Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 5

[ickky]

Started on 2nd October at Watford Employment Tribunal (Radius House, 51 Clarendon Rd, Watford WD17 1HP 01923 281750)

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Header should read

URGENT CURRENT CASE - Public Access Request - J Phoenix - The Open University - 3322700/2021

Ask for access link and pin and please give your name and address in the email as they check when you connect to the tribunal.

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Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R

OU Departments & Networks:

HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
IF - Prof Ian Fribbance Dean of FASS
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far - tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Prof Jo Phoenix Witness Statement (scroll to bottom of page and download)

https://jophoenix.substack.com/p/phoenix-v-open-university?sd=pf

Thread 1 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

Thread 2 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

Thread 3 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4917480-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-3

Thread 4 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4918479-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-4

I so wish we could see the body language close up.

That is surely significant given we've had lots of witnesses who say they didn't write it and now she's admitted she knows at least some of the people who wrote it

BC: reads, you say you don't sign stuff you don't agree with

HBC: agrees with and stands by open letter in its entirety

Out of all the liars from the OU, she is the worst

In fairness, I think if you work on a google doc or similar, you might well be focusing on the words and not on who's changing them. I can actually believe that two years later, if you had deleted the records long since, you might not be able to remember who from your large social circle of people - all of whom agreed with you - was actually involved. Working on a document with a group of people all remote is not like sitting in a room with them, when you'd remember who was there.

HBC -On the drafting, it might have been a zoom call, a video call,I can't remember.

I mean they are just lying by omission at this point. The judge / panel cannot possibly believe this person doesn't know who she drafted an open letter with.

Worst as in the most blatant or worst as in unable to dissemble effectively?

BC: statement published to world

HBC: not aimed at the world

BC: didn't say aimed. Published. Put on the internet for everyone to see

Both!

You can ask to decline to answer a question on the basis that the truthful answer is an admission that you are guilty of a crime.

You can't decline to answer a question because it would implicate someone else in a crime, or weaken your own case.

BC getting tetchy

BC: you assumed everyone would retweet it to the world.
HBC: yes [possibly less of a liar than some of the others, actually]

@JoIsBraverThanIAm but such an important document and they were all so frightened at the time - you'd remember!

I think HBC seems to be finding this much tougher - which I suspect means she is at heart a more honest person than some of the others. Or she's not very bright and it is easier to trip her up

These lot need the Umbridge treatment, I Must Not Tell Lies.

HBC: it's c GCRN and asking OU to take action.

BC: so when you said to interview panel I'm not trying to do anything to the GCRN that's not true. Trying to get it removed from the OU

HBC: trying to get it not to have any institutional platform

Sighing is her tell. When Ben asks her a question that is awkward for her, the sigh tells you she's in the wrong before she speaks.

OMG, she openly admits tweeting ‘how not to get caught’ but that’s ok, because she no longer uses the term ‘terf’

Meeting finished early and unmuted in time to hear Ben telling the witness she was dissembling. I'm not sure she's doing big sighs, I think she's a heavy breather/breathing too near the microphone.

Same as LD, considering the hurt to trans and NB staff, and no consideration to WOMEN or to the members of the GCRN.

Is her accent becoming more pronounced under stress?

I have never heard such commitment from employees about holding up their employers brand.

So she has no problem with GC research in one answer and then in the next days the OU shouldn't support GC research. So which is it?

All that solidarity, they must as rigid as a breeze block.

What a god damn liar she is.

This is what you get when management don't manage properly = a rabble who think they know better than anyone else.