Marina Hyde on Epstein’s enablers: will they get away with it? |

Me as a sex class will not care unless it affects them. In the same way we agree wheelchair users need built environment access, but until we are in a wheelchair, we won't understand how bad everyday designs are.

Men benefit from this. Our best bet is not trying to make them understand, but get women into places of power who do understand.

everytime I hear someone saying ‘’my thoughts are with the victims’ or ‘we should focus on the victims’ I think oh fuck off, you’re only bringing up the victims to deflect from you and shut down the questions - they haven’t cared about the victims before today

I think what I dont understand is how so many people seem to think what was happening is rare. And of course men cover up for each other.

It's all levels of society. Given the opportunity men will behave like this. And as we have also learnt or been reminded of, it can happen in families. And institutions.

All that is happening know is that because of this being about rich people, everyone can go on about the detail of the places it happened, etc..

Being flown across the Atlantic is in the end no different tnn being taken by taxi from one side of the town you live in to the other by men for other men.

Lets just hope all these journalists suddenly finding this worthwhile material for an article are just as zealous when the same is happening it remote parts of the country, run down estates, children's homes, seaside towns, big cities. And for all we know Fleet Street.

What does this mean?

There was a question about this on Any Questions R4.

Very direct asking why isn't anyone talking about the underlying misogyny.

And apart from one panelist (a woman sadly) who only wanted to go on about it being all Labour's fault the other's tried to address the issue. Even Caroline Lucas came over as a strong feminist, and had to remind myself of the Green Party ideology.

What was also interesting, when Laila Cunningham (Reform candidate for London Mayor) starting spouting stuff about it wouldn't get better until the UK stop illegal immigrants, the audience booed her! This was in Essex, which the MSM claim is going to go Reform.

Also the first caller to Any Answers was a woman who spoke movinglly about here experience in 1980s of being exploited by a man who gave her her first job.

It was heartbreaking. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002r39h

Not sure how big an audience this programme gets, but horrible to hear what happened to her and the impact on her life hopefully it will make som R4 listerns stop and think.

The impression I get is that the men thought that they were in a protected environment where they were safe from any consequences. How did Epstein create that illusion? And did none of the men realise that they were being photographed or more likely filmed? How were they lured into being so reckless?

On Skye yesterday there was an article about the young girls abused by Epstein's lot. It mentioned how many of them were 17 and still at school, and what one victim has said about being made to go to give a man a massage, which she didn't want to do, and then being sexually assaulted. On reading the article it came home to me that almost all the articles I've seen have just been about the men and what they wrote in emails etc. On the radio, they've sometimes prefaced it with a sentence saying that we should think about the victims, but have then gone on to talk about the men and only the men. I think we could do with more information on what the men actually did to those girls, how they were "recruited" and what they were put through.

Agree with everything she has said. It’s disgraceful that after all of this evidence, everyone will move on and nothing will have changed for women and girls.

Greer told us, she warned us. It feels like a hard lesson to learn

Where are the huge anti misogyny protests, attended as much by men as women? Oh yeah we can't have them can we because even the name for our class of human offends some men.

The movement against misogyny has been so effectively scuppered. Men who benefit from the status quo exist across all sections of society, in all political flavours. We can't really win against them.

I read the guardian article about how the men involved wrote about women.

Nothing has changed. I didn’t really think it had but seeing it in black and white is so utterly depressing.

There is a wafer thin veneer of respect and equality put on for show in modern society (and of course sometimes not even that) but really it is just business as usual.

@Ox136jl Someone shared it with a share token on a different thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5485848-brilliant-article-on-epstein-by-helen-rumbelow-in-the-times-tw-distressing-content

Hopefully this works for you!

Helen Rumbelow wrote an article in the Times about the misogyny of the Epstein files. I haven’t been able to read it yet as my DH keeps forgetting to reactivate my subscription but I think it is addressing exactly this issue.

All those lefties fretting over transwomen have been schtum so far.

Branson has been named in them. Not much seems to have been said about him.

So far the only 2 Brits implicated by the files are a homosexual, so the subject of the degrading treatment of the women in this loathsome boys club is not relevant, which is why the MSM and politicians get to ignore it.

The second is a unwanted spare, who's not been charged with any crime, but has had everything stripped off him and has now been banished to living quietly in the country, off his brother.

It'll be interesting to see if any more high profile Brits are named in these files, and if any charges can be brought against anyone of them. If they are we'll see how much attention is paid to the women then, I'm betting none of course.

She was saying as much on The Rest Is Entertainment podcast. She brought the subject back to this a couple of times.
The world is interested in which rich men are paedos or nonces and the UK is interested that a knight of the realm did something corrupt while serving in the government.
But none of them are that bothered about the real victims in all of this, the women.
I've seen women on MN (even) excuse the situation because the girls weren't under 16.
It matters more that they were young, impressionable and lied to by a rich English woman with a posh accent - that made the abject lies they and their families were told more credible. It matters a lot more. But surely the fact that they were trafficked matters just as much, they could have been in their 20's and it would have mattered.
It's a tale as old as time. Money matters, reputation matters, titillation matters, but females don't.

I love Marina and she is bang on here.