The Dating Thread 58 - will you swoon in June? 🌸🌼🌸

[Nosdacariad]

The Rules:
-The first rule about the dating thread is don't talk about it with people you're dating
-Develop a thick skin
-Do not invest emotionally too soon
-It’s all BS until it actually happens
-Trust your gut instinct
-People vanishing, lying & being generally weird is not your fault
-Know your worth
-If it's not fun, stop
-Loo update is mandatory
-No dating the thread
-Treat others as you'd like to be treated
-Any relationship you have that could get ruined by having a conversation about your feelings, standards and/or expectations wasn't really stable enough to begin with
-The things you choose to ignore/ tolerate now are the reasons you will break up in the future

• If you're wondering if you're being too picky/should give another chance after the second chance/should try harder - the answer is invariably NO! You're not and you shouldn't. If this, now, is as good as it's going to get, the A game, then do you want what comes next?!

-OLD can get very time consuming. Keep doing other activities you enjoy Optional: Please give your irons (potential dates you are talking to) nicknames like Mr Scottish. Initials are allowed (Mr S) when you are an item*

I’ve had a hard time with all 3 of mine pinning them down to a date. I wonder if part of the problem is some women expecting men to pay? It could be an expensive past time for them.

I wonder if you are right - and for that reason I always mention, as soon as the idea of meeting comes up - that I am thinking of our local Wetherspoons as a good venue.

(It has other advantages too, even though I am not a fan of the chain in general - it's massive so it's always possible to find somewhere to sit - has a big garden - it's convenient for me to get to - and it has parking if the guy is planning to drive).

I don't expect the guy to pay but I know a lot prefer to, and I admit I do find it nice if they do.

I am no gold digger but I am looking for a guy who is affluent enough to be able to pay his way on the occasional meal out, cinema trip etc - so if a couple of rounds at Wetherspoons is beyond his budget then it's unlikely to work anyway - I don't mean to sound like an entitled cow and I do have every sympathy for those who find themselves in straightened circumstances - but I have bankrolled fellas before and it's not a situation I want to find myself in again, if I can help it. (Obviously circumstances can change, and if I was in a committed relationship with someone who suddenly found himself redundant for example that would be different - but I don't want to start out with the expectation that I'm the one paying for everything! Been there, done that....)

I empathise - sex is really important to me too - but I found that when my profile hinted at that, I was attracting guys who purely wanted no strings fun - my position is that I want lots of good sex, but I want it with someone who respects and likes me as a person, and who I also get on with outside the bedroom too.

I guess I am lucky in that I have a couple of guys in my life currently I have strong sexual connection with, who are more than happy to be FWB. So I don't have to go without sex if I don't want to. They don't fully meet my needs, because knowing that they have similar relationships with other women to be honest leaves me a bit hollow. The sex is fun at the time, but doesn't give lasting satisfaction in the way sex with someone I loved would (I hope). But still, I suppose it takes the edge off, and at least makes me less likely to leap blindly into a red flag situation because my libido is in the driving seat. (A mistake I have made more times than I care to think of in the past.... )

@duckingclueless @Ilovelurchers Do people generally go on expensive first dates though? Usually my first dates have always been coffee, or other drinks. The guy would usually insist on paying but we’re talking of a budget of £10-20.

I do wonder if guys enjoy the connection and flirtation with someone, feeling wanted for a bit, while knowing that after meeting, there’s more than a 50% chance this will all end?

Having said that, I’m solvent and like to do things in my day-to-day life, so I would like to date a guy that can at the very least join me occasionally. I do a lot of things alone (like theatre, day trips etc) and the idea of having a partner would be that they join in 😉

@Ilovelurchers Yes, same! So saying ‘I want lots of nice sex’ probably won’t get the results we want 😆 I also don’t really enjoy sex when I don’t really like the person.

Out of interest, how are these guys able to attract several women for FWB? Mr RedFlagParade was never short of female attention in that way either and he was honest about it. I could continue seeing him on that basis as he still checks in regularly and hints at that, but frankly he actually seems stretched thin between all the ladies!

It’s just that most men struggle to attract even one woman for a relationship, so it amuses me that some men can attract several women where the tin clearly says ‘this is just sex’. Are they a little undateable in terms of an IRL but easy on the eye?

Well I went against advice and moved to WhatsApp with Mr Cyclist a couple of weeks ago and we’ve been chatting a lot but now we’ve actually been talking about getting a date in the diary he’s gone quiet. Lesson learned that I should listen to the good people on the Dating Thread!

