Where are all of the Labour voters in real life?!

[PBEEBIES]

I grew up on a council estate. I would say the majority of the people here were very “I’m happy for people to come to this country, but those who come over and don’t work/don’t assimilate are unwelcome” as their main political belief. Despite being a poor area with the majority of people on some form of benefit, they believed that people who work shouldn’t have to pay super high levels of tax and people should be able to keep what they earn etc.

I went to university and associated with “posher” people for the first time. I would say the political beliefs held by these people were very similar to those held by the people I grew up around. I met a few people that were stronger to the left and right here, but to generalise, the majority were all pretty middle of the road/right leaning in the same way that they were on my council estate.

I now have a well paid professional job and live in quite a “posh” area. The people here again, generally hold the same views as everybody at my university and the council estate I grew up on. Probably slightly more right leaning, but all pretty similar on their thoughts on immigration, taxation, government spending priorities etc. We’ve recently completed a house renovation and if ever the topic of politics came up with the tradesmen we were using (eg. If the news was on when we were in the same room), the general consensus was still the same. I have also noticed that 99% of people I have spoken to all seem to be anti Covid vaccine/think that there was some kind of government conspiracy with hiding the negative effects of the vaccine - this is ranging from the drs I know, to the tradesmen, shop assistants, students etc (not just a small section of society).

I’m suprised that considering I’ve lived in multiple cities in both rich and poor areas, socialised with and have friends in professional careers as well as tradesmen, students, across all ages… most people I encounter seem to all hold the same political views.

I have genuinely only ever met a few truly left wing people in my life, in real life. For example, I’ve never met anyone in real life who has stood up and said “I think that we should take asylum seekers as they’re at risk in their own countries” even though this isn’t extreme! I’ve never met anyone who has said “I think that our taxes should be raised so that we can improve public services”, or “I think it’s really important that we spend on making our country more energy efficient as this is important for eradicating climate change”. How is this possible?! Everyone I’ve ever discussed politics with across a wide range of social classes , careers, ages, locations has always been centre/right.

Please don’t focus on the fact that I’ve used immigration as an example throughout this, it was just one of the stronger examples that I can think of! Another example would be the trans issue - I’ve never met anyone who thinks anything other than “trans people are free to do whatever they like, but sex is a biological fact that you cannot change”.

Later as in just before the 2024 GE. The big visa reductions kicked in after due to the lag in policies.

Obviously pro Labour promote it differently.

The left from Blair onwards has always sold migration as a good, whether it’s academia, the media ie the BBC, The Guardian, other institutions. It’s odd to see no memory re that but I guess not that surprising politically.

Although it doesn’t really match with the other claims from a pp that it’s not that important anyway.

Overall we’ll see if it works, Burnham seems to be liked more than Starmer (not hard) but seems a bit empty on his first attempt. But it’s up to voters, a GE is a long way off in political terms.

Labour had an open door immigration policy immediately prior to the 2024 when they were not in power?

Can you provide a link to this open door policy they had? And explain why if it was Labour policy it was the tories that had peak net migration levels?

Again, the conservatives changed policy just before 2024 which had a lagged impact on visa numbers.

Of course if we want to be literal, Labour have never had an open borders policy, but New Labour had a more open immigration system and numbers rose as a result.

We all remember Blair’s forecast that between 16,000 to 18,000 Eastern European migrants would arrive for work, the number was closer to 200,000, while other EU countries restricted access.

Therefore Blair’s forecasting failure opened the door to migration on a scale totally not anticipated.

Generally Starmer could not understand the issues on immigration, his rhetoric didn’t work at all, hence he was ousted.

Andy Burnham seems to understand that the British pubic want someone they kind of like as a person above all else. Your guy next door basically. He understands that there is massive overlap between centre Tory and Labour policy and usually there is pretty much one way to govern broadly which is in response to macroeconomic events, changing demographics etc etc power struggles by the superpowers and now increasingly too much individuals which huge amount of power (Money and data and energy) backed by foreign governments (and we can’t always tell if they wish us well or not). Ultimately Europe has opened itself up to other superpowers trying to exert some sort of malign influence over it and there is no way we cannot get back into a closer defence and security relationship with our closest neighbours. How that is navigated with the whole freedom of movement and the EU principles remains to be seen.
Keir Starmer thought the public wanted and needed solid policy etc and then kept flip flopping as no amount of good or bad policy making sways the majority of the British public. We are all so spoilt by peace time and assuming it is going to be fine one way or another, that we don’t really value subtle policy changes, Nor do we even believe that they are going to be implementing any of what they promise.
So it is back to Personality politics. It is all rather ironic that Burnham the backstabber of all backstabbers is Mr Nice supposedly, but we shall see. In the mean time, I doubt Keir Starmer has forgiven it as otherwise why would he be resigning on the eve of Andy Burnham’s debut at question time. So clearly the power struggles within the Labour fold continue, as they do in the Tory fold. Some Tories simply have far more in common with certain Labour MPs ideologically speaking than with other Tory MPs and vice versa.

