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Original poster

Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 5

1000 replies

ickky · 13/10/2023 16:35

Started on 2nd October at Watford Employment Tribunal (Radius House, 51 Clarendon Rd, Watford WD17 1HP 01923 281750)

You may attend in person or remote viewing has been quite limited but you can request log in details from

Email [email protected]

Header should read

URGENT CURRENT CASE - Public Access Request - J Phoenix - The Open University - 3322700/2021

Ask for access link and pin and please give your name and address in the email as they check when you connect to the tribunal.

The clerk will ask you (in a private remote room) to put your camera on to verify, this involves looking at you, but no ID is needed. You may turn off your camera after this pointless and unnecessary process.

Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R

OU Departments & Networks:

HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
IF - Prof Ian Fribbance Dean of FASS
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far - tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Prof Jo Phoenix Witness Statement (scroll to bottom of page and download)

https://jophoenix.substack.com/p/phoenix-v-open-university?sd=pf

Thread 1 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

Thread 2 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

Thread 3 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4917480-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-3

Thread 4 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4918479-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-4

OP posts:
Thread gallery
20
nauticant · 16/10/2023 16:03

HBC is on Radio 4 right now with one of her remarkable tales of courage.

Original poster
ickky · 16/10/2023 16:04

It's back

OP posts:
chilling19 · 16/10/2023 16:04

We are back!

OP posts:
Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:04

We're back and HBC still sighing. A lot. Don't know what at.

Oh, it's the q of whether this is personal c JP

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:05

HBC: I have seen JP do transphobic things, like SMinds podcast

Original poster
ickky · 16/10/2023 16:05

I have seen JP be transphobic ie savage minds etc.

OP posts:
Original poster
ickky · 16/10/2023 16:05

She sits there and laughs along

OP posts:
LarkLane · 16/10/2023 16:06

Jo says nothing transphobic on Savage Minds FFS. Fucking FACT.

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:06

BC: Perfectly okay in podcast, nothing transphobic

HBC: But she sits and laughs along with presenter, eg re suck female cock.

BC: But SW says lesbians transphobic if dont' sleep with TW

HBC: Don't agree that is SW position

LarkLane · 16/10/2023 16:06

I may be a tad annoyed in my earlier post.

JoIsBraverThanIAm · 16/10/2023 16:07

Witness: I don't understand that to be the position of Stonewall (that lesbians who systematically don't want sex with transwomen are transphobic). Nobody remember Some Women Have Penises Get Over It, then?

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:07

HBC: those are your words not mine

BC: actually those are your words from your WS

HBC: okay

[we've been here before]

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:13

Panel asks c a name and HBC says it's one of the OU LGBT organisations.

[How many do they have, one wonders? How many GC ones?]

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:16

Panel: you thought some lang (= female cock) inappropriate.

HBC: podcast was c JP experiences at Essex and how SW had changed.

Panel: what was wrong in what was said.

HBC: It was the way...I took it as laughing at t and SW...I thought people would find it upsetting and it was not sensitive esp as media so hostile to t and nb. I was appalled by the lack of sensitivity shown. I was v shocked by ti.

Ameanstreakamilewide · 16/10/2023 16:28

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:07

HBC: those are your words not mine

BC: actually those are your words from your WS

HBC: okay

[we've been here before]

Edited

😂

RethinkingLife · 16/10/2023 18:26

nauticant · 16/10/2023 16:03

HBC is on Radio 4 right now with one of her remarkable tales of courage.

In what capacity and what was the topic? Was it live recording as part of a piece for something like Woman's Hour or a rebroadcast of something else?

RethinkingLife · 16/10/2023 18:38

I think it was a reference to the real HBC, not the tribunal version
Real HBC presented this

Thank you, that looks inspirational.

Is it foolish that I was a little hoping that tribunal HBC had done something truly admirable that would help me to see her in a more rounded fashion that I have from the tribunal performance?

maltravers · 16/10/2023 19:17

Mmmnotsure · 16/10/2023 16:16

Panel: you thought some lang (= female cock) inappropriate.

HBC: podcast was c JP experiences at Essex and how SW had changed.

Panel: what was wrong in what was said.

HBC: It was the way...I took it as laughing at t and SW...I thought people would find it upsetting and it was not sensitive esp as media so hostile to t and nb. I was appalled by the lack of sensitivity shown. I was v shocked by ti.

It wasn’t what she said it was the way she said it m’lud. Mind your tone Jo P! Do they even hear themselves…?

nauticant · 16/10/2023 19:51

I do apologise for my mischief @RethinkingLifeI'd been amused by the HBC confusion earlier and couldn't resist when the other HBC coincidentally appeared on the radio.

That episode was particularly good in a series of very good programmes.

IcakethereforeIam · 16/10/2023 19:58

Oops, I read it as HBO 😜

WFTCHTJ · 17/10/2023 02:00

Waiting for the Conference Host to join...

WFTCHTJ · 17/10/2023 02:01

Waiting for the Conference Host to join...

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