Is there any future you'd accept for trans people?

[AYoungTransWoman]

Hello, I'm a young trans person who transitioned in my teens. I've been on hormones my entire adult life, have a GRC and will have Gender Reassignment Surgery imminently.

Is there any future you would accept for people like me who have gone through everything?

Okaaaaay. That kind of attitude isn’t going to help the world become a safer and more accepting place for everyone is it?

Of course men can be vulnerable!

Please direct that to those making the world unsafe. AKA - men.

If only there was a sure fire way of identifying the ‘vulnerable’ men from the ‘violent’ men eh🤣

What does "trying to be a boy" entail?

If you know a way to tell which ones are dangerous with a 100% success rate I would love to hear it

You can't change sex, it's impossible.

You can lop off/invert a penis, or fashion a 'penis' but the biological sex remains regardless of the butchery surgery

OP, I wish hope you have a good, happy and healthy future. I think you have challenges on all those fronts, but like most of the posters on here, I wish you well.

I feel sad though that you couldn't have stayed being a man, because the world needs a whole range of different kinds of men, it certainly doesn't need more of the toxic macho kind, and men like you, who don't identify with that kind of masculinity, have a lot to offer society.

You could have been a role model for little boys who don't go for the 'rats and snails and puppy dogs' tails' business, who do not want to grow up to be an Andrew Tate or a Conor McGregor, and who feel lost - they could have looked at you and seen a different way to be a man.

Strict gender stereotypes are so powerful that some people find it a better choice to change their bodies than to challenge the stereotypes. It's a shame, and can have huge consequences for people who chose to change their bodies.

Are you aware that it's not actually possible to 'change sex' and you remain biologically the sex you were born into? Good luck navigating a path through the difficulties that result from that.
Take care of yourself.

@AYoungTransWoman please can you answer this question. I have asked it (or variations of it) many times on this board, and so far no trans identified person or TRA has answered it. So you could be the first to actually show good faith and engage with the question.

A teenage biological female is in a car crash. Unfortunately she sustains serious injuries and needs intimate care (bed bath, wiping after using the bed pan, insertion of catheter, change of sanitary products, etc) while she recovers in hospital. She requests single-sex intimate care (from a biological female). Is this transphobic or anti-trans in your opinion? Or is it a perfectly reasonable request for a vulnerable individual to make?

If you are asking whether you will be able, to dress act and present as your idea of what a woman is without being hassled or discriminated against, the answer is probably yes for the most part, as long as you stay under the radar and don't make a huge great fuss about pronouns, misgendering, deadnames and so forth. However, if you are expecting everyone to unquestioningly agree that you are indeed a woman and accept you as a female in single-sex spaces, I'm afraid the answer is probably no. Sadly, you would have had a lot more chance of that happening before the trans activists started demonising every woman who wouldn't agree with their TWAW nonsense and threatening them with assault, rape and decapitation.

Is this another thread where the OP is on here to beseech us to be kind without clarifying whether they are respectful of the wishes of the majority of female people who don't want any male people in single sex spaces reserved for female people?

OP I wish you every happiness for the future, but I hope you respect women's wishes wrt keeping female spaces female only.

If you can do that then good luck to you.

Absolutely
Maybe we should allow men wearing eyeliner into the ladies loo just in case a bloke looks at them wrong in the mens?

Did you actually read my comment? What part of where I said "personally I don't mind" made you think I was trying to speak for anyone but myself? It's your kind of frothing at the mouth over the top overreaction to anything someone says that means we can't even have even the beginnings of a conversation about this topic. It's ridiculous, frankly.

What is being a boy to you as opposed to being a girl @AYoungTransWoman bexause my concern always is that fixing the outside isn’t going to fix the inside and the issues still exist but with irreversible pain and issues

becsuse you should be free to be whatever you want to me dress however you like be whoever you like without worrying about gender becuase that is a societal and cultural concept that changes over time and location.

biology however is fixed

@SevenCat
My point is that many don’t seem to be considering a transwoman’s concerns of using a men’s bathroom.

My point is that transwomen aren't considering the concerns women have about a man using the women's bathrooms.

Irrespective of how they feel, it is NOT and never will be their space.

It's a WOMAN'S space, why do we have to "be kind" at the discomfort to ourselves? I did ask the OP this question but they haven't answered. Why is a man's feelings more important than a sexual abuse victim's? Than the feelings of a lady who's religion or culture means they should not be sharing their space with a man? Than the feelings of ANY woman?! Male violence to a male person, however they present is a male problem. Why do I have to make myself uncomfortable to sort that out? Why as a woman do I have to make myself uncomfortable to sort out a man's problem? Why can't the men? I have never had a good answer to that. Maybe you can help?

