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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

NHS update on recording patient sex and gender identity

430 replies

Whatchamacallitt · 27/07/2026 19:08

For a long time sex has been erased and replaced with gender identity. Trans-identified people actually lose out the most with this. There have been cases of trans-identified women having heart attacks, pregnancy emergencies, and kidney failure missed due to clinicians relying on normal male test ranges or presumed male sex. There have been issues for trans-identified men too but unsurprisingly it is the women who have suffered the most due to these policies.

Fortunately the NHS Core Information Standard has been updated to make 'sex at birth' a mandatory data item, with the option to record gender identity separately for patients who feel they have one.

(I don't personally believe in gender identity but recognise it is a genuinely held belief for many trans-identified people and also that it could be helpful information in the context of an altered body due to medicalisation.)

Release Notes - Core Information Standard V2.01 - NHS Standards Directory

https://standards.nhs.uk/published-standards/core-information-standard/release-notes?page=2

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akkakk · 31/07/2026 11:51

MashaPav · 31/07/2026 11:36

That is your opinion however it is not fact. No matter how much you try to dress it up as such. Hence why two FIT (feminist identifying transphobe) opinion pieces were thrown out of court for not being skilled evidence.
Hope this helps.

Oh dear - I do hope you don't intend to double down on your own inaccurate statements...

you post about Maya Forstater above is a made up quote which references the Sandie Peggie v Fife Health Board & Dr Beth Upton employment tribunal.

Where the tribunal considered that both Mx Valentine and Maya Forstater were, in effect, attempting to give opinion or expert-style evidence without being appointed as expert witnesses.

That will also be Mx Valentine:

a witness called by the respondents (NHS Fife and/or Dr Beth Upton) in the Sandie Peggie v Fife Health Board & Dr Beth Upton employment tribunal. The judgment identifies them only as "Mx V Valentine", noting: "Mx V Valentine (who identifies as non-binary and for whom the title 'Mx' was used on request)..."

So one person on each side of the debate at that tribunal - both categorised the same - yet, somehow your meme only focuses on one of those two people - I wonder why?

When information is distorted in that way and presented as a sole perspective, then one has to ask why... it can only be because there isn't a strong argument if the full facts are revealed... the irony of also stating: only deal in false information while publishing false information is really quite amusing!

akkakk · 31/07/2026 11:55

MashaPav · 31/07/2026 11:38

I’m sorry but this forums high school level biology and opinions are far from scientifically proven information. If I want correct information I’ll speak with a scientist, biologist etc I hope that helps.
I am sorry that my posts frustrate you.

I presume then that you are still yet to have that conversation with a scientist?
As it doesn't appear that your information is correct yet...

I think this forum has put out the challenge many a time - prove that:

  • a man can become a woman
  • a woman can become a man
  • that there is any sex other than man or woman

Still waiting...
Until that rigorous, peer reviewed, scientifically published study takes place that proves any of the above beyond doubt, I suspect that I will stick with the views of 99.9999999% of the world that they are comfortable believing fact:

2 immutable sexes - male and female

Sunnibee · 31/07/2026 12:16

akkakk · 31/07/2026 11:25

whether you are male or female is a matter of fact / of birth / of biology.
It is obvious through appearance
It is as much a part of someone's biological makeup as the colour of their eyes

It is not personal medical information.
It is not an intimate detail

Hope that helps clarify your confusion.

------------

There is no such thing as a 'real vagina' as that implies that there is such a thing as a constructed or other vagina...

there is just a vagina. - surgical butchery ending with holes in someone's body - does not make a vagina.

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If someone is trying to pretend that a man is a woman (when we know that is not possible), then that is a deceit, it is not factually correct, so we have to ask why they are doing that - and there are only two apparent reasons...

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I don't need to believe that sex is immutable - it just is immutable. Much like I don't have to believe that the earth is round, but that doesn't stop it being a sphere and make it flat!

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an individual doesn't get to decide when it is relevant for a HCP to need to know that they are e.g. male and not female - it is a necessary piece of medical knowledge which can affect virtually every medical decision. The NHS is not yours to dictate how it acts - it acts in a manner which is proven to be best for the patient. Even something as innocuous as dealing with a minor injury might need that knowledge to make decisions on pain relief and other treatment...

As for a receptionist knowing - so what, their job means that they need to know all sorts of information about patients - that doesn't mean that they will use that knowledge to the detriment of the patient - so the concept that up and down the country GP practices are refusing access to medical care because a receptionist knows the sex of the patient is quite frankly absurd.

