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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be annoyed with Brown Owl???

38 replies

Hoppinggreen · 14/11/2014 20:34

DD has been going to Brownies since leaving Rainbows and really enjoys it.
She is due to leave Brownies and move up to Guides soon but as it will clash with another activity she has decided to do that instead and not do Guides.
This hasn't gone down well with Brown Owl at all, she keeps asking are we sure and would DD like to see if she can find another Guide pack in another part of town that would take her and doesn't clash with the other activity.
I have repeatedly explained the situation but each week Brown owl keeps "checking" Tonight I got a speech about what a shame it was that DD wasn't going to Guides ( again!!)
DD has also grown out of her Brownie trousers, she has ALWAYS been in full uniform but I think it's daft to pay for a pair of new ones for another 5 or so weeks. DD wears a Brownie Tshirt and hoodie but with jeans. This evening she had to stand up in front of the whole group and explain to them ALL why she wasn't in full uniform, DD is quite shy and found this very embarrassing, especially since some people were in Children in Need fancy dress!!
I appreciate all that the volunteers who run Brownies do and think they do a great job but the way I feel at the moment I'm considering withdrawing DD now rather than letting her continue until Xmas - AIBU??

OP posts:

LumpenproletariatAndProud · 14/11/2014 20:37

Just send her in with the usual trousers. It won't kill her to wear trousers a bit too small for a matter of a few weeks.

The brown owl shouldn't have made her stand up though, that was mean.

BlueberryWafer · 14/11/2014 20:40

It won't kill her to wear trousers a bit too small

What if they're digging in at the waist?! I sure as heck wouldn't like to wear trousers that were too small for me! Granted if they're just a little on the short side, but if they're uncomfortable why on earth should she have to wear them?

Original poster

Hoppinggreen · 14/11/2014 20:40

They are not the stretchy leggings style ones so it's not a case of them just looking silly she can hardly get in them and if she does she can't move about much and is very uncomfortable.

OP posts:

rookiemater · 14/11/2014 20:43

If she isn't continuing into Guides and isn't overly enjoying it, then yes I don't see why you shouldn't take her out. I'd explain to the Brown Owl that you can't justify getting new uniform for such a short period of time.

Wellthen · 14/11/2014 20:47

Ridiculous. I think its time to stand your ground and say, as politely as you can: 'i understand that you want the girls to remain in guiding but it just isn't DDS thing. I don't want to discuss this again. However, she really wants to see brownies through to the end but, yes, she won't be in full uniform. As I am continuing to pay subs, I assume this is fine? If not I take her out and expect half this terms subs back.'

Gileswithachainsaw · 14/11/2014 20:52

Seriously?

You are frickin able to join or leave any time you want to and it has bugger all to do with her.

The clothes thing is ridiculous. 5 weeks. Of course it's not worth buying new k es and if she can't wear ten old ones well tough crap. As long as she borrows a pair for any public ceremony where people outside of ten pack will see her then tough crap. Send her in what she has.

That brown owl sounds like a miserable cow

Gileswithachainsaw · 14/11/2014 20:52

On phone excuse typos

DiddlyBiddly · 14/11/2014 20:57

As a Brown Owl myself - she sounds like a pain.

The trousers are optional for all Brownies. We would never humiliate a child in that way.

And it is a shame to be losing a girl from Guiding, and we would look to encourage and find a Guide group for her to move onto, but I'd hope in a friendly and helpful way, not harping on about it when a parent has clearly explained the situation.

Oakmaiden · 14/11/2014 20:58

Gosh - I would definitely leave. I would probably also phone the district commissioner and explain exactly why. There is NO necessity for girls in guiding to wear uniform at all if they do not choose to. Most guiders like it, but they cannot insist.

Ridiculous.

Although - if the problem with guides is that it clashes with another activity but she has really enjoyed Brownies, then why not look for one on another night? The Brown Owl is probably trying to be helpful there...

whojamaflip · 14/11/2014 20:59

Sounds exactly the experience dd had when she left - she gave up going in the end and left early as she was soooo uncomfortable.

DiddlyBiddly · 14/11/2014 21:05

I also left Brownies early, though luckily for me my DM was the Guide leader, so I just started early!

Original poster

Hoppinggreen · 14/11/2014 21:06

DD could just leave now but she wants to see it through - having been going for 5 years ( if you include Rainbows).
DD doesn't want to go before her official leaving ceremony, and she doesn't want me to tell Brown owl I'm annoyed so I will respect that but I have told her to refer Brown owl to me for any further explanation of non uniform trousers!!!
I am just itching to text her though - apparently they were just about to begin when Brown owl said " wait a minute, before we start we seem to have someone not in uniform - x, could you stand up and explain why to everyone please ?" Well I'm pretty sure the girls in onesies for Children in need were out of uniform too!!

OP posts:

Lazymummy2014 · 14/11/2014 21:10

Bang out of order. Send the text about the uniform at least.

LumpenproletariatAndProud · 14/11/2014 21:17

I was just picturing trousers that were swinging round the ankles a little. For the sake of a few weeks I would send my kid in with those if they were just a wee bit short.