Totally agree. Having someone "become" the other sex is obviously going to be a legal fiction, but we have lots of those (like, say, the one that says there's one day where a child becomes an adult). I'm ok with that fiction existing as long as the safety of actual women comes first. And a woman who's had a hysterectomy, taken some testosterone, grown a bit of facial hair and started calling herself Dave isn't a threat to anyone. The FTM people aren't sexually attacking men or going into men's sports and winning everything. It's the MTF ones who can be dangerous and whose presence in female spaces can erode women's rights. That's why I think if you're a man who wants to call himself a woman, you lose the dick first. That would probably cut down on the violent male criminals deciding they're women when they're going to prison, at least.

Social contagion has a lot to answer for, as has historical inaccuracies.

Can I ask you OP, have all of your mental health problems completely disappeared since you transitioned? I know you've said you're happier, but has transitioning solved all of the issues you were previously experiencing?

Also, can I ask, are you autistic or otherwise neurodivergent?

I think the very aggressive stance that some TRAs have taken has made women need to defend ourselves and our rights quite robustly. In reality, most women don't really care about trans-identified individuals - lots of us are very happy and willing to accept anyone living their life in a way that makes them happy. What we're not happy about is TW being nominated for "woman of the year" type awards, taking the sole allocated spot for women in male-dominated environments, and most importantly, TW in female-only spaces such as bathrooms, hospitals, prisons, etc. Trans-identifying individuals have been given far more care and concern than women have ever had, and the erosion of our language, our rights, and our spaces - all of which have been very hard-fought - are what we're so upset about.

The vast, vast majority of us wish trans-identifying individuals the very best. We would support you in fighting for third spaces and would be opposed to any discrimination, but in return we need to see our sex-based rights respected too - which they very rarely are. I'm not referring to you specifically OP as you seem open to third spaces and identifying as a trans woman rather than just "woman".

Women that insist trans-identifying males should be allowed into women's single sex spaces typically speak from a point of privilege, Emma Watson being the perfect example. Women who have been sexually assaulted, raped, or otherwise violated and abused by a man often have a different viewpoint - a viewpoint which is supposed to be protected by the law allowing single-sex spaces.

Hi @AYoungTransWoman

I don’t know what you want from us? But as a biological woman I’m tired. Wear whatever outfits you want but the trans community need to stop acting as if the idea of women wanting spaces to themselves is wrong.

the more the trans community do that, the more backlash. There is also growing resentment as they try and separate gender and sex and say it’s not the same. The trans ideology says that women are social constructs?

but if being a woman is a social construct, and sex isn’t the same as gender. Why do trans women get plastic surgery to mimic the biological expressions of a female body?

why do they get plastic surgery to get themselves a females intimate area? Why do they get boob jobs, vocal cord surgery etc. all of these things are formal markers of the female body.

If a woman’s biology isn’t what makes her a woman, why do they get feminisation surgery? Why do trans people get gender affirming care if gender and sex aren’t the same thing? Surely a dr created vagina can’t affirm their gender if they’re not the same thing?

I believe that even trans women know that that to be a woman is to be a biological woman.

wear what you want just as long as you don’t try and erase women

@SpidersAreShitheads I think Emma Watson is a pretty awful person and yes, obviously she’s very privileged, but she is unquestionably a victim of abuse by men.

Women’s rights in law to single sex spaces are not yours to give away dear.

Narrowmindedness?

On this thread, I have witnessed delusion, fantasy and non-fact/non-science based information, along with a hefty sprinkling of misogyny, so I suppose the misogyny could fall under the narrowmindedness umbrella, but I guess that's not what you're alluding to.

Please explain/give examples of said narrowmindedness.

There are lots of groups of men/boys that are not comfortable in certain male only spaces. You’ve fallen into the trap of thinking that trans identifying males are the most oppressed or suffering members of society when that is not the reality. I’ll bet that young boys experience a far more serious risk to their safety than a trans identifying male.

Funnily enough incidents of violence against trans identifying males are rare.

Can assure you none of the women here are making the world 'unsafe'.

If men are being dicks to each other, they are the ones who need to sort it out.

I don't think Andrew Tate et al are.likely to listen to the women of Mumsnet, tbh, no matter how nicely we ask them to stop being dicks.