Imane Khelif not eligible to compete in boxing world championships 2025

[Lovelyview]

https://boxingnewsonline.net/iba-confirms-stance-on-imane-khelif-ahead-of-womens-boxing-world-championships/

The IBA is sticking with its rules and Khelif failed its 'gender eligibility tests'. The writer of the article shows remarkably little concern with saying what a 'gender eligibility test' involves and that it shows Khelif is male.

Oops, apologies if I misunderstood

It is sometimes hard Keating to know who is parodying and who is serious. But yes, Alison’s post was all parody.

On one hand I do like the Guardian; recently started to try out CNN, but they have these awful clickbait-y headlines - "Did the sun rise this morning? - see what happened" - nowadays which I do not remember from earlier.
BBC looks visually very messy, which hampers overview.
But whenever there is a topic about gender, I know that they will leave out important information. Politics news are easier for me to categorize and see what's missing because I've a good frame of reference.

I don't understand how they don't realize this is a reputational risk, and I agree about the sanctimonious tone on disinformation, while at the same time taking part in it. They still frame keeping children from unneccessary surgery or men out of women's sports as taking away trans rights, especially in all the articles about the US (I do understand the general politicial agenda behind that and discussed it in other threads, but I'm taking the win).

No word on women's rights or children's rights to grow up without harm.

This claim by Bach does not check out because there are so many other signs: the physical body, the strength, the behaviour of the trainer and coaches after the wins for example. The fact that the female opponent, no doubt highly trained, would rather lose than risk her life or lifelong health complications. Even without old photos or lab reports it's clear.

This was my point, and I suspect, Bach’s also. Russia amplified all the talking points via bot farms and obviously controls the IBA. Other boxing federations have Russians in their hierarchies.

However, yes, a clear independent test would clear this up.

There was no “Russian bot farm” stoking the gender wars 🙄. Two men were allowed to compete in women’s boxing at the Olympics, and a group of people raised concerns about it, one of whom happened to be Russian. That’s the extent of it. The only reason it became a massive bone of contention is because gender acolytes like Bach refuse to accept biological reality.

@NotBadConsidering @Philosophies

There is a lot of misinformation / intentional disinformation, definitely, and I agree that every potentially divisive topic is easy to broadcast and amplify through algorithms and programming.
But I would say both things can happen at the same time; people are aware of a problem and trolls and fake accounts diving in to rile up people.

The trolling is a problem for the genuine discussion because in the view of people critical of GC, both can appear mashed into one.
This is a similar phenomenon to the far right using GC views to gather followers and merge it with questionable theories and concepts like pro-natalism or nationalism (trying to force out everyone who is "different").

Thus, with Bach handwaving away the genuine and well-argued concerns together with the troll argument, he puts a shadow on the GC critics.

Yet strangely, despite all this “misinformation/ intentional disinformation” plenty of people have been able to determine reality.

It’s just infantilising nonsense, to blame failure of accepting of facts on “bots” when the rest of us have managed quite well enough.

More misinformation is that the IBA is Russian. It comprises 5 continental boxing confederations and has offices in Russia; originally, it was based in Switzerland.

We see plenty of evidence that the people who have been pushing genderism for 15 years or so, and the youngsters being suckered in by it, are bombarded with online messaging telling them it will make them rich and happy and famous, and feeding them sound bites and misinformation. We spend a considerable amount of time on here countering the same specious arguments from multiple posters.

Why is it 'infantilising' to assume that a lot of the not-very-deep-thinkers, and quite a few get-rich-quick characters, have been targetted online? Think of the way other non-stories suddenly explode - as I said, Irish history has had a few doozies over the last few years. It is a good way to sow disharmony, and disharmony is good for business.

I have found that people who are only superficially interested in the topics or who support male inclusion or seem to have some fascination with censuring FWR are the ones who resort to discussing bots and algorithms to discredit information . Are there bots, Russian or otherwise? Yes. Is the internet influenced by algorithms? Sure.

But I also find the people who post on FWR tend to be some of the most pedantic fact checkers, some individuals but certainly collectively. And the same with the people I read on Twitter. If someone does post misinformation by mistake, it is quickly picked up. FWR is a good filter for misinformation. I assume that places like the old Kiwi Farms are similar. But I have to admit to only visiting it to check it out and haven’t been back.

This whole ‘the Russians’ angle really took the cake though. It was like yelling ‘the bogeyman!’ and yet the IOC did it successfully and still do it. What is hilarious is that people have forgotten just how corrupt the IOC was and I would expect, still is. Including listening to ideologues in the attempt to appear liberal and progressive while not really being that at all when it comes to female sport.

Hence why anyone who does look at information critically to check if laughed when people really did try to say ‘But why would the IOC be spreading misinformation?’

