.

The impact on our high street (or now lack of) is massive, shops gone or as people choose cheap, poor quality, sometimes dangerous products. Less jobs in retail, empty shops, units filled with nail bars and vape shops.

The impact on the environment is also detrimental.

We are not making good choices ourselves, so bring in a levy.

France targets Shein and Temu with fast fashion fees https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm2792pendro

I’ve been on holiday twice in the UK this year - once to Lincolnshire, so not exactly rolling in it, and once to the South Downs. Most of the towns had good, solid high streets that were busy. Mix of shops from local bakery chains to Primark/M&S, with a couple of streets of indie shops. Not all high streets are dying!

I bloody love amazon. It’s a massive facilitator for my life, gives me access to smaller retailers I wouldn’t otherwise find (it’s great for Asian groceries), and is a great example of an innovative business that is a behemoth for good reason. I have no desire to spend my life trawling round shops for a packet of coat hangers when Amazon gives me a far greater choice and has them with me the next day.

This actually isn’t true that it’s no different ethically. Buying from Temu or Shein is ethically very different from buying from traditional brands because their ultra-fast business model maximise environmental and labour exploitation at a scale mainstream retail cannot match. While many brands manufacture in China, Temu and Shein ship individual packages directly to consumers to exploit the shipping loopholes, allowing them to bypass bulk customs inspections and evade forced-Labour import bans. AI-driven, on-demand production relies on thousands of tiny, unregulated workshops that escape independent labor audits, resulting in rampant design theft, sub-living wages, and an unprecedented volume of cheap, disposable goods destined for landfills. It really annoys me when people say they are all the same as all made in China. Just isn’t true.

And even if dangerous items or poor quality chemically filled fabrics, were for sale here in high street shops, at least we would know.
How many times do I read about SHEIN fabrics being like plastic but too expensive/difficult to return, how often is the sizing wrong, drop-ship companies where clothing is a very poor quality copy of a designer version, but huge ‘stock replenish’ fees to return. Wasted, not returned.

None of these items would be bought from a shop. Shop would therefore stop ordering.

Most of the stuff on the high streets at the moment is from the same factories and producers as Shein and Temu. The quality is exactly the same. This is why so many people just shop at Shein and Temu, they feel fleeced buying something from the high street at £28 when on Temu/ Shein the pretty much identical item is £8, made of the same fabrics.

The high street itself needs to source decent suppliers.

As for empty shops/ vape shops/ nail bars/ charity shops. This is very much a rent, rates and enforcement issue. A lot of the empty units are owned by private landlords, they often want very high rents for these buildings. Many independents cannot afford the rents plus rates of the more expensive rental units. The high street stores are unwilling to pay high prices and are instead investing in their delivery/ online/ click and collect offers. Charities get a reduction on rates so it's cheaper for them. Nail bars/ vape shops in many cases are money laundering fronts so the price of rent doesn't matter - it's another way to launder the money. They tend to rent for the year, close down and then rent a different shop with a different name. Dealing with money laundering fronts is an enforcement issue. It requires a police force that is equipped and trained to deal with money laundering and human trafficking/ modern slavery.

Then there is the anti social behaviour many high streets now attract, loitering, rough sleeping, chugging (I consider this antisocial), drug and drink use.

This is definitely the wasteful era. And people go on about plastic pollution.. it's like the more you think of it, the more you do it.

There would still be supermarkets selling clothing and a range of other local shops.

A SHEIN levy would mean people buy less, waste less, pay less in returns. Fits perfectly with a cost of living crisis.

But Primark have to adhere to UK laws and standards, especially in regards to chemicals used during production etc. I work in clothing and China has a high standard of manufacture for clothes, the bulk of their stuff is much more likely to come from Bangladesh, Pakistan etc where it’s cheaper and they don’t pay duty. They also operate a model where they buy huge amounts which brings the price down.

i wouldn’t choose to wear primark clothes either but they are not the same as Shein and Temu.

The high street shops need to stop the race to the bottom on quality.

Nailed it. Mind you, Next and M&S are often ok for basics.

It just is not true that all products are the same and if we chose less, chose quality, their would be no market for unsafe tat anyway.

So we just let all that you describe , happen to our high street, just accept it? We have to start somewhere.

The wider will also be to lose the tourist trade. Who wants to visit the wasteland you describe. A race to the bottom.

France are certainly concerned enough to want to make changes. Look after their own high street.

Yes to the effect on the high street, but also the effect on the planet. Theser awful companies are churning out millions, billions of items every week, all made as cheaply as possible and not designed to last. Producing them is polluting, getting them here is polluting, recycling them is impossible as they are all artificial materials which will not degrade and is too poor quality to do anything with. Disposable, cheap shite.

ANd that's before you get into the slavery issue. Well done M. Macron.

Greedy landlords and their ridiculous lease prices, stupid councils and their ridiculous parking policies were major factors in the decline of the high street as we knew it.
And they’re still not learning. It’s too late now to fight back against on line shopping and a levy on Temu etc will make bugger all difference.

Like I said earlier, even if they are produced in the same factory they can be very different quality and the workers can be treated very differently. They use AI to copy designs and churn out thousands of ultra-cheap items daily, using unregulated workshops that ignore safety and fair wages. This extreme volume creates a wave of disposable, low-quality waste that traditional brands simply cannot match.This is not the case for all brands who make items in China factories, just the blueprint for Temu and Shein type brands.

I think you are touching on 2 different things here. 1 is ths rise of online shopping and 2 is the rise in buying from unethical online shops. An import fee was introduced in Ireland in July from anything coming from outside the EU, regardless of their quality or safety. It is making me think twice about what I buy but is not making me stop buying online, nor will it.