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We are part of a society that has a structure which makes it work. The sex of an individual is a core part of that - we have everything from employment law to toilets, education decisions to medical decisions, even marriage decisions (e.g. Church of England v. registry office) all which come down to knowing the sex of an individual - it is so core a part of who they are that it usually has more relevance than the person's name. Sorry if you don't like it - but one small group's dislikes doesn't set the pattern for our society.

Ok let's address these:

whether you are male or female is a matter of fact / of birth / of biology.
It is obvious through appearance
It is as much a part of someone's biological makeup as the colour of their eyes
It is not personal medical information.
It is not an intimate detail
Hope that helps clarify your confusion.

Being biological and/ or inferable through appearance does not mean something
is not personal information. Data protection law does not define personal data by whether something is biological or visible; it concerns whether information relates to an identifiable individual.

Many things can be visible while still being personal information. For example:

  • a person’s pregnancy may become visible but remains private health information;
  • a person’s disability or medical condition may be apparent but is still sensitive personal information;
  • a person’s age may be obvious from appearance but is still personal data;
  • a person’s ethnicity may sometimes be guessed from appearance but that does not make it information others are entitled to record or share.

There is no such thing as a 'real vagina' as that implies that there is such a thing as a constructed or other vagina...
there is just a vagina. - surgical butchery ending with holes in someone's body - does not make a vagina.

These are simply semantic claims and value judgements with little relevance to the privacy issues in question. Whether someone uses a particular anatomical term for a surgically constructed body part does not determine whether information about a person’s body, medical history or healthcare is private. The relevant question is not what terminology someone prefers, but whether disclosure of personal information is necessary, proportionate and justified in a given context.

If someone is trying to pretend that a man is a woman (when we know that is not possible), then that is a deceit, it is not factually correct, so we have to ask why they are doing that - and there are only two apparent reasons...

This assumes that a trans person presenting as their gender identity is an attempt to deceive others about their biology. That does not follow. Many trans people describe the opposite experience: that being required to present as their birth sex feels deceptive as they feel like they are presenting in a way that does not reflect who they are.

A person living and presenting in accordance with their experience of sex is not necessarily claiming that every aspect of their biological history has changed, nor are they necessarily attempting to mislead anyone. It is a question of how they live and are socially recognised. There is no general rule that someone with a particular anatomy must present, dress, or be socially understood in a particular way.

I don't need to believe that sex is immutable - it just is immutable. Much like I don't have to believe that the earth is round, but that doesn't stop it being a sphere and make it flat!

The fact that sex is biologically grounded does not mean every aspect of sex-related biology is fixed or unchanging. Some traits associated with sex can change through development, ageing, medical treatment or surgery. The debate is often about which aspects are relevant in which contexts, not whether biology exists.

an individual doesn't get to decide when it is relevant for a HCP to need to know that they are e.g. male and not female - it is a necessary piece of medical knowledge which can affect virtually every medical decision. The NHS is not yours to dictate how it acts - it acts in a manner which is proven to be best for the patient. Even something as innocuous as dealing with a minor injury might need that knowledge to make decisions on pain relief and other treatment...

Healthcare professionals absolutely need access to information that is relevant to providing safe and effective care. However, relevance is context-dependent. Sex-related information may be clinically important in some circumstances, but that does not mean that every member of staff requires unrestricted access to it in every interaction.

Confidentiality and consent are also fundamental principles of healthcare. Where information is disclosed without a patient’s consent, there should be a clear justification based on necessity and a proportionate balancing of the potential harms and benefits. The question is not whether clinicians should have relevant information, but who needs to know, when they need to know it, and why.

As for a receptionist knowing - so what, their job means that they need to know all sorts of information about patients - that doesn't mean that they will use that knowledge to the detriment of the patient - so the concept that up and down the country GP practices are refusing access to medical care because a receptionist knows the sex of the patient is quite frankly absurd.

The issue is not whether reception staff can be trusted with confidential information; healthcare relies on many staff members handling sensitive information appropriately. The issue is that confidentiality principles generally limit access to information to what is necessary for someone’s role.

The fact that some staff may need access to certain personal information does not mean that all information about a patient should automatically be visible to all staff. This is a standard principle of healthcare information governance, not something unique to sex-related information.

We are part of a society that has a structure which makes it work. The sex of an individual is a core part of that - we have everything from employment law to toilets, education decisions to medical decisions, even marriage decisions (e.g. Church of England v. registry office) all which come down to knowing the sex of an individual - it is so core a part of who they are that it usually has more relevance than the person's name. Sorry if you don't like it - but one small group's dislikes doesn't set the pattern for our society.

Sex can be relevant in some contexts, but relevance does not mean it is always the defining or overriding characteristic. Societies already make distinctions based on context: sometimes birth sex matters, sometimes age, disability, health status, gender presentation or other factors matter more.

