Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Politicians respond to the SC judgement

511 replies

ArabellaScott · 17/04/2025 10:59

A thread to gather politicians' responses to yesterday's Supreme Court judgement.

  1. Stella Creasy. She's rather unhelpfully posted a pdf, (and turned off replies), so archive below.

https://archive.ph/8T1Yl

https://x.com/stellacreasy/status/1912609872430133697

https://x.com/stellacreasy/status/1912609872430133697

OP posts:
Thread gallery
45
Floisme · 24/04/2025 12:55

lcakethereforeIam · 24/04/2025 12:08

Some more receipts

https://thecritic.co.uk/labour-didnt-start-the-gender-madness/

Actually, this is a bothsides-ism that holds water! Pity he didn't wade in on the LD and the Greens, but they weren't in power and, as there's enough blame to go round to write a library of books, you have to draw a line somewhere.

Thanks for this, it's a very useful Roll of Shame from Jonny Best that should make both the Conservative and Labour Parties wince.

Minor point: I don't think Caroline Nokes is Chair of the Women and Equalities Committee any more?

Bigger point: I think one difference between the parties that Jonny Best doesn't mention is the attitude towards dissenters. I cannot recall any Conservative MP getting the kind of treatment from their own colleagues and party members that Rosie Duffield had to endure.

I'm going to be charitable and assume this deeply unpleasant authoritarian streak is a bug as opposed to a feature of the Labour Party (although I'm sure some will disagree with that). Anyway I want nothing further to do with them until or unless they acknowledge this and take steps towards tackling it.

SternJoyousBee · 24/04/2025 12:43

Datun · 24/04/2025 11:37

Ffs.

Lisa Nandy has said the reason she said rapists should go to women's prisons is because she didn't understand the law!

Not, no they shouldn't, obviously, but the law said they should.

And how does that explain her signing a pledge for to kick GC women out of the labour party for hate?

Honestly these people. For fuck's sake, come up with something better than this.

You cannot dress up 'I still agree with transactivists but my hands are tied', as anything other than that.

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/daily-mail/20250424/281741275275957?srsltid=AfmBOorjs3UpqW5RFkzy8qR5bJo-9TzNgegoVkT7XC4pY_PzjtUUKi8R

Edited

Thank you Datun - I have been waiting for her comments since the ruling.

SternJoyousBee · 24/04/2025 12:41

So she confused the legal fiction of the GRC with self-ID? Bollocks.

I really am coming around to the idea of intelligence tests for everyone standing for parliament.

Peony1897 · 24/04/2025 12:35

Datun · 24/04/2025 11:37

Ffs.

Lisa Nandy has said the reason she said rapists should go to women's prisons is because she didn't understand the law!

Not, no they shouldn't, obviously, but the law said they should.

And how does that explain her signing a pledge for to kick GC women out of the labour party for hate?

Honestly these people. For fuck's sake, come up with something better than this.

You cannot dress up 'I still agree with transactivists but my hands are tied', as anything other than that.

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/daily-mail/20250424/281741275275957?srsltid=AfmBOorjs3UpqW5RFkzy8qR5bJo-9TzNgegoVkT7XC4pY_PzjtUUKi8R

Edited

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Nice try Lisa.

She can fuck right off.

lcakethereforeIam · 24/04/2025 12:08

Some more receipts

https://thecritic.co.uk/labour-didnt-start-the-gender-madness/

Actually, this is a bothsides-ism that holds water! Pity he didn't wade in on the LD and the Greens, but they weren't in power and, as there's enough blame to go round to write a library of books, you have to draw a line somewhere.

Datun · 24/04/2025 11:37

Ffs.

Lisa Nandy has said the reason she said rapists should go to women's prisons is because she didn't understand the law!

Not, no they shouldn't, obviously, but the law said they should.

And how does that explain her signing a pledge for to kick GC women out of the labour party for hate?

Honestly these people. For fuck's sake, come up with something better than this.

You cannot dress up 'I still agree with transactivists but my hands are tied', as anything other than that.

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/daily-mail/20250424/281741275275957?srsltid=AfmBOorjs3UpqW5RFkzy8qR5bJo-9TzNgegoVkT7XC4pY_PzjtUUKi8R

SinnerBoy · 24/04/2025 01:17

Dawn's as honest as the day is long.

On the 23rd of December. In Svalbard.

Datun · 23/04/2025 23:56

And I don't believe a word Dawn Butler says. She talks absolute bollocks.

There are six and a half thousand genetic differences between men and women, Dawn, and guess which side lesbians fall on?

Hint, not the men's.