But if they are strangling her around then fair enough.

It was mean to make her stand up, do you think she was doing it because she was pissed off? It was my first thought.

Hairtodaygonetomorrow · 14/11/2014 21:17

In our group, you don't have to wear the whole uniform, I can't afford the hoodies right now so mine just have the t-shirts and wear another top. In Guides they are allowed to wear jeans anyway.

She sounds a very silly lady, you don't ask little children to do that. My girls love Brownies and Guides but I have to say I'm not sure some of the leaders are so great at dealing with children, our one isn't although she is good hearted, they just seem very old-fashioned sometimes- and that's an old-fashioned thing to do.

ReggieJones · 14/11/2014 21:21

No good can come from text conversations when it comes to things like this. Just go and explain about the trousers in person if you need to

BuckskinnedAstronaut · 14/11/2014 21:28

" before we start we seem to have someone not in uniform - x, could you stand up and explain why to everyone please ?"

"I'd be delighted, Brown Owl: I'm wearing jeans because the Guiding Manual states that uniform trousers are appropriate for 'events where formal uniform is required' rather than for events such as normal weekly meetings where we are not representing Girlguiding to the general public, and because my old uniform trousers don't fit."

Get her word-perfect for next week...

redexpat · 14/11/2014 21:43

Well from a guider's perspective it means that they really really like her and dont want to lose her.

Uniform thing sounds a bit odd. Id ask for clarification as gguk says jeans are ok.

redskybynight · 14/11/2014 21:54

Another Brownie leader here.

We don't enforce uniform at all - we absolutely understand that it is a big expense for lots of family, and certainly don't expect children to buy another pair of uniform bottoms if they have grown out of an original pair. Though we do have a stock of 2nd hand uniform and would offer it to you in circumstances such as this.

The going up to Guides I can see is Brown Owl trying to be helpful - we've had quite a few parents "assume" their daughters can't go to Guides because they do another activity on the evening that our "normal" Guides meet.

JoyceDivision · 14/11/2014 22:01

loudly tellbrown owl at next brownies session she was bang out of order, your dd won't be wearing hfull uniform and that you'll report her higher up if she carries on

loudly tell brownie pack girls can join scouts.

leave with a harrumph

CumberCookie · 14/11/2014 22:04

No YANBU I'm a brownie leader and think humiliating a child like that is disgraceful. Brownies isn't school, its meant to be fun. We've had a few girls who have grown out of their uniform and I understand parents not wanting to buy another - they're not exactly cheap as chips. Also for her to keep going on about guides is stupid, not all girls want to do guides after brownies - its not the end of the world.

itsaknockout · 14/11/2014 22:09

The Brownie leader wasn't 'bang out of order' Uniform is the rule, I believe they are called uniformed organisations! If you or your DD don't explain why she isn't wearing uniform trousers then I think she is entitled to ask.
Mybe this week she was a bit fed up at so many turninmg up wrongly clad she asked them why!
i think your DC needs to stop being such a special little snowflake.She is getting towards secondary school age.Wait and see what they will do there is she turns up in the wrong trousers!
With regards to the guide thing, she probably forgets that she has already had the conversation with you already.

itsaknockout · 14/11/2014 22:13

Don't modern happy-clappy guiders do uniform inspections anymore? They were a big thing in my day-you had to have the right kit in your pocket too.2p for the phone a clean handkerchief for first aid (I think) a pencil and notepad.Can't remember what else!

Original poster

Hoppinggreen · 14/11/2014 22:18

Thanks everyone
I appreciate that they like the girls to continue with Guides but asking me EVERY week is a bit much.
DD has enjoyed Brownies ( and Rainbows before that) but she seems to have out grown it a bit now and wants to stop once she is due to move on to Guides. DD is quite shy and would not join a new pack even if she hadn't decided she was finished with it all.
I just think that it's a real shame that she could be leaving on bad terms and her memories of the last 5 years will be affected by being embarrassed in front of her friends - probably being melodramatic but if you knew DD you would know that what Brown Owl did was very upsetting for her.
I have offered to tell Brown Owl why DD isn't in uniform but she says she doesn't want me too.
Brownies has been great for DD and she's enjoyed it so I guess we will focus on that rather than any unpleasantness in the last few weeks.
Brown Owl is actually very nice but has a bit of an abrasive manner and to be honest, she doesn't relate very well to the children and can be very shouty. Brownies seems to be her life ( she comes from a family of Brown Owls apparently ) and I don't think she gets it that it's not the same for the rest of us. She does a great job and gives up a lot of time for free and I am grateful for that.

OP posts:

ravenAK · 14/11/2014 22:19

As a couple of people who actually know what they're talking about have already explained, itsaknockout, uniform is not the rigidly enforced rule for regular weekly meetings.

I'd be tempted to text Brown Owl, just to reiterate that dd won't be continuing to Guides, but would very much like to finish Brownies. However, you can't see your way to buying her new trousers to be worn for the few remaining meetings - would they prefer her to wear jeans, or should she withdraw now for lack of uniform trews?

Unless she has a larger friend with a spare pair, or you could obtain some secondhand & then pass them on?

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