The issue is not simply about dislike or preference. The question is how society balances the legitimate aims of accurate information, equality, privacy, dignity and practical needs in different contexts. The fact that these considerations exist does not mean one must automatically override the others.

akkakk · 31/07/2026 14:18

I appreciate your efforts to answer methodically - I won't quote as otherwise it gets too long...

You seem to imply that something that is personal information is purely in the control of the individual and that GDPR trumps all in allowing them to choose who has access to that information - that is wrong on both accounts.

Not all personal information is in the ownership of the individual, nor is it always unobservable...

passport number / bank account number are not in the individual's ownership - they are created by and owned by the issuing authority - they can also revoke them, yet they are personal information as they relate to one person.
If you wish to play in the system then you play by its rules - if an airline requires your passport number to book a ticket then many admin people will have access - none of whom are running passport control or border control, yet they need the information - who needs it is decided by them not you.

some personal information is observable - e.g. current colour of hair / colour of eyes / whether you have one arm or two - that is all personal information, but you can't walk through life telling people that they are not allowed to observe you or note that personal information if you walk into a GP reception, the receptionist will be able to see whether you have one arm or two - you can't tell them that they are not allowed to know because it is personal information. You only get to control what is observed by where you take yourself - so, sure, become a hermit on a remote mountain and you are more likely to keep that information private.

some personal information is not necessarily observable, it might not even be in a third party's ownership, but they may still have lawful needs to know that information which is a reason under GDPR to share that information with others who also have that lawful need.

It is worth noting that you can not sue an organisation for sharing personal information without permission where that information is in the public domain. Observable personal characteristics are in the public domain for those who are in a position to observe. So a doctor referring to a patient as their natal sex - 'he' is not sharing personal information where the recipient has also been able to observe that person, they both already have that information, so none has been shared.

Not sure that accuracy in biological terminology is ever semantic or a value judgement - it is critical scientific terminology used to decide treatments. If a male presents at A&E with a pretend vagina and pretending to be a woman yet bleeding at the crotch, it is probably quite important to know that they don't have a womb / don't have a vagina / are actually male - so that the HCP can rule out some of the heavy bleeding issues women can have but which men can not.

"This assumes that a trans person presenting as their gender identity is an attempt to deceive others about their biology. That does not follow. Many trans people describe the opposite experience: that being required to present as their birth sex feels deceptive as they feel like they are presenting in a way that does not reflect who they are."

Life is not about feelings being presented as fact, we don't live in a dream world - it is about understanding fact as fact.

A person presenting as the opposite sex is doing nothing other than deceive.

  • If I have blue eyes and walk around claiming that I have brown eyes - that is a lie, it is not a feeling...
  • If I have two legs and walk around claiming to have three, that is a lie, it is not a feeling
  • If I try to get hired as a concert pianist, claiming that I can play the piano, that is a lie, it is not a feeling
  • If I try to get work in a hospital, claiming to be a qualified doctor, that is a lie, it is not a feeling
I can not identify as a three-legged classical piano playing doctor with brown eyes if in fact those things are not accurate - let's not try to pretend that it would be anything other than a lie.

So, if I walk into any setting and claim to be a woman (I am a man) then that would be a lie - it doesn't matter if I feel sensitive and compassionate and caring and all the other womanly stereotypes, it doesn't matter if I suddenly have an urge to dust the bathroom, bake cakes and crochet - still stuck in the 1970s stereotype - I am still a man - it would be a lie.

"A person living and presenting in accordance with their experience of sex is not necessarily claiming that every aspect of their biological history has changed, nor are they necessarily attempting to mislead anyone. It is a question of how they live and are socially recognised. There is no general rule that someone with a particular anatomy must present, dress, or be socially understood in a particular way."

Every person lives and presents in accordance with their experience of sex - now we are getting somewhere - every man has their interpretation of man - they can dress how they like, they can live how they want (though you are back into bland stereotypes if you think that all men or women are the same), but they can only ever have their experience of what it means to be their natal sex - so a man dressing as and 'living as' (whatever that is meant to mean!) a woman is not a woman - they are simply demonstrating their interpretation of what a man is...

So in that context to claim that they are a woman is to deceive - there is no other interpretation.

traits associated with sex do not themselves define or change sex - doesn't matter what happens to you, what hormones you pump in, what surgery takes place - your sex remains identical to when you were born.

JamesKirkupReviewWritersFund · 31/07/2026 16:49

Oh Masha, you’re being a bit of a Gretchen Wieners aren’t you?

NHS update on recording patient sex and gender identity
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