Datun · 23/04/2025 23:55

ArabellaScott · 23/04/2025 17:14

Edit: From today's Commons questions to the PM.

Wait til you hear this one! (excerpted to include only relevant to the SC judgement, it's quite a long exchange with a fair bit of tangential politicking):

Kemi Badenoch tells Starmer he hasn't got the balls:

Mrs Kemi Badenoch
(North West Essex) (Con)
...Does the Prime Minister now accept that when he said that it was the law that trans women were women, he was wrong?
...will he now apologise to the very brave hon. Member for Canterbury (Rosie Duffield) for hounding her out of the Labour party simply for telling the truth?
...There was no apology to the hon. Member for Canterbury. There is no taking of responsibility. The Prime Minister talks about political football; he practically kicked her out of his party—constructive dismissal. He talks about my predecessor. What about the abuse I faced from his MPs, who called me a transphobe for supporting what the Supreme Court has now clarified, to use his words? And where was he? He hid for six days without commenting on the Supreme Court judgment. Why did it take him so long to respond? Is it not because he was scared?
The Prime Minister
The only fiction here is the idea that the right hon. Member delivered anything in office. She held the post of Minister for Women and Equalities for two years, and she did precisely nothing. She provided no clarity on the law, and did nothing to improve women’s lives, which got materially worse under her watch. For example, the Opposition talk about hospitals and mixed-sex wards, up hill and down dale. What happened in the last decade? The use of mixed-sex wards in our NHS rose by 2,000%. ...
Mrs Badenoch
I will tell the Prime Minister what I did. I stopped the gender—[Interruption.] I will, I will. When his Labour leader in Scotland was whipping his MSPs to get male rapists into women’s prisons, I stopped that gender recognition Bill. I helped commission the Cass review. I replaced the guidance on single-sex toilets. I made sure that the puberty blockers issue was resolved, while he was sitting there cheering on the ideology that was taking away safe spaces. And when the Prime Minister stayed silent last week, presumably waiting to hear what Morgan McSweeney thinks, on his WhatsApp groups some of his closest Ministers were plotting to overturn the Supreme Court decision. Labour MP after Labour MP stood up yesterday and challenged the ruling. How can we take his Government seriously on this?
The Prime Minister
... His Labour Ministers called the chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission “appalling”. Baroness Falkner’s role is critical to enforcing the Court’s judgment. She has had to put up with relentless abuse, not just from his Front Bench but from activists and ideologues. Reappointing her would be a clear sign that he is taking this issue seriously, so will he commit to reappointing Baroness Falkner when her term expires this year?
The Prime Minister
I have always said that the debate should be conducted properly, on the principle. I have said it many, many times. I would remind the Leader of the Opposition that when they were in government, violence against women and girls reached record highs, rape prosecutions fell to record lows, and millions of women were left stuck on NHS waiting lists, unable to get the healthcare they needed. Under this Labour Government, NHS waiting lists are down by more than 200,000, and there are domestic abuse specialists in 999 control rooms. We strengthened access to maternity pay, something she called excessive....
Mrs Badenoch
The Prime Minister is clearly so uncomfortable talking about this subject. This is a choice between a Conservative party that stood up for common sense and a Labour party that bends the knee to every passing fad. This is a question about moral courage, and doing the right thing even when it is difficult. The truth is he doesn’t have the balls. The Prime Minister only tells people what they want to hear. He is a weathervane; he twists in the wind. He cheered an ideology that denied safe spaces to women and girls, because he thought it was cool to do so. He hounded a brave female MP out of his party for telling the truth he accepts now. And now, he is hiding behind the Supreme Court judgment. Is that not because he does not know what he actually believes?

Edited

Fucking A

Go Kemi. That's awesome.

TheOtherRaven · 23/04/2025 21:50

I honestly have no sympathy for all the boo hooing.

Women with trans identities will presumably just crack on with what they've been doing so far since it seems to have been working ok, no incidents such as have been regularly popping up with men in women's spaces.

Women being challenged? Well yes, that's more of the shit men handed us when they started invading women's spaces and women started to get suspicious and anxious. It's not exactly the end of the world to have to reassure another woman, and I've tended to find as soon as a woman with a trans identity smiles or speaks it becomes clear they're not male.

The whole men being terribly unsafe in male toilets and changing rooms - well I'm not cruel enough to say to anyone the things that the lobby and such men said to women when they were the ones trying to explain being afraid. NAMALT/ fetishing victim status/ if they're going to hurt you they'll do it anyway etc.... it's vile. I am however quite happy for men to have to do what they have made women do for years when using spaces they feel anxious about, which is to make risk assessments on the spot about whether they want to chance it, or go somewhere else, or manage without. That's been what women have done and been expected to get on with, and it's mens' turn to suck it up and get on with it now until third spaces are in place.

