No more puberty blockers for children from the NHS - reported in the Times!

[MrsOvertonsWindow]

This is massive - and long overdue

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/97ce2e81-2884-42f5-bb82-2a2778f2cc91?shareToken=9568e79f0683beea68ffe5e978b05a29

Is anything known about whether the foetus is affected?

I think so. I read in Sharon Davies book that some of the East German swimmers had children with conditions likely caused by testosterone use.

There have been papers about the developmental issues during pregnancy due to testosterone. I will see if I can find ones I have linked. Others may have access to others. I would certainly like to see others.

Well, glad to see the back of them, but this leaves a nasty taste

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/staff-promoted-puberty-blockers-gids-large-payouts-rjmcnpkqf

https://archive.ph/8N8Qk paywall!? We don't need no steenkin' paywall!

Wood's plans for her future reads like a threat! We need a public inquiry.

Testosterone is classified as a category D/X drug based on research by the companies who make it, indicating risk of fetal malformations. It is unlikely to ever be studied further given the ethical risks of a potential teratogenic drug being deliberately given in a trial.

https://www.drugs.com/pregnancy/testosterone.html

Of course, there should be no need for a female to be on testosterone during a pregnancy.

It was Sally Hines et al who argued that wanting healthy fetuses not exposed to the potential teratogenic effects of exogenous testosterone was akin to eugenics, in wanting to guarantee “healthy” babies:

Ultimately, we argue that in the context of lacking and uncertain medical evidence (HRT with testosterone during pregnancy and chest feeding) in a highly gendered treatment context (pregnancy and lactation care), both patients and providers tend to pursue precautionary, offspring-focused treatment approaches. These approaches reinscribe binarized notions of sex, resulting in social control in their attempts to safeguard against non-normative potential future outcomes for offspring. These offspring-focused risk-avoidance strategies and approaches are, we argue, part of the gendered precautionary labor of pregnancy and pregnancy care itself, and not without potentially-harmful consequences for trans people and society more broadly.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2667321523000811?via%3Dihub

Oh my! I actually agree with Freddy for once…

”healthcare providers have an absolute duty to provide accurate and unbiased information. Nothing should be allowed to blur those lines”

So that’ll be the end of medical and surgical transition then, eh, Fred?

“Dr Polly Carmichael, the outgoing director of Gids at the Tavistock and Portman NHS Trust, is understood to be in line for a payout of at least £80,000”

Are these redundancy payments? I thought PC was being moved to one of the new clinics. Good news if they are ditching her even if it does cost the tax payer ££££.

I believe the received wisdom from the political lobby was that to be concerned about TQ+ related health care's impact on an unborn child's health and life chances was ableist. Or something. Basically the important thing was the adult doing whatever they wanted and consequences to others being frantically sophistry-laden with spin as anyone minding being a bad person.

When you are listening to the beliefs and insights of someone who as a starting point is speaking from their belief that they have changed sex, and that reality is what they want it to be, there is very little point in looking for coherence, facts or sense in anything else they say.

I hope some of the succinct points made here about Freddie make their way to the Guardian's letters page.

The Guardian, just like the BBC, is very selective about what they allow women to speak about.

They seem to be these days, yes. Twas not ever thus.

It was Sally Hines et al who argued that wanting healthy fetuses not exposed to the potential teratogenic effects of exogenous testosterone was akin to eugenics, in wanting to guarantee “healthy” babies

That is effing sick! Every normal parent (or medical professional) wants any foetus to be as healthy as possible. This isn't advocating (say) selective abortion of children with disabilities - it's doing the best to prevent unnecessary iatrogenic disabilities occurring.

Those poor babies.

They shouldn't just be ditching these people - IMO they should be charging them. Let them justify their decisions in court.

I'll add as a genetically fucked person with a disability, if a parent tried to inform me that my pain, illness, all the many barriers to earning a living or doing anything else, plus the terror of a body disintegrating with years of living still left to find a way to navigate was a good thing, to 'reframe my trauma' and challenge my inner ableism because they did it to me in full knowledge of what they were dumping on me, because they needed all their choosy choices and desired experiences and all the waffle was to hand off having to take any responsibility about their own fantastic selfishness?

Actually I have no words. I have no idea how I'd handle that. I've watched my parents' distress for years about my disability, and it was no fault of theirs beyond that the genetic material involved turned out to be screwy.

I cannot envisage an adult sufficiently selfish to intentionally do this to a child, never mind messed up enough to try and frame it as a positive thing but children should emphatically be protected from them. The fundamental safeguarding requirement of a parent is 'capacity to put the child's interests ahead of their own'.

I suppose this could be a hopeful sign for Scotland

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scottish-health-bosses-met-expert-behind-ban-on-puberty-blockers-lq8nb2ks6

https://archive.ph/3CTka paywalls are the only things that should be blocked, tenuous links are 🙂

I think the article contains a link to Alex Massie's piece putting forward his thoughts on the Sandyford. Worth a read, if you want to get annoyed.

A news article from Northern Ireland on how events are progressing here - must admit I’m amazed that this has happened so quickly after the NHS England announcement:

https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/politics/health-minister-confirms-ni-puberty-blocker-ban-alliance-call-it-very-very-damaging-4556622

The Alliance party, like the Lib Dems in GB, have received financial support from Ferring the pharmaceutical company (don’t know if it’s still ongoing), the party has also tried to appeal to younger and middle-class voters by embracing woke politics in recent years. As for Sinn Féin, Mary Lou McDonald (party leader) has a brother who is trans-identified and the party has been supporting woke policies North and South of the border in recent years in an attempt to rebrand from their previous less 'kindly' image. SDLP are also a middle-class 'just be nice' party these days too.

The politicians of N Ireland are not giving the issue of protecting women, children and LGB people any serious investigation or thought, they’ve largely split along ideological and social class lines on these issues like the parties in Westminster.

Oh for fucking fucks sake.

This has elements of the post office scandal - except worse. These people should be behind bars, not being given £80k payouts! How much treatment for the children whose healthy bodies they've destroyed would this pay for?

It's so unbelievably outrageous.

I hear you @Froodwithatowel

"both patients and providers tend to pursue precautionary, offspring-focused treatment approaches"

I know other posters have already responded eloquently to this, but I can't believe Sally Hines et al had the gall to write this in a scientific journal.

To reword it: "both patients and doctors tend not to want to harm unborn babies". No shit Sherlock.

I note she's written 'offspring', rather than 'baby' or 'child'.

Well, you have to dehumanize the infant that you are advocating potential harm too.

Yep what a read

funnily enough she tweeted about children but has argued about why it makes more sense to change it to young people instead

Cropped the photo too short!

She wants to give children cross sex hormones? What the fuck is wrong with her?

Wiki tells me Sally Hines is the daughter of Barry Hines, who wrote the book Kes is based on.