AIBU to wonder why holidays to Tunisia are so much cheaper?

[DallazMajor]

To wonder why holidays to Tunisia are substantially cheaper than other places.

I was thinking of booking but when I’ve mentioned it to people they have said they wouldn’t go.

Am I missing something ?

Is it cheaper because it’s considered unsafe or something.

It’s because women are second class citizens there and western women are objectified. It’s run down and unkept and the men have nothing better to do but hang around outside in groups.

We went 40 years ago, in a luxury hotel near Carthage, in a group of about 20 families, some with children. The hotel was good, food good, if you were prepared to eat unusual foods. Service was bizarre with staff just not always available. No one felt safe going out side the hotel unless in a group. Going into Tunis, the poverty was shocking, disabled beggers everywhere, in the souks women being harassed, coffee shops, men only, in fact very few females seen out. Coach trips out, coaches turning up late, if at all, just generally shambolic organisation. Nice weather, interesting to see a different culture, lots of history around Carthage. Oh, and loads of cockroaches. If you are going to an AI hotel, and dont want to venture out much you may be ok, personally, would not go back, no matter how cheap.

I’ve been to London and Turkey and would not compare the 2 in any way. I never got leered at or groped like I did in Turkey were I was nearly gang raped and thrown to the floor like a piece of shit, they only stopped as a English guy intervened which to be honest I could see him contemplating it and was closed to walking by

Do people think it’s in the ME?

It can be cold out of season so that's why it's cheap. I went solo in the summer - stayed in all inclusive, did some diving, booked a highly recommended taxi driver to do Carthage and the souk.

It’s far from an isolated incident. I was simply giving you an example. Aside from this, it’s a well known fact that antibiotic resistant bacteria are far more common on the African continent - not a good idea to get elective surgery or treatment there. I’m glad that your emergency care went well.

Remember the Arab spring/uprising a few years ago with shooting tourists on the beach? Local Muslims objected to the tourist industry as the lifestyle was against their religion. It happened after I was there on holiday, tourists were shot on the very beach I had been on. I'll never go there again.

For some people the thought of a cheap, sunny all inclusive cancels out the fact that they’re travelling to a third world country.. Personally I think it’s madness, especially with DC in tow.

Would it be OK if it was an expensive, sunny all inclusive in a third world country?

Most people don't rule out holidays to 'developing' nations just because of that. Some choose them because they're cheaper. Most such countries are in warm, sunny climate zones, making them attractive to holidaymakers. Many people relish opportunities to broaden their horizons by visiting different lifestyles and cultures. Having children with you often breaks down social barriers, even more so if they get the chance to play with local children.

You'd have good reasons to travel only to economically 'developed' nations; others have different priorities. I freely admit to being pissed off that my horizon-broadening exploits are more limited than a man's, but that's to do with global patriarchy, not economics.

That beach attack puts me off for some reason . I know I’m probably being ridiculous and it was ages ago but it was just particularly horrifying and it’s the first thing I think of when I think of holidays in Tunisia .

Tunisia is cheaper than comparable countries such as Morocco and Egypt. It's also really nice! It's easy to get caught up in the narrative of a country being unsafe due to one or two awful attacks - but many countries, including the UK, have occasional attacks sadly, but that doesn't make the country unsafe overall. I travel a lot for work and also for fun, and I don't want to take unecessary risks, so I also look for facts over feelings. The global terrorism index takes an objective look at real risk based on attacks, casualties, deaths etc. At the moment, Tunisia is at number 50 in the world. The UK, France, Greece, Sweden, the USA and Australia are all much higher up the list - in other words, more dangerous. Here is a link to have a look www.visionofhumanity.org/maps/global-terrorism-index/#/

The terrorist attack on the beach put people off, people cancelled that year. I don’t think it’s any worse than Marrakech in terms of hassle.

The terrorist attack was 11 years ago. There have been more terrorist attacks in the UK since then.

Yes - I’ve spoken to a few people who have booked Tunisia and then panicked after the ME attacks.

@CoffeeCantata

Growly - this isn’t meant to sound aggressive - it’s a genuine question: can you say why you had such positive experiences? What did you do and not do? I’d be interested to know, because not many pps have had such a pleasant time

I’m sorry, I missed your earlier question. Im not quite sure why our experiences have always been so positive - We’ve just always had really relaxing and enjoyable holidays. Since the late 1980s we’ve avoided the large resorts and big hotels, and have usually travelled independently rather than on a package. The country is obviously very different now to how it was when I first went in the mid 1960s - it was just after the seven days war and there were, I think, only three hotels in the whole of Hammamet, and there were only 20 guests in our hotel. Tourism was really in its infancy and it was quite a novelty to go to a country thst was so culturally different.