MarieDeGournay · 23/04/2025 21:31

Reading through a lot of the politicians' responses, I can't help thinking - wow, butch lesbians are really having their day in the sun, aren't they?
(I'd say our day in the sun but I've been told that I'm not as butch on the outside as I think I am😠 so I don't know if I'm butch enough for, say, Dawn Butler.. )

It looks like the new most marginalised groups are transmen and butch lesbians.

KnottyAuty · 23/04/2025 21:30

SameyMcNameChange · 23/04/2025 21:25

Anything from Jess Phillips yet? I can’t find anything and she was edging towards single sex spaces anyway so I am quite surprised.

Her twix account looks to have been unused since the “rape genocide apologist” comment from Elon Musk. Another reason to avoid that platform. Her Bluesky has a lot of posts from 1 month ago and one 16 days ago then nothing. Curious?

SameyMcNameChange · 23/04/2025 21:25

Anything from Jess Phillips yet? I can’t find anything and she was edging towards single sex spaces anyway so I am quite surprised.

EasternStandard · 23/04/2025 21:21

ArabellaScott · 23/04/2025 20:50

Yes, it was Dawn who set the rozzers on us.

Show quote history

The rozzers that was hilarious

Is she pretending now too that Labour meant something pro women all along

So much lying it’s hard to keep track

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 23/04/2025 21:08

murasaki · 23/04/2025 20:55

I'd forgotten the giraffes, that was hilarious.

Show quote history

Yes, but have the giraffes forgotten it?

what if they have been misidentified in their sexual orientation?

murasaki · 23/04/2025 20:55

UrsulasHerbBag · 23/04/2025 20:52

Dawn “most Giraffes are gay” Butler? Everything she says is complete true fact and never ever made up into a fantasy to suit her story. Not ever ever ever ever.

I'd forgotten the giraffes, that was hilarious.

UrsulasHerbBag · 23/04/2025 20:52

Dawn “most Giraffes are gay” Butler? Everything she says is complete true fact and never ever made up into a fantasy to suit her story. Not ever ever ever ever.

Original poster
ArabellaScott · 23/04/2025 20:50

EasternStandard · 23/04/2025 20:49

And that mumsnet should be reported to the police?

Which Labour MP was that I think it was her

Show quote history

Yes, it was Dawn who set the rozzers on us.

OP posts:
EasternStandard · 23/04/2025 20:49

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 23/04/2025 20:36

Isn't Dawn Butler the one who said that babies are born without a sex?

And that mumsnet should be reported to the police?

Which Labour MP was that I think it was her

SummerDaysOnTheWay · 23/04/2025 20:45

GCAcademic · 17/04/2025 11:17

Imagine expressing "disappointment" that the Supreme Court has clarified that women have rights and trans people have rights, and that one category doesn't supersede the other.

This!

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 23/04/2025 20:36

Isn't Dawn Butler the one who said that babies are born without a sex?

MarieDeGournay · 23/04/2025 20:30

I've just seen someone who I have since identified as Dawn Butler MP [I'm not British and can't recognise all your politicians by appearance] in a discussion on TV.

As well as the current Labour line - 'But we've always said we were committed to single sex spaces!', she ticked a variety of other bingo card boxes by saying that she has a butch lesbian friend... who is 'hounded out' of women's toilet's....
to such a serious extent that Ms Butler and friends have to accompany her into the women's toilet! ... and that's what's going to happen to transmen, thanks to th SC ruling.

Which is the least likely?

That DB has a butch lesbian friend - I nearly said 'suddenly has a convenient butch lesbian friend' but maybe they are old pals who go way back, I don't know.

That her butch lesbian friend gets 'hounded out' of women's toilet - note, not momentarily challenged, as has happened to me and many other gender-non-conforming women, but 'hounded out'.

That DB and her friends form a protective phalanx around the butch lesbian friend every time she needs to go to the toilet.

There was a bit of push-back by a Conservative (adviser not MP I think), but three-quarters of the way through DB's narrative, he just gave up and said something like 'Hmmmm, it IS very complicated isn't it?' and that was that.
Nobody challenged her with her own previous pronouncements on sex and gender, or on the unlikely elements of the butch lesbian story.

