Caitlyn Jenner

[Terfinator]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4398858/Caitlyn-Jenner-underwent-gender-reassignment-surgery.html

(Yes, it's the DM - because it's one of the only news sources which is balanced on the trans issue)

Saint Caitlyn has a book coming out in which she reveals that she HAS had gender reassessment surgery. I think a few people on here thought that they hadn't.

Anyway, the DM have some interesting pictures which show how trans surgery works.

As always, the comments are very telling... Fair play to the DM for keeping them open!

Or put in simpler terms by transwoman Miranda Yardley

then trans people "clocked my privilege"

Oh FFS.

Well we know exactly where you're coming from now don't we, charming. Physical violence. Fuck off.

You know where I'm coming from? Physical violence? What do you mean?!

trans people "clocked my privilege

Somebody born female is not more privileged than someone born male.

I am biologically male and was raised and socialised as a male which by definition means that I am more privileged than all the women posting here.

The fact I have gender dysphoria and am trans is irrelevant.

Well, that is just the language that I've become accustomed to. I said I wouldn't use it again. I still don't see why anybody would refer to my trans woman friend as he and him. I'm seriously shocked that nobody in here doesn't see that as a problem?!

Don't be fucking disingenuous, you posted a link, directly to me, depicting physical violence. You are abusive.

CharlieSierra, you have been so rude to me and joyless in this thread that I tried to lighten the mood by using a gif that me and my friends use all the time on FB Messenger and WhatsApp.

I am not abusive in anyway. I've never abused anyone. You don't know me. Thank you very much.

BigDeskBob, if we're getting hypothetical, I do not believe that anyone like Danielle is going to be registered and going to a University and joining a society like that.

Well, there was transwoman Anna Lee, who ran for NUS Women's Officer. Anna also identifies as a woman and is different from Danielle in that Anna...wears dresses and a wig. The trouble with rejecting Danielle Muscato's identification as a woman but accepting more feminine-looking transwomen is that it's essentially saying that all there really is to being a woman is performing femininity to an acceptable standard.

I find 'cis' and your statement that women as a class have 'privilege' about as offensive as you find my standpoint on pronouns (which you'll note I avoided in the paragraph above, out of courtesy). For what it's worth, I refer to the trans people I know in RL in the way that they'd prefer, but I do consider it a matter of courtesy and politeness, not something I'm obligated to do for everyone or that is 'literally violent' if I don't (which you haven't said, but some TRAs have).

Well I found it abusive and threatening. I fail to see how a depiction of a physical attack could be interpreted as lightening the mood by any sane person.

CharlieSierra, it a sister hitting her sister with a handbag jokingly. There was no intention of violence. I was trying to reach out to you.

While others have been quite nice and understanding to me in this thread, you have constantly tried to goad me and put words in my mouth. The tone of all your posts has been passive aggressive and hostile towards me.

"if we're getting hypothetical, I do not believe that anyone like Danielle is going to be registered and going to a University and joining a society like that."

True, he's too busy shacked up in a women shelter.

Phyllis I can see you are genuinely hurt. But do try and think critically instead of emotionally.

Your friend isn't here. You won't show them this thread. No actual harm has been done. But I am sorry that I hurt your feelings.

The point about referring to biological males as men is that it names the problem. If your friend was here I would refer to them as she. I'm not in the business of hurting people's feelings. Particilarly genuine transsexuals. But when I say genuine transsexual, I mean the same definition as curry. A person born a man, who remains a man that 'lives as a woman'. It doesn't mean they are actually a woman.

Women are oppressed by their biology. Gender roles (sex role stereotypes) are what enforces that.

If women cannot talk about structural oppression meaning men oppressing women because women now include men, feminism will die immediately.

Calling people by their biological sex is not done to be impolite or hurtful, but if you don't name the sexes and the reason why gender roles are damaging to women, the problem cannot be discussed, ever.

It's Kim and Khloe Karcrashian (which I guess is topical given the thread title).

phyllis

A lot of people would find that gif triggering. Many people come on here to find support for domestic violence. You need to be more aware.

I would love to know what this so called "cis" privilege that I apparently have is supposed to be.

Is my privilege growing up in a world where being sexually harassed is just a normal every day occurrence? Where wold whistling and cat calling is just a bit of banter and I should just lighten up and be grateful?

What about fear of rape and sexual assault? What about growing up hearing that it's my fault if something happens to me and if I don't take enough precautions and end up being raped then I am somehow partially responsible?

What about pregnancy and the risk of getting pregnant and all the risks that comes with?

How about being constantly told from an early age that I shouldn't do certain things and be in certain places in case I get raped? That I shouldn't be out alone after dark otherwise it's my fault if I'm assaulted?

How about my sexual availability being judged by what I'm wearing?

What about learning from an early age that I need to put others before myself and step aside, put up and shut up?

You're right, this whole cis privilege I have is great

Can someone who was born male relate to those experiences? Can a transwoman really relate to them?

Perhaps Curry can answer that question.

I can completely understand the threat of losing feminism, especially when we had such movements as the suffragettes. I won't say privileged, but I guess I've lived a very fortunate life where I was able to go to school, college & university without anything getting in my way. I never experienced sexual harassment till I was clubbing at University, and I never felt that I was disadvantaged by my gender in anyway until I worked in full time professional employment.

I just want to make sure that minorities are protected, especially when I feel like I've gone on a journey from childhood up until now where I've faced any prejudices that I may have previously had.

Learning from an early age that the way I look is the most important thing. My value and my worth being judged entirely on my weight and my looks. My weight being focused on constantly.

Learning from an early age that I need to be polite and passive. To be quiet, not speak out and not offend.

How many men and transwomen can relate?

Please tell me more about all this cis privilage that I have

I wasn't aware of physical violence being triggering on this board. I apologise. I would never have seen that gif in that way, especially as Kim is moving in a jovial manner and Khloe is sat down smiling. And yes, that's the reason I used it, because we're in this thread!

AVirginLitTheCandle, it is terminology that I'm used to using with my LGBT friends. It wasn't supposed to spark that sort of debate. I'm not completely blind to my own gender. I didn't mean it in an offensive way and I won't use it again on here. Thank you.

What are the worst things about being a woman? Do you think a transwomen and a woman would give the same answer to that question?

To me the worst things about being a woman are periods, risking of pregnancy, fear of being raped and sexually assaulted, sexual harassment...

How many transwomen can relate to these things?

Caitlyn Jenner thinks the worst thing about being a woman is deciding what to wear. Says it all really.

I have to hand it to the trans activists though. They have actually managed to convince people that girls and women are somehow more privileged than boys and men.

Bravo.

I did see that clip from the ABC 2020 interview. I'll say what I've said before, Caitlyn is on a journey and she needs to learn. She'll get better, but I don't think she'll reach where she needs to be by the time she passes on. I don't see someone that was a rich white republican man for 65 years changing into any gold standard for the trans community.

I don't see someone that was a rich white republican man for 65 years

Exactly. She lived as a man for 60 odd years and enjoyed all the privileges that came with being male.

She has no fucking clue what it's like to be a woman and no fucking clue what it's like to go through life as a girl/woman.