'Pregnant people'

Feminism is the radical notion that women are people.

This phrasing emphasises their humanity and makes it more likely they will be taken seriously. But it also describes, 12-year-old girls who get pregnant through rape. And, obviously, trans men and some non-binary people can get pregnant. Most pregnant people are women. Some are girls., Some are neither. "Women are not people" is a very weird hill to die on.

The NHS for example, will use the language that an individual prefers. No midwife is going to call you a pregnant person or talk about chest feeding unless you want it.

So, I am currently a “pregnant person” then I guess. I find the term mortifying. Especially as someone who struggles with PCOS and had to go through fertility treatment. These are experiences that no biological male will ever go through!!

Interesting username. I wonder what that could be a puerile reference to?

All 'pregnant people' are women. No man ever gave birth. Hope this helps!

Congratulations! 💐

Women are female people.

Women are not less human because they are female.

and makes it more likely they will be taken seriously.

Why would the word 'woman' make it less likely that they would be taken seriously?

The NHS for example, will use the language that an individual prefers. No midwife is going to call you a pregnant person or talk about chest feeding unless you want it.

Have you read the thread? I don't think anyone is arguing against bespoke patient care. The problem is the avoidance of the word 'woman' in general language. It's the equivalent of expecting all women to cover their heads because some women do so for religious purposes.

Ahh, thank you!

A women, as gender critical people as so fond of saying, is an adult human female, so no pregnant person under 18 is a woman. Some girls get pregnant. “Person” covers everyone.

And pregnant people who aren’t women aren’t any less pregnant.

They certainly aren't any less women than any other woman.

In the example you give, their age would be very relevant to their care, so it would be appropriate to describe them as girls.

And, obviously, trans men and some non-binary people can get pregnant. Most pregnant people are women. Some are girls., Some are neither. "Women are not people" is a very weird hill to die on.

The one thing all these people have in common is that they are female, otherwise they couldn't be pregnant. The vast majority of pregnant people are adults and the word for an adult female person is woman. Women are 51% of the population and we deserve our own name and are reclaiming it.

And, obviously...some non-binary people can get pregnant.

Do we have any clues as to which ones yet?

All pregnant people are female. In English the words in for the female half of humanity are "women" and "girls". Together in their original meaning those words cover every human female who ever has or ever will live.

The only way this becomes untrue is to change what those words mean by introducing personality limitations on who can be considered a "woman" or a "girl". This is simply sexist and as such of no benefit to female people.

And yet, even if a change in the meaning of the words we use to name ourselves is forced upon us, the original truth will still be true.

Not one person who would not have otherwise been called a "woman" or "girl" will be less able to be pregnant just because the words changed, and not one person who would otherwise have been called a "boy" or a "man" will become so. The same groups remain the same matter how much the language is futzed around them.

All that is actually achieved by this "women and other pregnant people" is the reification of sexism into our language and as a result, lack of clarity about the reality of being female and what that means for the half of humanity who are.

I do think that sometimes it is natural to use 'person' or other unsexed language interchangeably to refer to issues that only affects women.

The problem is the deliberate avoidance of sexed language when discussing issues that only affect women.

I can't believe this thread is still going on really.

I'm currently a pregnant person, I'm a person who's pregnant. Not sure what about this is offensive to anyone. Women are people. All this brouhaha over this sort of thing always manages to totally ignore the fact that language like "birthing parent" is nothing at all to do with trans people and everything to do with the fact that the second largest group of people getting pregnant, after heterosexual women, is lesbian women.

If a baby has two mothers, calling one the birthing mother makes sense.

Calling her the birthing parent, as if hetero or male gay parents can also decide which of them bears the child, is erasing from culture and conversation the reality of biological motherhood and which sex it is that bears that burden. This is not good for women whether they see themselves as women or not.

@Mouldemort ‘Most pregnant people are women. Some are girls., Some are neither.’

ONLY women (and sadly) girls can get pregnant. “Some are neither” are MEN, and they definitely CAN’T become pregnant!

* ‘Most pregnant people are women. Some are girls., Some are neither.’*

Two out of three... you were so close.

So SO disingenuous (or just dumb?) to frame this as though the problem is that anyone is offended by the notion that women are people. We all know they are people. They are that particular 50% of people who are the only kind who can get pregnant and give birth. Yes, not all do or can - but if they can't, that's for a specific reason which they will very likely have been concerned about and checked out at some point from puberty - and the reason won't have been found to "they're the kind of woman that has a penis and testes".....

So, given that they are of that 50% of people who can get pregnant and give birth, would it not make sense for there to be a word for that.... like .... woman?

As I said in the post that precedes yours, it's the avoidance of the word 'woman' that is offensive.

Words should be allowed to have a neutral meaning.

In the example you give, the word for a 'birthing parent' is 'mother'.

A 'mother' can be the worst person in the world, but she is still a mother. Many people will have birth certificates that list a mother with whom they no longer have contact, but that does not change the circumstances of their birth.

When you render accurate language taboo you take away the power to communicate clearly.

Only women give birth, and that impacts their entire lives, whether or not they have children. Deliberately obscuring this fact does not help women in any way.

Do you understand now?

At least you acknowledge that not all pregnant people are women.

Trans men can definitely get pregnant. This whole thing has f-all to do with women "not being acknowledged" and everything to do with GC people not wanting trans men to be acknowledged in any way.

A 'pregnant person' under 18 is still female. There is an argument for inclusivity here, whereby we refer to 'pregnant women and girls' in some situations where the age of the mother informs the care she requires.

All who get pregnant and give birth are female. There is no need to be 'inclusive' beyond that; pregnancy and childbirth, by their very nature, are exclusive of the other half of humanity, ie males.

Trans men are WOMEN. That’s why they can become pregnant!

Only women give birth, and that impacts their entire lives, whether or not they have children. Deliberately obscuring this fact does not help women in any way.

This is straightforwardly not true. Girls can get pregnant, and trans men can get pregnant, and treating women as a subset of people harms no one and is a fundamental feminist principle. Your anger is simply based on not acknowledging trans men exist and everyone else gets hit in the fallout.

Trans identifying females can indeed get pregnant, and nobody disputes that. Guess why?