Is Dawn Butler the person who suggested that MN should be reported to the Met, resulting in the gem of a thread called
Everyone scarper, the rozzers are coming | Mumsnet

We owe her a debt of gratitude if that is the case because that was such a funny thread😂

Everyone scarper, the rozzers are coming | Mumsnet

Dawn Butler's called the polis on us! Quick everyone, namechange and look busy. [[https://twitter.com/DawnButlerBrent/status/1737853431413657806 htt...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4967923-everyone-scarper-the-rozzers-are-coming

OP posts:
Original poster
ArabellaScott · 23/04/2025 17:27

https://x.com/RosieDuffield1/status/1914727107294556204

This was after yesterday's speech, btw, but I think it's lovely to see two women standing together across the political divide, sticking up for each other.

'Thanks to
@KemiBadenoch
whose brilliant speech just now was the actual truth, not a new rewritten convenient version if it. She has been one of the most consistent supporters of feminists and women's sex-based rights, unlike any of those opposite now pretending to be.'

https://x.com/RosieDuffield1/status/1914727107294556204

OP posts:
Original poster
ArabellaScott · 23/04/2025 17:14

Edit: From today's Commons questions to the PM.

Wait til you hear this one! (excerpted to include only relevant to the SC judgement, it's quite a long exchange with a fair bit of tangential politicking):

Kemi Badenoch tells Starmer he hasn't got the balls:

Mrs Kemi Badenoch
(North West Essex) (Con)
...Does the Prime Minister now accept that when he said that it was the law that trans women were women, he was wrong?
...will he now apologise to the very brave hon. Member for Canterbury (Rosie Duffield) for hounding her out of the Labour party simply for telling the truth?
...There was no apology to the hon. Member for Canterbury. There is no taking of responsibility. The Prime Minister talks about political football; he practically kicked her out of his party—constructive dismissal. He talks about my predecessor. What about the abuse I faced from his MPs, who called me a transphobe for supporting what the Supreme Court has now clarified, to use his words? And where was he? He hid for six days without commenting on the Supreme Court judgment. Why did it take him so long to respond? Is it not because he was scared?
The Prime Minister
The only fiction here is the idea that the right hon. Member delivered anything in office. She held the post of Minister for Women and Equalities for two years, and she did precisely nothing. She provided no clarity on the law, and did nothing to improve women’s lives, which got materially worse under her watch. For example, the Opposition talk about hospitals and mixed-sex wards, up hill and down dale. What happened in the last decade? The use of mixed-sex wards in our NHS rose by 2,000%. ...
Mrs Badenoch
I will tell the Prime Minister what I did. I stopped the gender—[Interruption.] I will, I will. When his Labour leader in Scotland was whipping his MSPs to get male rapists into women’s prisons, I stopped that gender recognition Bill. I helped commission the Cass review. I replaced the guidance on single-sex toilets. I made sure that the puberty blockers issue was resolved, while he was sitting there cheering on the ideology that was taking away safe spaces. And when the Prime Minister stayed silent last week, presumably waiting to hear what Morgan McSweeney thinks, on his WhatsApp groups some of his closest Ministers were plotting to overturn the Supreme Court decision. Labour MP after Labour MP stood up yesterday and challenged the ruling. How can we take his Government seriously on this?
The Prime Minister
... His Labour Ministers called the chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission “appalling”. Baroness Falkner’s role is critical to enforcing the Court’s judgment. She has had to put up with relentless abuse, not just from his Front Bench but from activists and ideologues. Reappointing her would be a clear sign that he is taking this issue seriously, so will he commit to reappointing Baroness Falkner when her term expires this year?
The Prime Minister
I have always said that the debate should be conducted properly, on the principle. I have said it many, many times. I would remind the Leader of the Opposition that when they were in government, violence against women and girls reached record highs, rape prosecutions fell to record lows, and millions of women were left stuck on NHS waiting lists, unable to get the healthcare they needed. Under this Labour Government, NHS waiting lists are down by more than 200,000, and there are domestic abuse specialists in 999 control rooms. We strengthened access to maternity pay, something she called excessive....
Mrs Badenoch
The Prime Minister is clearly so uncomfortable talking about this subject. This is a choice between a Conservative party that stood up for common sense and a Labour party that bends the knee to every passing fad. This is a question about moral courage, and doing the right thing even when it is difficult. The truth is he doesn’t have the balls. The Prime Minister only tells people what they want to hear. He is a weathervane; he twists in the wind. He cheered an ideology that denied safe spaces to women and girls, because he thought it was cool to do so. He hounded a brave female MP out of his party for telling the truth he accepts now. And now, he is hiding behind the Supreme Court judgment. Is that not because he does not know what he actually believes?

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread