Support group for those affected by someone else's drinking thread 5

[pointythings]

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/5473399-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking-thread-4?page=5

A new thread, because the old one is full - link to previous thread above.

These threads are a safe place for anyone who has an alcoholic in their lives. You can ask for help, you can vent, you can say whatever you need to without judgement. We will listen and support you.

Oh god @AcrossthePond55 that all really resonates. He's certainly predictably stupid when he's drinking.

I have contacted a friend who separated from her alcoholic husband a decade ago. It is very helpful to hear her take on it.

Interesting you would only leave it 48hrs before checking @AcrossthePond55. Ex can be absent for over a day off fb if drunk and may not read a text from me or older dd for a day or two

does dh have to pay for these trips to er/welfare checks

but I may not hear from him for 3/5days if lucky

@Nogoodusername count your blessings. You would know if he died as someone would tell you

@Thefellowship I’m still wary your dh is drinking. They way he’s given it up so easily seems strange

and the drinking of 0% beer

is he a vodka /spirit /wine man as you said wasn’t really beer

I’m wondering if he’s having the 0% beer to mask the smell of real beer but as beer is low % compared to wine or spirits that it doesn’t touch the sides and makes him seem sober even tho he’s drinking beer

I may be casting my doubts due to ex doing that so to def happens

how long has it been now @Thefellowship. When is the month up?

and maybe he thinks a month sober and you will stay and he will drink again

you’ve made your mind up to split. I totally get that as most of I will on here

sad to say I believe that you say to dh that regardless you will be divorcing - that he will go back to drinking at once

just seen @CharlotteByrde reply. Same views as me. Sorry

as hard as splitting up was. Esp for dd as she was sad. But that was the beginning. She soon came to reliese we have a happy house now

no shouting or feeling wary or tip toeing to avoid eggshells

and as time went on he carried on drinking and lies about it and that like me , makes dd cross

swears blind I haven’t had a drink for 4mths - yet she saw his order on the iPad (by accident) and then saw the vodka bottle by the sofa and one in the bin and the smell of it

so at 9 she now knows he lies but at 6 nearly 7 she didn’t see it

im Saddened that her daddy hero isn’t one anymore to her - but that’s his doing and tho it’s sad she has had to see it , it’s better for her to releiese and understand why I said no more that day in Feb

Sorry that was a bit of a woffle

He drinks cider usually. Never really drunk anything else. He has never hidden empties which is how I know when he has been drinking. Always puts them in the recycling. He does sometimes lie about whether he has been drinking but never hides evidence. Doesn't hide the bottles waiting to be drunk or receipts or hide any in the house. It's right there in the cupboard.

I asked him yesterday how he was finding it and he said it was absolutely fine and it was easy. Then he said 'Do I miss it? Yes. Because I like it'. Which makes me think he is struggling.

Today is day 16. This is the longest he has been sober since he was a teenager.

Yes I agree that as soon as I say we are divorcing anyway then he will start drinking again. I think this is why I'm putting it off to be honest.

@Thefellowship I actually think the periods that they are sober, waiting/ fearing a relapse, are some of the worst. Absolute hell. No way to live at all.

When I first left Ex, I assumed I would go back to him if/ when he managed 6 months sobriety. It’s never going to happen as his addiction has continued to spiral. But honestly, now out of it, I would never in a million years have a relationship with an alcoholic again. It’s just hell. Your happiness is tied up with something utterly out of your control: whether they can stay sober. It’s a life on egg shells and it is excruciating. Never again.

I cannot wait for this to be over.

I really don't think he is drinking but equally see why everyone thinks he must be. I'm sure there would be some sign if he were. There's really nothing.

I’m just joining in for the first time.

My husband is a drinker. We have 3 small children. I think his drinking is tied to feelings of shame (he has anxiety and depression too), he drinks when he’s happy, unhappy, feels ashamed, bored, unloved, anxious. Anything.

Hes been lying to be lately more. That he goes on an errand to b&q (but comes back with nothing) and I know he’s been to the pub. Sometimes he takes our children. He lies where’s he’s been but one of the children usually lets slip.

he used to hide his bottles in a cupboard but then stopped when he realised he had an issue. He stopped drinking for 3 weeks and relapsed and later 6 weeks. This was 2 years ago now. It’s crept up a lot.

when he’s been drinking he’s very aggressive. He’s not often really drunk. Perhaps once a month stumbling but drinks every day starting at around 11 I can smell it on him.

I go to bed early to avoid him. I’ve tried talking to his parents about it. They agree to my face but then said awful things about me behind my back - like I was stirring or lying or exaggerating how bad it is and the impact on me. And the kids.

is there any point me joining an Al Anon meeting? It would need to be online

@Beachbeach welcome to the club nobody wants to be in.

In terms of getting support for yourself, there's AlAnon - they do indeed have meetings online. However, they are closely affiliated with AA and so their offering may not be best for you. Look into them, but also consider SMART Family & Friends for a non faith based support option.

It sounds to me as if your DH is not doing anything to address the reasons for his drinking. Unless and until he does, he won't change. He won't stop. And as your children grow older, they will see more and more of the alcohol using him. Children of alcohol misusers have a much higher risk of addiction for themselves, so think carefully about what you want going forward.

The aggression is ramping up - that means it's time for you to start thinking seriously about leaving. When aggression comes into it, it's time to put yourself and your DC first. Your children should not have to see and hear this from their dad. It's not their fault, and it isn't your either.

Learn about the three Cs: You did not cause this, you cannot control it, you cannot cure it.

There's also a fourth C: Don't Cover it up. Start talking about it to people you trust. His parents will be useless to you. Contact Women's Aid about the aggressive behaviour. Start putting plans in place for an exit. And lastly: if his aggression escalates, do not hesitate to call the police on him.

TBH, I think I agree with you. DH could stay sober for quite a long time if he felt he had a really good reason to do so. In the past he stayed sober due to cancer treatment, for heart surgery, and often on our 6-8 week RV trips. This was in the days before he spun out of control last year, but he was a pretty regular drinker back then, just not an out of control one. A 'functional alcoholic', as it were.

But the minute that reason passed or no longer existed, he went right back to drinking. If your DH really thinks you'll leave he's probably fighting in with every ounce in him. But once he thinks or is told you're leaving anyway, he'll be right back on the sauce. Just remember, it's not your job to stay and be unhappy just to keep him sober. Don't light yourself on fire to keep him warm. Besides, once he was 'sure of you', he'd start drinking again anyway. That's always the way it was with DH. Once the health crisis, the RV trip, or whatever he would go right back to his regular drinking.

I agree the waiting is worse. You know it will happen - just when. Whether a day week month or few months it will happen sorry to say @Thefellowship

bit if he does drink after you say splitting that is not your failing !! But you will feel guilty same way that I do that dh went downhill and drank so much living alone as could

same as my twin @Nogoodusername I would never date an Alcoholic again even if 5yr sober

rem how I say that ex can drink every day for 2w or until money runs out then be fine till gets uc again

he has no shakes etc and drinking 200 units a week you think he would

@Penguinsandspaniels

Interesting you would only leave it 48hrs before checking. Ex can be absent for over a day off fb if drunk and may not read a text from me or older dd for a day or two

That's pretty much the usual timeframe for him to be out of touch, but there's usually motion in the house. It would be the lack of motion with no calls or texts that would prompt me to call for a welfare check after 48 hrs. I'm not on FB (or other SM) so that's not something I can check. And I'm the only one who keeps an eye on him. His one remaining friend (as far as I can tell) isn't in regular contact with him.

does dh have to pay for these trips to er/welfare checks

Welfare checks, no. That's just the police going to the house and ringing the bell. If he answers they assess if he needs help, if not they leave. If it came to that I'd meet them there to open the door because in a welfare check if they're really concerned they break the door down to enter.

ER visits, insurance pays if it's 'medically necessary' so it generally doesn't cost him anything to go to the ER in an ambulance or for treatment once he's there as he's usually deemed 'medically necessary, even if all that ends up happening is him getting sobered up. If EMS doesn't feel a situation is medically necessary, they normally won't transport so he just doesn't go.

Where I think he's racking up charges is that when he forgets his phone (to request Uber) they call an ambulance to take him home. I have a feeling those won't be 'medically necessary' but so far I haven't seen a bill. It's one of the reasons I'm so glad I got the legal separation. I am not legally liable for those charges if insurance doesn't cover.

Welcome @Beachbeach to the thread no one wants to be on but we are all glad we are As no one understands like we do

it is hard to leave or say no esp with kids. But as you have kids it is important to say no more

they have no choice to live there

do you have friends or family you can talk to

agree the 4th c is covering

whether embarrassed or shamed or coz you don’t want to think marriage is over

they thrive on us hiding their drinking so means they can drink more

@Beachbeach

I agree. It's time to start making an 'exit plan'. And make sure it includes a 'quiet exit' option

My DH never got physically violent, but the emotional and verbal abuse ramped up until I just couldn't stand it. And I had to be escorted out by our local sheriff's office as he wouldn't let me leave. He didn't hurt me because I had locked myself upstairs to get away from his verbal abuse. But he wouldn't let me leave peacefully and was demanding I hand over my car keys. I couldn't trust that he wouldn't try to physically get them off me. Point is, be sure you have a way to leave without his knowledge.

