Ryan Grim: results of latest trans activism poll. A tweaked playbook for the US ?

[Helleofabore]

This is well worth watching. I will look for more information as to who commissioned and if the full results are published.

Basically, they have done a study on trans acceptance using different ‘messaging’ and methods that will win greatest acceptance.

Of course, one was very familiar - sneak the rights you want in with other legitimate reforms. Eg. Same sex marriage, conversion bills etc.

It is chilling to see the manipulation. It is propaganda and it is chilling.

The group behind it is the Transgender Law Center.

transgenderlawcenter.org/

It is worth noting that they mention in their report, apparently as I have not yet found it to read, that sneaking in reforms in with other law may backfire. That when people become aware of what happened, not only does this create distrust but that the opposition swells and those laws can be repealed.

The report apparently also says that opposition can spread ‘misinterpretation’ via media so it is best to keep a low profile (nothing new there). But yes, apparently we are all misinterpretating the reforms and they are not ill conceived or deleterious on rights for women or children in any way…

The original document has been archived here;
static1.squarespace.com/static/5fd0f29d0d626c5fb471be74/t/61b13d00236e2f7f2dbb9a36/1639005441624/Transgender+Youth+and+the+Freedom+to+Be+Ourselves.pdf

The document suggests talking about gender identity in place of sex, and infers that girls are not permitted to be competitive in sports. It describes competition as 'a zero sum game'. IMO, this is infantilising. (pages 9 and 10).

If they want an Open class, theres nothing stopping them for asking for that instead of destroying womens competition. Their own survey suggest they would get a lot of support .

Thank you inebriati. I shall go and peruse this.

We live in an age of mass manipulation.

I was interested to hear that sports is showing as the area where people are really seeing through gender identity ideology (my phrasing, not theirs). Lia Thomas may yet be the best gift ever & our side clearly needs to use that.

Also interesting that the attempts to shift the sports focus away from the individual to the team isn't working. I am in and from the UK and my impression of America and Americans is that the individual is important and that being the best & winning is what matters (Americans please correct me if I am wrong). This attitude doesn't sit well with 'hey, the team's what matters'.

At this point:

Ryan Grim reads about gender identity as a common place while he explicitly mentions the quotes around "biological sex" as though it's that that's the new and outlandish concept.

That was reflected in the "gender is determined by biological sex" question later on which was especially manipulative.

It's worth watching to the end when the other bloke Robby Soave acknowledges some of the realities in the real world and they then look disheartened while they talk about how the general public is beginning to resist the manipulation they've been subject to.

The bit that was most jaw dropping for me was when they explicitly said that direct arguments in favour of the trans sport issue weren’t working, so TRAS should use indirect arguments instead — linking trans rights to the civil rights movement, talking in vague platitudes about how we should all be free to be ourselves etc. It’s astonishing. They are actually admitting they are losing the argument, and so it has to be smuggled in a round about way.

Yes Wee. The manipulative nature of also using race is really eye opening too.

The manipulative nature of also using race is really eye opening too.

And jaw-dropping. These people really have no concept of honesty, or basic right and wrong! Not the slightest scruple about misappropriating the genuine horrors of racism. Just incredible.

Ryan's explanation and the actual document he read from are both illuminating. Truth and honesty seem to have no resonance here.

The bit that was most jaw dropping for me was when they explicitly said that direct arguments in favour of the trans sport issue weren’t working, so TRAS should use indirect arguments instead — linking trans rights to the civil rights movement, talking in vague platitudes about how we should all be free to be ourselves etc. It’s astonishing. They are actually admitting they are losing the argument, and so it has to be smuggled in a round about way.

I think this has been really striking for me too. Some idiot sports writer in the Guardian, presumably generally bothered about sporting fairness in important men's competitions, basically said that even if women's sport were to be completely dominated by MTF trans people and unfair to women, it would still be a net positive as the most oppressed group of people known to human history etc etc would be happy and have positive role models etc. Fuck women, who cares.

Placenarkingbto watch later

Marking even.

The presenters almost seem to get it. Not sure they do but at least they are discussing it. And that discussion is available to the public.

Some idiot sports writer in the Guardian, presumably generally bothered about sporting fairness in important men's competitions, basically said that even if women's sport were to be completely dominated by MTF trans people and unfair to women, it would still be a net positive as the most oppressed group of people known to human history etc etc would be happy and have positive role models etc. Fuck women, who cares.

That was Jonathan Liew, he was writing for the Independent at the time. He was subsequently named sportswriter of the year at the 2021 Sports Journalism Association awards.

I hope Sean Ingle has him on a short lease.

The recommendation for what to say regarding protecting vulnerable children is this:

Promoting the creation of a positive good (the freedom of self expression) is more effective than appeals to ameliorate harm (protecting transgender young people from violence and discrimi- nation). It generates support and trust from our base for transgender young people to know what is best for their own health and well-being.

It is heartbreaking to see the manipulation at the core here. The manufactured response concerning children’s welfare to progress an agenda that can be so readily seen as already leaving a trail of detransitioners in its wake. All grist for the mill apparently.

The report shows men's rights movements doing what they do best - appropriation.

You see this time after time, black lives matter? Not As much as black trans lives. Violence against women? Nothing compared to violence against trans women. Failing healthcare system? Time to prioritise experimental cosmetic surgery and hormones so kids can be their' true self'.

This report is professional, data led gaslighting.

What we, generally, want is fairness and that goes with openness. Those in the middle (soft left to soft right) will find this sort of secretive lobbying wont go down well. Sunlight on this area will show what Denton's (worth a read because this is where the secrecy comes from) has been advocating and how undemocratic it's all been. www.iglyo.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/IGLYO_v3-1.pdf

@hoodathunkit is probably all too familiar with what is happening here.

This is part of a sustained assault on democracy and whether people accept it or not it's pushing us on a road to thought totalism and general authoritarianism.

Absolutely hilarious clip about the US report. Also impressed they included the Denton's report for Europe.
It's so funny how the underhanded and manipulative methods used by the trans lobby spectacularly backfire. 😂😂😂
Sure, it works in the short to medium term but eventually ends up decreasing public acceptance. I've never come across a genuine civil rights movement where that happens, which says a lot about the gender identity brigade.
What geniuses came up with such winning strategies? 😂 And they still don't get it - endorsing further manipulation of racial issues and playing on people's sympathies and vulnerabilities. Pathetic. The losers that pop up on this board are also cut from the same cloth.

twitter.com/lnmackenzie1/status/1475517279634927617?s=21

This Twitter thread shows yet another deliberate manipulation by one of the UK trans groups to get males into Scottish prisons so other organisations would follow suit.

The encouraging thing is that if you watch the clip the public are having none of it.

This made my jaw drop:-

“Women’s sports have never existed on an equal playing field. For too long, we have devalued women’s sports, and we see this in the way that professional women athletes are underpaid compared to men and how transgender women athletes are targeted, attacked, and forced out of their sport. And instead of striving for equality in sports, certain politicians are distracting us from the real issue by blaming transgender women”

So they’re saying that because women’s sport has always been unequal it’s OK to make it even less fair by allowing males to compete? The total disregard for women, the absurdity of thinking that calling a male sex person ‘she’ means they can be treated as females in all circumstances. It’s a mens rights movement determined to take from women all rights they have spent decades fighting for.