NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #8

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3

Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4

Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5

Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6

Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7

Before you even leave a building it's your first thought. Will I encounter any men, where will I likely encounter them and this often leads to us changing routes, just incase!

NC: As soon as you ID a person as female, risk assessment drops. If tehy're just female,you know nothign more about them, risk assessment plummets.

BU- it reduces. Don't know if plummets.

why is the judge slowing things down by writing everything down himself?
Is there no one is a court records/secretarial postion who takes notes?

DrU is doing an awful lot of eyelash fluttering while giving the court his thoughts on all the "gender bollocks".

God he's smug and pleased with himself

BU: Which one am I more afraid of, one who presents male or one who presents as female. Don't know. All about context.

These are very typically male responses he's giving.

He sounded slightly annoyed with NC just then!

His very speshul friends.

JR - this should be for the 1st respondent
NC - DU is a witness
J - I will allow the question
NC - I would suggest that that RA, as soon as you realise the other person is female, your RA plummets. Thats right isn't it?
DU Id say it reduces, not plummets. What you are saying is... it's all about context

If DU says no to this, it shows DUs maleness as all women know that the threat level drops when you realise its a woman walking behind you and not a man.

Lying. Trying to hide what one secretly knows to be true.

Yes NC, dignity!!

Parents, wife and other support humans

BU:
Risk assessment is reduced if person 'present's as female but not the only thing or the primary thing.

NC: Do yuou agree that for most women, also it's a matter of dignity?

BU: people have different feelings about privacy or dignity.It's far more complicated.

You can't agree with a woman's sense of risk cos you're a bloke, FFS. You will NEVER understand!

He is very aware of the fact he is being set traps.

How is he given such special treatment!

He's just completely given the lie to the idea that he's a woman. And if he had gone the other way, he'd have been agreeing that it was reasonable for people to be afraid of him. Clever of NC, she wins either way.

NC - leaving aside qs about risks and safety, wouldn't you agree that it's a matter of dignity
DU lots of people have their own ideas on this. It's far more complicated

'it reduces if they present female, but it's not the only . . .um'

Bit close there Dr Upton.

NC moving on from safety to privacy and dignity.

Asking if his male colleagues are a risk

NC: You didn't want to get changed in t he men's. Is that just about safety? Did you think your male colleagues would assault you?

BU: Primarilyu about safety.

Had a meeting first thing, in now!

"You'd have to ask them."

🤦🏻‍♀️