Decision made

[adorably2014]

I posted here in June. I can't seem to be able to link to my old thread. After a summer of ups and downs I have decided I don't want to be married to my husband anymore. He has no idea and now the children are at school again I have more time to plan.

My fear is that because what is happening is always in private, how can I possibly document all this and be believed in the divorce courts? For example this summer he had bought me two really expensive pieces of jewellery which he presented to me in front of the children as a kind of I love you gift, only for 5 days later to do the stuff that has made me decide to leave. So he will easily seem like the wronged man with a gold digger wife. I am also concerned what to say to the children when a split is initiated. I don't want them to know exactly as it would be too awful for them but then again is it going to be possible to protect from everything? I also worry that if I talk about what has been going on then my H could potentially be in trouble which I don't want, selfishly I just don't want to have to live with it anymore.

For the moment I am focusing on my course and work experience where I asked if there was possible paid employment. My boss said they were very busy and would probably have two projects I could help with in October and be paid for. I hope it materialises. In the meantime I am putting as much money as possible into my own account. My H has not got access to it but knows the account details. Is it OK do you think or should I set sth he knows nothing about. For choosing a solicitor is it best to take a WA solicitor or one of my own? I reckon my H will get someone really good and expensive so I need to make sure I have someone very very good.

I tried to find a counsellor before the school holidays but it wasn't that easy. I also found that talking about all the stuff in a way made me freeze and reflect so much that I couldn't act if that makes sense. I think when things are over I will then hopefully find the space to talk ... So for now I am trying to get on with practical stuff like following advice on getting paperwork together before contacting solicitors. My H has loads of paperwork. I know because I sometimes do his filing. There are share certificates, pension stuff etc... Do I need to copy everything? If so,does it need to be recent or can I take copies now even if I don't start anything in 6 months' time.

Sorry I sound like such a cold calculating b here. I am mostly terrified of putting the children through such an upheaval but then I keep reminding myself our eldest saw something was wrong with me during the holiday and didn't really believe the explanation that 'mummy is tired'.

Anyway apart from my few questions not sure entirely why I am posting, for support I guess and to update on previous thread after this long gap.

Lovely you could have worked on that marriage for the next fifty years and he'd still have been a manipulative abusive selfish monster. You'd have been a nervous wreck who was frightened of even breathing in case it annoyed him, and your kids would have been trained into thinking that's what love looks like, so you'd have had to watch in horror as they replicated your marriage in their relationships.

He was always going to mess about with money, it's the only power he has left, but the court will see through it and it won't do him any favours. Given the way he behaves, court was always the only option - he is not going to be reasonable, so unless you don't have a choice or it will look better for your case (your solicitor will tell you) don't waste any time with mediation if you don't have to. Just get it all over and done with so the three of you can get on with your lives in peace.

You are absolutely not weak, you have definitely not chosen the easy route - standing up to bullies is never easy - and although at the moment there will be days when you question what you have had to do, I promise if you read this thread and your other thread in the future you will not regret it. You will be thinking "thank god I got out".

Take care of yourself darling, you are much in my thoughts .

I have to run to town, but I just want to say that your parents are idiots!!!

If I was your mother (and between you, me, and the fence post, I'm old enough to be) I would be so proud of you, so proud to have a daughter like you!

Hope all is going along peacefully for you, Adorably.

Acrossthepond thanks for asking about me, l don't know what to say, or where to start, things are not so good really. I had a complete meltdown over half term last week. I had sorted childcare on the days my course was running but didn't manage to go. This week I am feeling a bit better but I'm playing catch up on what I missed in addition to doing the project work as lots of deadlines are coming up in March-April, and there was the placement as well.

The legal side of the divorce is not moving fast at all. After lots of threats over defending but not actually filing anything, that's now been done so there's a hearing scheduled for that. He's basically objecting to divorce per se, which I'm told he stands no chance of succeeding with and in fact could very well antagonise the judge, but he is allowed to try so he is. It's making everything much more stressful though.