And yet, here we are again with the ‘it’s the Russians!’ coming from the IOC and the media, and repeated here. It amounts to yelling ‘look over there’ as a distraction or discrediting exercise.

I always find it helpful to remember that we have evidence that the IOC has lied about this very issue previously. They insisted that Semenya was a woman with naturally high testosterone and then it all came out in court that Semenya is male with a male only DSD called 5-ARD.

So on that fact alone, we are right to doubt the truthfulness of anything the IOC says regarding these 'possible male in the female catagory' cases.

You’re conflating two different issues. There’s no doubt there are concerted efforts to sow discourse through online means.

But it’s infantilising to blame failure to acknowledge reality in the face of the presented evidence and ongoing denial of that reality of this particular story on actions of the “bots”. Maybe the “bots” stirred up nonsense before and during. But “bots” can’t be blamed for not coming to your senses just by looking at Khelif. People need to take responsibility for their own failures there.

It's weird how myth about Irish history have persisted, even recent history. I'm just reading Robert Fisk , In Time Of War about ww2 neutrality. Trains were running on turf yet people still think German U boats were popping up in Ireland to refuel with diesel. Melvyn Bragg casually repeated this on In Our Time once ffs. But we can't blame the Russians for everything? When I lived in London older ppl would say things like ' You Irish left the lights on so the Luftwaffe could attack us' !

A lot of the more bonkers misinformation comes from the USA also. The same people who started the Know Nothings and the KKK originally to intimidate Irish Catholics are now trying to use eg Famine victims to push white victimhood and divide people along racial lines.
But some of the funniest myths are New Age ppl. Apparently Ireland was a pagan feminist paradise in a sort of mist shrouded golden age. Then the horrible Roman empire invaded, killed all the lovely druids and forced us to become Christians. I often see variations on this theme online. Except the Romans never came to Ireland. They'd even left Britain before Patrick's time. On that note : Lá Fhéile Pádraig Sona Duit. ☘

I have no doubt Chinese and Russian agents, and other countries, use social media to stir up division in the west. Tiktok, probably the biggest pusher of gender ideology amongst the young, is Chinese.

Of course they do. Do you think it is relevant for this particular discussion? If so, can you explain how it would have been done please?

Are you blind? He is clearly a man.

It matters not what the topic is; the aim is to cause division. In this case by giving Bach confidence in his position and posting in support of IK to encourage the omnicause protesters.

So it gives Bach confidence? Based on falsity and he looks like a fool for repeating it?

I think the 'Russian bots' line is overlooking the fact that, as I always say, somebody on FWR knows everything - not only are we keen fact-checkers, but we also have a lot of sources of specialist knowledge.

It so happens I know a bit about amateur boxing, there were a few keen amateur boxers amongst my uncles, and although I don't agree with professional boxing, I keep an eye on amateur boxing, which is a popular sport in Ireland. And one where we are most likely to get an Olympic gold medal😄

So before the Lin/Khelif thing, I already knew about the IBA. I already knew about its corruption - which it admitted and allegedly has 'addressed' - and its financial links with Russia.
I already knew about the boxers who had beaten Khelif in the past - which was given as 'proof' that he didn't have an unfair advantage - and I was aware of the significance of the change of weight categories in a male and a female body - Khelif's extra kilos would have been in the form of bone density and muscles.

I gather from other posts at the time that I wasn't alone in having existing knowledge into which to set the Lin/Khelif issue, and we were able to acknowledge that the criticism of the IBA was completely valid, while at the same time seeing that there was objective evidence against Lin/Khelif.

We didn't need any help from Russian bots because we had our own store of information about the dogy goings-on in global amateur boxing.

It was never an IOC bad/IBA good split, and several of us who knew the background pointed this out at the time. The IBA was crooked; Lin and Khelif are not women. The two statements are equally true.

What gives Bach confidence to continue to assert lies is his breathtaking arrogance, and his stubborn pride that prevents him from admitting he is wrong. Nothing else.

I think he has said they won’t be allowed a visa if passport doesn’t match biological sex. I assume it’s a bit tricky to register as a female cyclist (or whatever) if your passport says you are male.

Surely you dont agree with Trump!!!! Something has gone badly wrong if so called feminists are agreeing with a misogynist/rapist

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Do you think everybody should renounce reality just because we happen to be aligned with Trump on a single issue?

We actually agree with sports legend, Democrat and lesbian Martina Navratilova who also thinks men shouldn't be allowed in women's sports.

This case is such a slam dunk I don’t need bots to brainwash me into thinking that IK is a man.

Photos of IK with other men make it crystal clear that this is a man and the other men know this. Carrying a woman on the shoulders of a man is something unthinkable. The world is multicultural enough for the average person in the West to know that Muslim men and women don’t behave like that in public. If IK was female they would have at most walked or stood side by side with big smiles like the royals when they are photographed.