Green Party thread 3

[FermatsTheorem]

Previous thread here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3347925-Green-Party-statement-continuation-thread?pg=40

Will post links to AC's public statement and Caroline Lucas's appalling white wash job in a moment, but for me, Andrew Gilligan nails it yet again:
twitter.com/mragilligan/status/1034776005326581767

I have faced many calls for immediate action against Aimee – calls that fail to understand the very limited powers I have as a party co-leader and that assume I would be prepared to ditch the fundamental right to due process and a fair hearing. ( www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/look-future-aimee-challenor-trans-green-party-caroline-lucas )

Really?

www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/05/11/green-party-suspends-former-parliamentary-candidate-after-transphobic-heckling-on-channel-4/

Caroline Lucas article in the Guardian.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/look-future-aimee-challenor-trans-green-party-caroline-lucas?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Otherclicky

Let me try to spell this out slowly and carefully for you Caroline, in case you are reading this.

This is not about AC being trans (though I happen to believe AC's agressive stance on trans rights, and more specifically their "terf-blocker" software are threats to women's rights).

This is about whether AC's claim not to have known about the charges against their father's until very recently holds water. In particular, did they know and choose to withhold the information at the point at which they appointed DC their election agent?

Did AC know and choose to ignore the consequences of this information at the point at which they were drawing up legislation in support of self ID which directly conflicted with professional advice on best practice in child safeguarding?

Did AC know and not consider it relevant at the time at which they and their father were jointly developing the "terf-blocker" list, which silenced women voicing precisely these worries about the conflict between self-ID and child safeguarding?

Given that (a) AC lived in the same house as DC, and one would have thought normal police practice in investigating an extremely serious crime would be to interview all members of the household, and (b) AC was a trustee of Coventry Pride, and the board of trustees was informed of the charges hanging over DC way back in November 2016, it seems a tad implausible to think that "very recently" actually means very recently as opposed to "nearly two years ago."

I just caught the end of the last thread, but I'll repost in case people have come straight over here:

Those images of children playing with BDSM toys etc were posted on AC's blog in 2015, I believe, as a satirical anti-gun meme (i.e. If they are there, children will play with them). Given what was going on in the Challoner household at that time though, it's difficult to see it as anything other than trolling. The implication too that it's basically inevitable children will come across sex toys at home has an almost Savilian whiff of 'hiding in plain sight'.

Not impressed by that article at all. Not expecting a full and detailed report from the Greens into the Challenor debacle. Something more like Shami Chakrabati's report into Labour anti-semitism, i.e. a whitewash.

Re the weird advert thing posted on Twitter - it comes from three years ago and seems to have been a US advert to do with trying to get more gun controls. Very dubious way to go about that, but gun control is not really a live issue in the UK in the same way as the US, so why would AC be using that advert over here? Incredibly tone deaf (at best) to use an advert like that if it was after the police started questioning DC.

I would need a lot of convincing that AC knew nothing about the police enquiries right back when they first started questioning DC and TC. This is a family broadcasting its entire life through social media with frequent forays into mainstream media. They lived in a tiny house with minimal privacy possible. AC was either living there or nearby after the age of 16. Given that the victim stated that the crimes took place in that house, of course the police would have questioned everybody who lived in that house at the time of the alleged offences. That is highly likely to have included AC. Even during the time AC was in care it looks as if AC was in frequent contact with the rest of the family.

Checking on.

Am fuming about the CL article.

So many comments in there to be disproven.

Condemning the silencing of women yet failing to not AC wrote one of them silencing 50k women.

CL making it about AC being trans by holding them to a different standard.

Saying she has limited power but look at how quickly Olivia was suspended then banned from the party.

No evidence that self id would be used by predatory men - not looking very hard them love....

The party is not budging on TWAW and TMAM.

Truly, the Green Party is the political wing of Stonewall

Won't be able to save the planet while it's on another planet.