I know you spoke to his parents, but have you spoken to yours? Or other family or friends? Because if you can, you should. You deserve and need your own support system.

I did go to AlAnon before I left and it really helped me. I'd probably still be going but at this point I'm not able to. I consider myself a 'spiritual' Christian rather than a 'religious' one so it being spiritually based worked for me. That being said, the spiritual aspect is a 'higher power as you perceive it to be' meaning it could be a Supreme Being, or it can also be an inner or outer 'power', something that gives you strength and courage. Try AlAnon and try SMART (both do online) or any other family/friends group. Hopefully you'll find one that works for you. And remember that we are always here.

Agree with my twin @Penguinsandspaniels! Ex went back to coke use when I left him. He’d managed a few months abstinence of that so I felt guilt that me leaving permanently (I had a few failed attempts) caused that ‘relapse’. But it also proved that he is utterly incapable of managing any emotion or set back without resorting to substances so I had a bit of a ‘might as well be because of me and get it out of the way’ fatalistic attitude towards it. He would have found an excuse in the end - me/ length of no child contact/ a special day (kids birthday/ Christmas/ Easter/ divorce anniversary date - you name it, he will drink through it!)/ argument with sibling/ a bereavement in his vicinity (Ex loves to make someone else’s family loss about him)/ flat tyre.

They do often spiral once you leave them, a combination of having a really good excuse to hammer the substance and lack of accountability I think. BUT that isn’t your fault - you have to choose yourself and a calm life where you are in charge of your own destiny! And honestly, until they really reach acceptance that they cannot drink ever again and want that more than anything and are prepared to work so hard daily to achieve and maintain it, it’s just a waiting game until relapse. Ex talked a good talk sometimes about wanting to be free of addiction, but it’s all words, he fell at the slightest discomfort, the first moment he may have to sit with cravings or stress or anxiety and not ‘use’. Then it’s all poor me poor me about how he cannot be expected to give up drink when his life is so hard, and he is the most unique and tragic of all the addicts and a very special case etc.

you know what, screw that and screw them! (Clearly I have some anger issues today 🤣)

hi @Beachbeach, welcome to this amazing group of very supportive people.

I went to online Smart friends and family meetings and I found it very helpful. It helped me to reach acceptance that I could not fix Ex, I couldn’t control the path of his addiction, I couldn’t make his life ‘better’ or ‘simpler’ enough that he would have no reason to drink, and that I had to prioritise me.

I had a few failed attempts at ending our relationship, it is so so hard to ‘give up’ for good - sunk costs fallacy maybe? ‘If I leave now then the past two years of hell will have been for nothing’ kind of attitude. But Ex became worse and worse in his behaviour as his addiction continued and escalated. With every relapse really. I think the anger and frustration he felt towards himself inwardly, he turned onto me. He was never physically violent/ aggressive, but the verbal abuse got worse and he did some unforgivable things. And so much blame. All the blame!!

it wasn’t until I left that I realised what a toll life with an addict had taken on me. All the fear, anxiety, stress that you push down and power through day after day. I would rather be single for the rest of my life than ever risk that kind of existence again. That’s how strongly I feel about it now I am out the other side and can see objectively how destructive it was.

If it helps @Beachbeach, my Ex also had significant depression, anxiety, childhood trauma, low self esteem and also neurodivergence in the mix. His mental health was actually way better during his brief periods of sobriety. There is a strong correlation between poor mental health, neurodivergence and risks of addiction. The substance is used to numb, but the substance also escalates the mental health problems and leads to new ones. But knowing why they may have initially become addicted doesn’t change the impact of addiction on you and your DC. You deserve to be in control of your future not subject to the whims of an addiction that you didn’t cause and cannot control or cure. Don’t set yourself on fire to keep an addict warm.

We had a barbecue today. It was lovely but I kept thinking 'this might be the last time we do this'. Then I got really sad about all the memories in the house and garden and then I just felt really, really angry. I just don't know how to navigate all of this.

We're supposed to be going on a big family holiday in a few weeks with my siblings and their families

The step you are proposing to take is a huge one with an enormous emotional impact. It is completely normal and reasonable for you to be feeling a lot of conflicting emotions. The best thing to do is just to let those emotions happen and sit with them. It's honestly the easiest way to mental equilibrium.

When you are out on the other side of the whole process, allow yourself to grieve for the relationship you meant to have when you married him. Shit happens, but that doesn't mean you 'should have spotted a red flag' or anything like that. It takes time, but you will get there. You may need some counselling. I did.

Once you have found that balance, you will be able to acknowledge the good times as well as the bad. You'll be OK. We'll hold your hand.