I absolutely hate shopping in person - the crowds, the traffic, the cost of parking, going through rails of clothes, the time it takes that I could be doing something I actually like... and then after all of that I might not even find anything... not for me!

Should there be a fee to make people double or triple think about buying from the likes of Shein? Yes. But its having a knock on effect as the poster with an etsy business mentioned. Should a levy be introduced to deter people from shopping online? No!

its a difficult one.

I've never bought from Shein, but I have bought from Temu. I gave in when I realised that a lot of the items sold from The Range was EXACTLY the same stuff as direct from Temu. I looked at some plantpot stands - they were £28 on The Range website, but £12 on Temu. The item photos and product descriptions were identical - so why would I spend so much more for the same thing? That's where the problems come from.

But on the high street, it's too easy to blame online retail. I work a lot in this field, and I've seen first-hand research on what customers want, and people genuinely want to shop in-store still.

But I also think retailers make it far too difficult and unnecessarily put up barriers.

There's a general air of "fuck off, go and do it online" whenever you go into certain stores (Marks and Sparks, I'm looking at you. In my local branch, they had literally two clothing items in size 10-11 for my daughter in the entire children's range. When I asked if they had any more in stock, I was told "no you have to order online" - well don't then complain that people aren't shopping in store)

There's also my local football club shop. My daughter is invited to a friend's party this weekend. I said I would get her mate vouchers for the club shop as a present so she could buy herself a new kit. The club shop is only open 10am-4.30pm Monday to Friday. They also put barriers outside, so you can't park outside. You have to pay in the expensive council car park opposite, so it would be a minimum £3.70 for 1 hour parking - I only need to nip in for less than 5 mins).

But what really irritates me is that there are two voucher types: an e-voucher that you can ONLY use on their website and not in-store. Or an in-store voucher, which you can't use online. But delivery is a minimum of £7 for a 3-5 day turnaround.

So all that tells me, is they are literally saying "go away" - it's not making it easy to shop at all.

And its ironic because we now have a generation where a weekend hobby is a wander around B&M/Home Bargains, because you can park for free, take as long as you need, and let's be honest, you always end up spending at least £25 on useless stuff that you didn't even know you wanted!

Imagine if they got rid of car parking charges, and instead of spending £30 ish every weekend in B&M we were all spending that in our local high streets?

I don't use Shein or Temu but I never buy clothes online unless the High Street store doesn't have the colour I want in stock but only if they do free click and collect.

I detest having to pay for postage and packing and only will if absolutely necessary. I weighed up the cost of going to London to buy Fortnum and Mason chocolates for my Mother's birthday to paying for postage and packing. She's worth it but it still rankles mainly because it was too hot when I was in London in July to carry them home intact.

We woulld also go back to buying less in general which is a positive step. Mindset needs to change. No hauls. No mountains of things for birthday/Christmas. No wearing stuff once or twice - keep it til it literally falls apart and then replace. Repairing what you have. Embracing second hand.

France also have the "ecogeste" tax rebates which give money back when you have your shoes repaired, a hole in your coat fixed or getting a new lining in a dress/suit. I would wholeheartedly support that too.

https://www.service-public.gouv.fr/particuliers/actualites/A16951?lang=en

Be careful what you wish for.

The events of the last couple of days may mean it is not viable to ship from China at such low prices soon.

Having said that even stuff which is sold by high end retailers often uses Chinese made based products.

There's one outdoor brand who are considered really ethical and make a lot of their stuff in the UK who did a presentation on their environmental considerations which I went to. Almost all their core raw materials were still made in China even if they were then manufactured in the UK. It was eye opening actually.

Shein launched on the Hong Kong exchange I think last week. Their share prices tanked immediately - this was BEFORE The Toddlers started hurling missiles at each other again. This suggests the market doesn't think their model is sustainable and there's too much competition. It will be interesting to see what does happen.

The Chinese economy is going to have some very big challenges with fuel if things carry on for much longer. Ukraine has been hitting Russian fuel and power supplies hard and the Iran - US conflict is stopping China from getting fuel from one of its biggest suppliers. Not to mention the announcement 'closure' of Russian Airspace by Ukraine which will have an impact on any airline flying in Russian Airspace (it will increase insurance costs even if Chinese airlines continue to take the risk). Flying a longer route will also cost more in fuel.

If you aren't paying attention to all this, I strongly suggest you do. This coming winter could be trying worldwide. This isn't about being a prepper - this is about keeping an eye on what's going on. We are in for 'Interesting Times'. It could get a lot tougher for all of us very quickly.

SHEIN and TEMU for certain, absolutely dreadful substandard products, why anyone buys from them is beyond me, do people realise how awful they look wearing them? Hideous. Anyway yes levy those all day long and hopefully encourage people to get back into shops.

I don’t want to have to buy my clothes in person and am not prepared to pay for quality clothes.

It’s not always true about the waste. I have cheap clothes that I have worn regularly for the last 8-10 years.

Good for you if you have the time, inclination and the budget to schlep round the high street looking for clothes, meeting your friends for coffee etc. Some of us don’t.

I agree. But people will endlessly whinge about how their “haul” of cheap crap is now more expensive.

We should absolutely put a huge levy on this sort of crap. I refuse to buy from those sites.

Most brands make stuff in China. That doesn’t mean they all use bad quality materials or all pay their workers poorly. Or are all unethical in some way.

I wonder if banning mail order of such poor quality clothing could be one option. Those too lazy to go to a shop or who would feel embarrassed to be seen in places that sell such clothing might choose something better.

It’s cute that you think people care about the high street. They don’t.

Independent local shops are too expensive and have poor choice.

Even if this levy was brought in, it wouldn’t save the high street, because the overwhelming majority of people do not care about it.