Caroline doesn't want to see the problem...

...if she does all her values fall apart.

Don't underestimate this as a force. The shattering of what you feel important. Many people will never do it no matter what they are confronted with because doing so requires you to look at the dark side of life.

The party is not budging on TWAW and TMAM

And women are non-men....

The implication too that it's basically inevitable children will come across sex toys at home has an almost Savilian whiff of 'hiding in plain sight’

Yes! That articulates perfectly why it made me feel so uncomfortable

It's just gobsmacking. Utterly gobsmacking.

After reading that CL piece. I have one question

What does ac have on CL to make her lie openly and publicly about so many things?

I don't think it's dirt. Honesty.

I think CL just does not want to face up to reality. She's in full on self denial.

I'm at that CL article. Just tone deaf! Thanks for starting new thread FermatsTheorem, it's so important that we keep discussing this stuff. I've been out today so looks like there's lots to catch up on. As ever...

And meanwhile Jonathan Bartley is continuing to pretend none of this is happening, Jenny Jones is 'muting haters' and calling people trolls and Amelia Womack is busy begging for votes. What an absolute shower the senior Greens are.

"No one will ever call her to account in front of her voters"

Well, she's the sole MP of a no-hope party, who is about the only representative they have had who can walk and chew gum at the same time. So once she retires, that's it for Green MPs. If the people of her constituency want to elect an irrelevant not-even-single-issue MP that's their problem, but at a national level the Greens are a joke and a complete irrelevance.

The only effect this will have is that idiots who vote Green as a protest vote to send a signal to the Labour PM (rather like the American Greens who voted for Nader to send a signal to the incoming President Gore, a strategy that rather failed) will have to square themselves with voting for a party which is openly supportive of rapist members whom it claims they can't control. But the Tories aren't going to push that point, because the more people who vote Green the better from their point of view (there are no Green/Tory swing voters, after all, so it's just taking votes from Labour) and Labour won't because their own engagement with TRAs is equally shabby.

I particularly dislike the sleight of hand Caroline uses to imply that it's the trans activists who are subject to bomb threats and violence.

I suppose we should thank Caroline Lucas for reinvigorating the discussion just as we were coming to the end of a second thread.

How interesting that it's in the Guardian when they took so long to run the original story.

To repeat something I wrote on the other thread, I notice Lucas is no longer claiming that The Green Party were unaware of the charges against the child rapist and torturer, David Challenor - this was when were using his home as local HQ and making use of his services as an election agent and party activist.

I would really like the Green Party to clarify whether they are now withdrawing that claim, because if they did know then that is quite astonishing.

The Green Party has a very iffy history going back over 40 years now. Not just this stuff.

There was someone on the other thread, I'm too lazy to wade through it again so please excuse me, who seemed to know about how Uk politics work on a national level. Could that person please pm me as I have an idea.

I am utterly disgusted with CL and the Green Party. I've emailed the Green Party with a number of queries but they have yet to reply.

I joined the Green Party because I saw Caroline Lucas as one of the very few MPs with personal integrity, a voice of reason. I left the Greens after their IWD non-men tweet this year, and I'd only stayed in that long because of Caroline, I really thought she could see through this nonsense. To say I'm disappointed would be a huge understatement. Shame on you, Caroline Lucas.

I joined the Green Party because I saw Caroline Lucas as one of the very few MPs with personal integrity,

Elected politician. Personal Integrity. Pick one.

How interesting that it's in the Guardian when they took so long to run the original story.

Isn't it.

Just like when the Guardian avoided reporting Cologne for days and then the first thing they published was Gaby Hinsliff 's "they were lucky enough to have smartphones" victim blaming.

Exactly right Bitoffun

To not report fully the case revolving an horrendous child sexual rape and torture abuse BECAUSE one of the children of the paeophile and torturer David Challenor is trans is dereliction of duty at best within the media.

That Guardian article by Lucas has made things worse.

What is going on?