It's emotionally I fell apart last week. A friend (the one whose husband used to be friends with h) thought the divorce was because of what he gets up to while he's abroad which I had in fact no idea about. I just don't know what to think anymore, I feel completely sick at the thought of just everything to do with my life with him.

He's also made contact when he isn't supposed to, in a charm offensive kind of way. Let's work through this, I know I'm a nightmare to live with but if we go to couple counselling we can make this work. I am prepared to go, we mustn't give up. I got some flowers (anonymous) and I guess it must have been him and I've had quite a few emails. He is on 'nice' phase, which is meaningless because in one of the emails I get berated for getting the children to go to breakfast club instead of using a nanny. The (pretty efficient) PO who I originally had contact with has left and her replacement is not so helpful with things like this, or maybe I'm doing something wrong. I suppose it's not mega urgent because there is no threat to my person. It's been over 2 months now that I haven't spoken to him or anything, and despite the guilt I haven't budged, you would think he would get the message.

Oh you poor poor thing. You are getting loads of really good advice on here, which I'm not really qualified to give, but I do think all your instincts have been proven right, you're so totally doing the right thing for you and your DCs, and just try to keep on lovely. If he's being an asshole (whether through unsolicited and criminal charm offensives) or through psychological shite, that only proves how very right you are to get the hell out. But I'm so sorry about the other, 'away from home', stuff, no matter how determined you are to change things, having more crap chucked into the mix messes with your mind regardless.

And you're bloody not doing anything wrong wrt the PO! If you're not getting responses, get angry with them. You have orders in place, and you have them for a damn good reason! They're not granted as a sop willy-nilly.

He's not going to get the message because he's not interested in your pov. I'm sure he's still confident of his ability to talk you round. And if that doesn't work apparently he thinks he's just going forbid you from divorcing him!

It's very interesting they he's straight out objecting to divorce. I've never heard of someone do that and it's a mark of his arrogance, effrontery and complete failure to grasp what is actually happening. I wonder if that was why he parted company with his previous solicitors because they warned him it was a bad move? It sort of confirms an abusive mindset frankly, it's not going to do him any favours at all.

I don't know, apparently it can be a delaying tactic to do that initially. He apologises for doing that in an email to me and says it's in my own interest that he does that. He's gone completely mad, honestly. It took a long time for things to be filed. I think his first solicitor was more like a friend of a friend maybe hired as emergency measure.

Ah right.

In your own interest? I agree he has gone completely round the twist.

Oh dear, sounds as if his 'secrets' are now coming out of the woodwork. I can't say that I'm surprised. Just be glad you got away before you learnt 'what he gets up to'. At this point I think I'd probably tell anyone else that wants to unload that "Unless it will help me with the divorce or finances, I don't want to know now what I didn't find out then.". There's really no points and you already have enough reasons for divorce.

My dear, an emotional breakdown was sort of inevitable, I think. You've been carrying on so bravely and dealing with it all on your own. You aren't superhuman, nor an automaton. But now you can just pick up the pieces, take a deep breath, and move forward. You are very strong, you know. You WILL get through this. It's hard to see it now, but time always moves forward and we move with it.

As far as his contacting you, if it''s in violation of court orders, report it to the police (if that's the correct thing to do) or to your solicitor. Is there anyone, anyone at all, who can read his emails before you see them? Can you try to 'edit' them visually? Skip paragraphs the moment you see anything personal. Try to skim them over rapidly, not focusing completely until you see anything regarding the children then just read that part? If it's phone calls, you need to say ONCE "We are only supposed to discuss the children. If you continue to try to have a personal conversation I will hang up the phone." Then do it.

Again, this WILL pass and you WILL have a happy life. YOU WILL!!!