I am talking to a couple of others but very early days and have another date pencilled in next weekend. Still annoying when someone who seemed quite nice and normal abruptly disappears though.

I found Hinge better than bumble - I had three options of the post-match prompt things ( a range of questions from normal to slightly absurd, to give men different options) on bumble, and still men wouldn’t say anything. It was super frustrating. Hinge I found men more wanted to engage. I never paid a subscription though so it was difficult to sift through likes.

I was chatting to a younger guy about it. He suggested a restaurant. She said she wasn’t comfortable with that and suggested a much more expensive place. Even those cheaper meals add up. If I met someone IRL and he asked to take me out I’d accept. But some blank random? I do appreciate them offering though.

Hmmm, interesting. I feel like it's some American social media driven trend... Like 'I don't accept coffee dates, because it shows he is not investing in you!'

To which I'd respond, well of course he shouldn't be investing in you, you're both just trying to get to know one another... At which point does this require a monetary deposit?

Interesting point about how these guys do it....

Of my two potential FWB, I would say both are well above average in terms of intelligence, also quite quirky and alternative. Both very good looking, and unusual looking. (One for example is dual heritage, and has really unusual, striking features and an unusual and lovely skin tone).

Also, in both cases, they are very open to sexual relationships with a wife range of women, not just conventionally pretty ones. Including women who are a lot bigger (I don't mean to be sizist - I myself think a lot of bigger women are beautiful - but it's a sad fact that they aren't always regarded like this in our society). And women who are considerably older than them too.

I remember speaking to one of them about it - he said it's extremely rare for him to meet a woman he doesn't see beauty and attraction in. It's a kind of talent, I guess....

And both of them are extremely good at sex - creative, incentive, unselfish..... So I can see why women go back for more!

Though they both often seem to end up in situations where women feel disappointed in them/upset by them, so though they both claim to be open with all of their lovers about the fact it won't lead to anything serious (and they certainly have been with me!) I wonder if that message is always transmitted quite as clearly as it needs to be.....

@Ilovelurchers Yes that makes total sense! That’s Mr RedFlagParade all over. He’s lovely, just not relationship material. But very easy on the eye. I’m not sure what his attraction range is but he keeps saying he prefers older women.

Do you think these men want a relationship or are they happy as things are?

Oh, this happens to me a lot. SO annoying.

How long since you last heard from him?

Just remember, better to find out now than a month down the line, if he isn't really serious about dating.....

Speaking of which, Cars is still chatting away but no mention of what evening he is free - I will give him till tonight then try to pin him down again. Not ideal to be doing the chasing on this, I know.....

Nothing since Thursday when he said he was looking forward to meeting me! We’ve been chatting every day so it feels like a change and he’s been online a lot too so not like he’s too busy. You’re right though that it’s better if the flaky ones reveal themselves sooner rather than later.

Are you getting the impression that Mr Cars is being deliberately evasive on the matter or is just not reading the signs?

Good that you have FWB x 2 to fall back on. I don’t and have no idea how to get one!

So I had my first ever OLD date last week, had been chatting for a week, met for a drink but I didn't really feel a spark. Chat has gone a bit quiet since so I'm presuming the feeling was mutual.

Matched with someone last night & he's suggested meeting for a coffee but I'm already regretting saying yes as the messaging is pretty boring lol.

Like pp have said above it does seem like it's going to be a challenge to find that initial spark via OLD...

Both of mine are exes - one from a proper relationship, the other just someone I met once for a date, didn't sleep with him at the time but kept in touch as Facebook friends even though we both then met people we pursued relationships with. Reconnected when we both became single for some no strings fun.

But that's never really been enough for me. Ideally I want a monogamous relationship with someone where there is also mutual love.

Seems hard to find, though....

You are right. I guess statistically, most of us are only attracted to a smallish percentage of people, so it's probably to be expected that we are likely to have more dates that don't lead to anything, than those that do.

This time round I have so far been on 5 dates. One kiss, but he only wanted ENM, which I decided wasn't for me. We did meet once afterwards as friends and might again, but I am not interested in sex with him.

Of the other four, there were two who wanted to date me again but I didn't want to, one who never contactede afterwards tho I would have seen him again, and one who revealed afterwards he was only interested in pursuing a certain kink (not for me).

This is on maybe 6 weeks back on the apps?

I reckon my experience is pretty standard for a woman my age (47, work full time, single mom of a teenager).

I'm similar age and situation as you. Only 1 week into OLD so will see how it goes but my expectations are pretty low which is probably for the best.
Last time I "dated" was someone I already knew earlier this year...were seeing each other multiple times a week for 3 months, I went completely all in & was left quite upset & disappointed when it ended. It's been so helpful reading everyone's experiences on here, be it good or bad & everyone seems really supportive of one another.

