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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think our police should be armed?

93 replies

sickofscumbags · 10/08/2011 18:53

This is a genuine question and not intended to be inflamatory(although i appreciate that people may not agree).
How do others feel about this?Do you think that this would have affected what has happened in any way at all?I'm not saying i think they should be armed and appreciate that this could cause more problems but i can't help thinking that if police were able to use more force then it may have put off some people.
Let's face it all the news reports are saying that these people will be brought to justice when we all know that this isnt the case,so where is the deterent?
what are your thoughts?

OP posts:
OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/08/2011 18:55

The police involved in the original incident last week that sparked this all off were armed.

belgo · 10/08/2011 18:56

If they were there would have been far more casualties.

maristella · 10/08/2011 18:57

Having seen shit awful police brutality I'm eternally grateful the officers in question on that night were not armed.

Original poster
sickofscumbags · 10/08/2011 19:01

I suppose what i mean is say for example if one of these idiots knew that the police had guns or water cannons etc and would use them do you think this would put off?
watching some of the news reports the police look powerless to me
(as you can see i'm not well informed about this situation just genuinely interested in how it can be stopped/ prevented in the future)

OP posts:
AgentZigzag · 10/08/2011 19:06

No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

I don't want them to police by anything other than consent.

Original poster
sickofscumbags · 10/08/2011 19:06

thanks for that edith i will take a look

OP posts:
Mare11bp · 10/08/2011 19:58

Definitely not. America has armed police AND the death penalty in some states, no real deterrent when you look at their crime stats.

Don't forget our bobbies ALL have CS gas and asps. Some have tasers and some have firearms. They are not completely without backup.

And for the record my DP is a serving police officer and is one of many who does not seek any radical change in policy because he doesn't want the responsibility of carrying a firearm.

Apart from the obvious risks the investigation following the use of a firearm is horrendous.

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/08/2011 20:00

HELL NO. I was in the US last week and our cousins told us how many people were being shot by Police in Washington State. Horrifying.

baskingseals · 10/08/2011 20:01

Are you serious?

No way should the police have guns
you may be 'sick of scumbags' but that doesn't mean they should be shot.

get a fucking grip

Mare11bp · 10/08/2011 20:04

I think OP is not saying people should be shot but that more armed police may act as a deterrent. I can see the logic in that argument even tho personally in disagree.

ThatVikRinA22 · 10/08/2011 20:06

im a bobby and i wouldnt want to be armed.

baskingseals · 10/08/2011 20:07

the united states of america anyone?

PeterSpanswick · 10/08/2011 20:09

Some (by no means all) of the police have already proven they cannot be trusted to use the power they have correctly.

I wouldn't be happy to hand guns to the thugs we've seen on CCTV during police brutality cases.

AgentZigzag · 10/08/2011 20:10

I don't think it'd deter anyone, it'd just make any criminal bent on violence feel obliged to tool up to the hilt.

It'd also put huge distances between officers and joe public, I wouldn't feel comfortable encountering anyone carrying a gun, no matter how much legitimacy they might have behind them.

Mare11bp · 10/08/2011 20:13

Yes I have just seen the footage on TV of someone being whacked half a dozen times with an asp by a police officer while the other man is lying on the floor, in other words in no aggressive state whatsoever.

I don't see how this form of violence can be legitimised over the other.

It made very uncomfortable viewing.

CurlyBoy · 10/08/2011 20:14

I am a former US citizen who has lived in the UK for over 9 years and now am a citizen here.

When I first came over I was a bit shocked the police didn't regularly carry guns. I thought there was no way they could keep law and order if they weren't armed. After seeing the scenes of the last few days I feel vindicated in that opinion. The problem with the police in the US is that too often they are WAY too "gung-ho" and don't have enough training which leads to too many unjustified shootings. I feel that with the higher calibre (no pun intended) of training here and with the different approach to policing in the UK that not only could officers be armed but that there wouldn't be a massive rise in shootings.

Clearly the rioters had no fear whatsoever of the police during the riots. If the police were armed and were given consent by their commanders to shoot looters then this would have been over the first night of trouble. People with that little respect for their fellow man give up their right to live in our society. If they choose that path they must accept the consequences. You'd never see scenes like this in the US because people just wouldn't think it's worth risking their life just to steel a few tops from the high street.

Tsil · 10/08/2011 20:17

Our police are armed but only certain units ie specialists. I think this is how it should be, having every police officer with a gun could breed complacency and incidents like the one last Thursday would be more widespread. That being said I think they need to be allowed harsher ways of dealing with things like riots and not 3 days later but there and then. Had they used baton rounds/water canons on Saturday it may not have escalated to 4 days be because that would have been a deterrent for most people.

Mare11bp · 10/08/2011 20:18

So curly are you saying that looters ought to be shot? But this could result in death.....why would you favour death over temporary incapacitation (CS spray). I am not sure I want my son brought up in a society which says it's OK for thieves to be shot.

Am I the only one thinking this opinion is ludicrous??

SecretNutellaFix · 10/08/2011 20:19

I believe that tasers would be more acceptable, but I don't know the effect of tasers on those who have a gun ready to shoot. Would it actually cause the triggering of the weapon?

Tsil · 10/08/2011 20:21

Curly two days ago I would have agreed with you regarding shooting looters, but is it really the answer to the problem to shoot people? It doesn't eradicate the root problem just the one staring you in the face. Don't get me wrong I think the police need to be harsher but killing people can not be the answer, we are just as bad as the 'gangsters' then.

ThatVikRinA22 · 10/08/2011 20:21

some of our police officers are armed - we do have armed response units. They are called upon often but luckily shootings are rare. As a bobby, and i can only speak for myself, i wouldnt want that kind of responsibility, hell i was uncomfortable carrying a baton and gas to start with - (until i realised i was getting confronted by nutters on a regular basis, or having to confront people who often carry or use knives or blades, this is very common)

i would be happy to carry a tazer now, but not a gun. i will happily leave that to armed response.

AgentZigzag · 10/08/2011 20:22

Good post Curly.

I also think the looters were doing it because they they could, but it was because there was no police presence around at the time and those not involved didn't feel able to tackle them.

The police spend a lot of time telling the public not to take on criminals themselves, so they can't really complain when violent criminals are on the rampage and people are so shocked they can't do anything individually.

I'm heartened to see people getting together now to give the looters a good hiding a piece of their minds, but that doesn't mean they see the police as ineffective, they are just realistic and know there's only so much they can do.

And I don't believe for one minute that there aren't riots or looting in the US Grin criminals take opportunities the world over, you've just forgotten them happening there.

AgentZigzag · 10/08/2011 20:23

Also curly, if you're OK with looters being shot, are you also OK with 11 YO looters being shot?

CurrySpice · 10/08/2011 20:23

No. No I do not. Definitley not!