Basically you've got a very outdated, if not downright odd, idea of what Labour voters think and what the Labour party's stance on a lot of issues is. It's not all Citizen Smith/Dave Spart/Arthur Scargill any more.

I honestly cannot believe anything you’ve said. 99% of people as one of your quotes.

Possibly the ones who talk about it are though. I occasionally reference COVID but although it had a big impact it's not a daily conversation.topic anymore. And more so the efficacy of vaccines/government conspiracy theories

I am quite politically engaged I would say and do talk about the news/politics etc on real life with people. But I mostly talk about other stuff unless I'm angry at something/someone. And there are loads of people I know where I have no idea which party they support. The most vocal will be those at the extremes (left and right) or the most dissatisfied.

I also think connecting "Labour voter" to wanting uncontrolled migration is a mistake anyway. That's not a manifesto they campaigned.on if we believe manifestos.

I worked during the pandemic. And most staff recommended it for the first year to 18 months. And then the enthusiasm wasn’t as intense as before but it was still being recommended. That poster met an unusual NHS staff cohort it seems.

And the 99% of people who you've spoken to about those harms are spot-on - maybe some wider reading is the way to go for you there's lots of it on Twitter - there is some very interesting and conclusive sign posting on there if you really want to expand your knowledge base - and it isn't to be ignored or debased because more and more negativity about the deleterious nature of those injectables is being exposed

Well I smell horseshit in the OP's post - he certainly doesn't live in the same UK that I do.

Most of my family and most of my friends are labour voters. Grew up in a very working class family in Scotland, some of the younger family members vote SNP, but most who stayed are Labour voters.
I now live in an affluent area of an English city, but a left leaning inner city suburb. It is still very much Labour here. DH and I have noticed that our friends who moved out into the leafier parts say things that we consider racist, and whilst they don’t share how they vote, I have no doubt it is conservative or Reform.
I remember when I was in my 20s someone told me you get more right wing as you get older. I certainly see that in some of my friends from that period, but DH and I have become more left wing!

Hiya 👋 labour voter for the last 15 years. Partner the same. Our parents are all long term labour voters.
I live in Makerfield constituency, and voted for Andy Burnham, as did most people i know, a few voted for reform.

The illegal immigration is being framed differently now - malicious gangs funded by foreign enemy states to infiltrate and exploit vulnerable people all at the same time. That is a plausible narrative for something to oppose even if you are on the left, including the underground slave trade and disappearance on our own streets and exploitation of such people.

I think Burnham also understands that certain key things matter, like not letting out certain prisoners early or making sure certain Pakistani criminals are indeed returned. It is easy for politicians to ignore some cases, but when there has been a really bad thing that happens people do expect them to exert their huge power in the right, just and moral way. If Pakistan is sending millions of vulnerable Afghanis back they should jolly well take their own criminals back too.

I’d be interested to know what area specifically this is. As i’m in makerfield too, and the majority of people I know voted for Burnham.

People generally have a tendency to accommodate when talking to others. When they don’t know someone very well they will temper what they say to suit the person they are talking to. Tradespeople in particular have to be careful not to upset their customers in case they don’t get repeat business. Think about it, have you ever fallen out with your hairdresser over politics or current affairs - I bet not.
Also, the way people vote depends on many issues, not just the headline ones. Politics is about choosing the least bad option so often you don’t agree with everything your chosen candidate stands for.
Finally, you ask where all the Labour voters are. Remember that Labour got into power with only 20% of the possible vote. So only one in five people you meet are likely to have voted Labour.

I'm labour through and through. I was bought up in an affluent Tory family background. The last time I voted Tory was 2010. I never will again. I finally broke the chains of my upbringing. It's to extensive to go through the whys and wherefores of why etc. I don't know anyone right wing

I find this v hard to believe

I find this v hard to believe

Seems v strange. I know a lot of nhs workers and cant imagine are reform voters. Most seem pretty Labour or lib. V few seem Conservatives

People generally aren’t as rude in real life as they are on social media. The medium itself and the anonymity it allows take away inhibitions.

i find this surprising because I have never met anyone who is reasonably well educated that is Anti Vax during or after Covid, or that thinks there was a conspiracy- that's basically insels in their parents basements.
i am not convinced this is a genuine post.

I guess it depends where your bubble is. I was raised by a leftie, my friends are lefties, I work for a trade union. The area where I live is strongly libdem so I suppose right wing people are a rarity in my life. I do read some right wing papers to keep up with what they're thinking, though!

A lot of Reform voters are keeping their powder dry.