I reported the irritation and I hope @empirebiscuits12 you're ok.

So, ✈️🛩🛬 still has sexual difficulties. I think the use of SSRIs causes these in some men.
5 weeks in and he is pretty much unemployed and trying to get his landlady to be dishonest about his rent to get extra UC.

It is so depressing thinking about going back to the drawing board.

I like that Mr EU guys. I think I may have another! I am yet to check my Hinge messages today, thought I'd come on here first 😂Thank you for the welcome!

I just had a healthy relationship (maybe the first of my life) and it really raised the bar for me, but more in terms of my time I think. By which I mean I give my time more when the guys are healthy. If they're insecure etc then I might carry on dating them, but just see them once every 4-6weeks... So I still get the positives without getting dragged into the negatives - they can do that the rest of the time 😂

I'm going with both - it's cultural AND he's crazy about me 😂
I'm getting a bit less keen on him - he said in chats that he and his last gf ended because she had 2 children and didn't have the time to commit to their relationship, even though he was in love with her. Which I found odd really. Didn't ring true - that might have been a factor, but not the deciding factor and I guess it's easier telling yourself this, or believing it when someone else tells you. Truth would have been closer to the fact that she didn't like him enough, I don't know maybe I'm splitting hairs. I just don't like it when people are clearly kidding themselves.
I read some great relationship advice which was instead of looking for the person, look for the relationship. Are you both looking for the same relationship? Or can you live with the relationship that the other person wants? So perhaps that's it, they were looking for different relationships... but if he doesn't have that realisation then just stay silent on the matter, I didn't ask and have no interest.

I really agree. I (47yrs) have already had several loves of my life and expect to have more 😂

I believe in the 'ones' and not in the 'one'.

A friend shared a quote with me, which I loved from a poet called David Whyte

“the ultimate touchstone of friendship is not improvement, neither of the self nor of the other, the ultimate touchstone is witness, the privilege of having been seen by someone and the equal privilege of being granted the sight of the essence of another, to have walked with them and to have believed in them, and sometimes just to have accompanied them for however brief a span, on a journey impossible to accomplish alone.”

@b0zza1 Ohhh, that’s a beautiful quote, I really like that. It also makes me think that even some of my failed relationships in the past, still had value - they just didn’t last for whatever reason.

I think your point about finding someone who wants the same relationship as you is really insightful. So much of the time we focus on the person. All the people I’ve had relationships with have been quite different from one another. What they had in common was a mutual want of some sort.

No need to apologise for a man's behaviour! Or maybe apoligising for your doing your best in the face of that behaviour. It has made me think it would be good to be able to report this kind of thing - I joined the thread only in the last few days and his comments were SO unwelcome. Perhaps we agree to report early and just police the tone collectively by doing this - we don't need to wait for it to become inappropriate, or cross a line.... I think I might do this... so that Mumsnet can make it's mind up, as it were....

@ElleintheWoods@Ilovelurchers I think you’ve both hit the nail on the head. I posted a while back about how Mr Charismatic featured on my local “Are we dating the same guy?” Facebook page and it turned out he’s been extremely busy. I suspect he’s calmed things down at least a little, but I did wonder how on earth he managed to find so many women he even wanted to sleep with. I struggle to find even one man.

So I do think there’s an element of these guys being more open about who they sleep with. In Mr Charismatic’s case he also lives up to his name. He’s an excellent conversationalist, really knows how to treat women to make them feel looked after and desired. Very attractive, great job, knows his way around in the bedroom. He’s also incredibly independent (as am I) which is why I think he’s still single at 47 and will likely remain so.

This is good to hear. I don't know why I'm such a fan of this, but additionally and again recommend pausing your account now if you're on Hinge. It means you can carry on chatting to folks you are already matched with and continue to match with people who have already 'liked' you. I don't know about other apps. If the app allows you to do it, maybe try it for a week and so how it feels.

I think I like it cos I can get overwhelmed with the feeling of an endless stream and so pausing my account helps me break it up into chunks.

I would say that I also recommend chatting to quite large numbers of peeps at the same time. I don't message all of them everyday and I'm clear that I won't be doing that but it gives them a chance to chat and it gives me space to not feel I have to get back when I'm not in the mood. It's really interesting to notice how I can be SO keen about one person and then not so much a few days later and then really keen about someone else 😂

Sorry to hear that. Is it worthwhile carrying on?