NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #11

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although at the start of the second week getting everything done in this time period was looking less certain. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10

NC - so how is it you're able to cope with my questions, considerably more direct, without distress, or with commendable composure

BU - I was expecting it, not at the end of a 10 hour shift, facing a long drive home, going home to my family I happen to be an A*E doc, facing stressful situations require me to have an air of calm to be calm in face of hostility, drunk, rude, scared patients, all manner of instances, parents of dying children, I have to maintain composure at that. I'm tapping into that at moment. You can rest assured I'm deeply distressed and upset by this whole process.

'You can rest assured I'm deeply upset by this process' . Then a little smug smile.

Love how NC lets that hang.

The foot shakes when he is stressed.

You mean "no one has ever had the guts to challenge me, how very dare they?"

So, yesterday was the philosophical basis for his thoughts and actions. Earlier was the potential impact on patients. And now it's the fall-out of Christmas Eve and what went on in his interactions with colleagues etc.

"I am deeply upset by this whole process " 😄 said with the biggest grin I've ever seen.

Imagine if your child was dying and this chancer came in tilting his head and giving his breathiest voice, I can't bear the thought of it.

Absolutely

But but but - all the transphobia! I thought all these vulnerable trans people got hostile nastiness all the time!!!

I expect everyone else he's ever met thought he was a lady, or something.

SHE DIDN"T compare him to a rapist!! HE did that, in his own pretty little head!

And he can FUCK RIGHT OFF with his "I put my big girl pants on and went back into he women's changing room" HOW VERY BRAVE!

Ffs

Schrödinger's trans.

No-one knows he's not a woman, although he has faced people saying he's a man.

No-one has ever spoken to him like that, although he deals with rude aggressive people all the time.

He's scared of a nurse although as an a&e doctor he's professional, calm and collected.

NC - you met KS and we read her account of it in investigation. She says she didn't get email on Xmas morning, because it was XMas and she was off. Meeting on 29th, beth was distressed, had had crossover with SP at that time, that's a ref to flight to the plaster room?

BU - ask KS- ref to my general upset

NC - what you were upset aobut was that nothing had been done to punish nurse who dared to stand up tyou

BU -no, not interested in punishment, retriubution, or revenge. Interested in bassic respect and justice.

Absolutely.

The pedantic sophistry with language and the monologues really remind me of my controlling ex. It's quite something.

The point about him being a biological female because he's biological (not a robot) and identifies as female I find particularly tough. I suspect he's manipulating language not because he thinks he's actually biologically female, but because he wants to control the narrative such that there is no scope for women to define ourselves as a sex class.

Hahahahaha - I'm interested in basic respect and justice - FOR ME!! Justice for ME!!! Respect for ME!!! Validation for ME!!!!

All of this

He is very deliberate in his language, the big girl pants is designed to infuriate. He knows what he s doing.

I'm struck with how he's treating his own victim status compared to how he treat's the victim status of females, he said something about (they claim to be victims or words to that effect).

He gives himself a higher victim status than female rape victims.

Disgusting male entitlement right here on public display.

The pedantic sophistry with language and the monologues really remind me of my controlling ex. It's quite something.

I think a lot of us have known men like him.

'Transphobic hate' about a woman feeling vulnerable about having to change next to a 6ft tall bloke.

He's now escalated Peggie's reaction to, in his words, "transphobic hate".

NC - you were driivng home that you couldn't be expected to tolerate SP. Trying ot ensure managers took action?

BU -no, communicating distress and anxiety at experiencing transhpobic hate. Job requires trust and teamwork, couldn't trust someone who confronted collg in that manner, didn't ask for anyone to be punished

He did! "I didn't say she was a bigot"

He is very deliberate in his language, the big girl pants is designed to infuriate. He knows what he s doing.

Yes.