I went back to Sousse for my honeymoon in 1980, and we got friendly with a couple of young Tunisians when we first arrived, who took us under their wing. We spent several days out with them, travelling to places like El Djem on the train, and we were invited to a family wedding. They treated us like royalty, and I didn’t even buy a rug from the shop where one of them worked. 😆 We went back several times in the 1980s and met up with them each time. We had started travelling round the country more by that time, and had discovered the Kerkennah Islands, where got to know a couple of the waiters in the hotel where we stayed, and are still in touch with one of them to this day; he turned up in London during the snow one winter and we had the chance to reciprocate the kindness he had shown us . We had a couple of trips to Morocco as well during that time and again, got to know a group of local Moroccan men around our age who started off trying to sell us things when we left our hotel for the first time, but quickly became friends and took us to various bars and restaurants, and cooked for us in their homes.

we went back to Tunisia in the late 1990s with our daughter when she was 6 or 7 and that started her love of North Africa and the Middle East. Tunisian people really made a fuss of her and she loved going to people’s houses when we were invited. We went to Egypt for several years when my daughter was in her early teens because there was so much we wanted to see and while we found the level of harassment very much greater than anything Ive ever experienced in Tunisia, it was copable with, and we didn’t let ourselves get agitated like many people we saw. Again, we went to local bars and restaurants and made a couple of friends who we still keep in touch with. We travelled around the country independently and stayed in some lovely places.

since we’ve been holidaying alone again, my husband and I have had a number of trips to Tunisia and Morocco where we’ve just booked flights and hired a car from the airport and explored much more easily than we did previously when we were younger by train.

It goes without saying that the beaches and weather are almost always wonderful, as they are for most people. But in answer TK your question, We don’t do anything out of the ordinary when we go to North Africa - we respect local customs and culture, use local restaurants, avoid big hotels and other tourists, and just try to get on with local people. We must have been to Tunisia, Morocco, and Egypt at least 25 times in total and in all that time the only problem we’ve ever had was getting arrested in Morocco in our 20s. We weren’t given any real reason for the arrest but the police clearly didnt like us being squashed in a car with three Moroccans; they let us go happily when one of our friends gave them a lump of dope 😆😆

As @HermioneWeasley said, there really isn't much of Carthage left to see, so don't be too upset if you don't make it. I remember being disappointed. I'm more sad about not getting to Libya's Greek and Roman sites. I went to south western Libya but thought I would do a separate trip to the north at a later date...

I did a tour of Tunisia and loved it. I wasn't hassled as much as in Egypt (Luxor being especially bad as mentioned by a PP.) However, it was years ago so might well have got worse since.

I’m really well travelled all over the world. I have been to Tunisia and it’s one place I would never go to ever again

Plenty of people go on holidays in developing countries.

If you read threads on MN, you will find women having bad experiences daily with non-Muslim men. I’ve not had any bad experiences with Muslim men in any countries.

You get that with anywhere though, including major European cities - Paris, Naples, Malaga etc One person will have their best experience ever, others will find them dirty, crime ridden, boring etc

@Growlybear83

Thanks - this is really interesting and I'm glad you have had the positive experiences you mention. I'm thinking: is it something to do with the time - I get the impression that the rise of militant Islam and the events of the early 2000s, as well as the 2011 revolutions in the North African countries may have had an effect on how Westerners (silly term in this case...but you know what I mean) are viewed by the populace. Perhaps they have become anti-Europeans for a number of reasons - not necessarily justified ones, but I'm looking for some kind of rationale.

The other thought I had was...my husband worked in Egypt for several years on and off, and hated Cairo and the big cities. He said he felt safe as a man, but was aware of the harrassment towards European women. But! He loved the Egyptian people in the villages. He found them welcoming, warm, genuine, kind and very funny and witty. He was invited to their homes and got on well with them. These were village people, not middle class professionals (whom he also met and liked, btw).

Perhaps the nasty attitudes and behaviour mentioned here are largely a feature of the cities and tourist resorts. Still no excuse, of course, but maybe the Tunisians in the less-visited areas are more friendly and less aggressive???

I still don't think the behaviour mentioned by some pps is acceptable in any shape or form in the 21st century, whatever people's cultural and religious beliefs, though. I'm sure it's not any part of Islam to grope women, insult them and spit at them??? No-one should make excuses for this (not saying you are, btw).

I have a lovely Muslim DIL before anyone accuses me of Islamophobia!!

Nope. Personally don’t see why you’d want to travel somewhere where your safety and wellbeing are put at risk, no matter how lovely things are in the confines of your all inclusive. For me it wouldn’t be an enjoyable or relaxing experience.

DH worked extensively in various third world countries. He had many opportunities to bring DD and I out for holidays in lovely 5 star hotels - for me that didn’t take away from the fact that local terrorist groups were running rife, local healthcare facilities were lacking and as women the safety of DD and I couldn’t be guaranteed. We always graciously declined the company offers and continued our holidays in more civilised places..

🤣🤣🤣🤣

You’ve clearly not been on safari or travelled much to Africa. It’s like comparing Benidorm to south of France. Africa is huge and tourism experiences vast, some are cheap, some very expensive.