OP I have read your whole postings since last year and it makes for massively uncomfortable reading. I am so, so glad that you have broken free - in fact I am rather proud of you for staying strong. As much as you don't feel it, it takes strength to do what you are doing/what you have done.

I am saddened that your parents are letting you down in this way. What woud happen if you were to tell your Mother what things happened to you? Should any daughter of mine tell me what your have told us, I'd feel
Hard pressed to not do him physical harm myself. Certainly not to tell you that you are a disappointment - I am angry on your behalf.

Across I think my friend genuinely thought I knew and that it was the reason why he was not living with us, I don't think she was being gossipy though probably curious. She's realised I didn't know and was mortified. She didn't know about the orders, I've told her now, though not exactly why, and she's phoned me and texted me since. She's asked if there's anything her and her husband can do to help. I think she means it. She's the only one who was in touch early in the next year. She knows through her husband who used to work with H and went on some work trips abroad with him. I have no idea of the extent of anything at all. I don't want to know really but it twists the knife in too many ways. In my head it's all mixed up with the fact there was no shortage of sex at home and then him pestering or forcing me when I didn't want. Plus the fact that I just never suspected anything, he always rang us lots, and in some ways sometimes I thought he was a bit too obsessed with me. It must have meant fuck all. I feel very used, that's for sure, and there are plenty of unanswered questions. I do think something in him changed about 2 years ago, but I don't know why. It's like all the worse bits of him got nastier and more marked.

Regarding him making contact. No I shouldn't be reading the emails, I know I shouldn't. But he shouldn't be sending them in the first place. But it's quite hard (I feel) to get through to the new PO person. My solicitor could write but it would also cost more. It's also quite low level stuff although yes, it's manipulative, I can see that. I'm not giving up but in a way I feel I have bigger fish to fry at the moment than fighting this. Sorry if it sounds like a pointless moan.

Hexbramble thanks and sorry, I don't mean to upset people. And no I will not tell my mother the exact state of affairs. I know what she would say if I did. It's sad, but she just won't get it. I envy those who have nice mothers, though, but that's not going to happen.

Adorably please don't apologise. This is a safe place to vent and please continue doing so. You will slowly come to realise, if you haven't already done so, that you have lived through too much trauma. Those feelings need 'dumping' so to speak, so that you don't carry them into your new life.

I think he's a sex addict. Just as an alcoholic craves liquor, he craves sex. He's a sick man. And none of what HE is reflects on who YOU are.

You know, when you say you have bigger fish to fry, it doesn't sound at all like a moan. Actually, it sounds like a person who is getting stronger. Something that bothers you now doesn't bring you to your knees. It annoys and is upsetting, but you can look past it to what is important to YOU. Good for you. Eventually those emails will stop bothering you and you'll just shake your head and think "What an idiot to think he could drag me back into that mess!".

No, I didn't mean that your friend was gossiping, I can see where she'd think you knew. I just meant that there are probably things that others know that you didn't. I think we all know 'certain things' about our married friends that we don't necessarily share with them because we don't want to rock their marital boat or because our husband's have sworn us to secrecy. If they split up….well I guess we feel that it's OK to 'share'. To tell the truth, I know something about my BFF's now XH that my DH told me. I still have never told her, I figured she already had enough reason to kick him to the kerb without what I knew so why add to her pain.

there was no shortage of sex at home and then him pestering or forcing me when I didn't want

The coercive sex was not because he wanted the pleasure of sex but because he wanted to pleasure of you being forced/raped. Sorry OP.

Hello lovely, I don't have any sage advice as do pp, just wanted to send strength and warm thoughts and for you, you're doing so well in such awful situation, try to remember that when it feels like you're drowning with it all xx

Thanks Adara

Across By bigger fish to fry I don't mean just what he writes in his emails but also how to deal with the system when it's not efficient or feels terribly unfair. Maybe I meant I was having to pick my battles and save my energy.

His being 'nice' is completely surreal anyway when he instructs solicitors to make the divorce process as difficult as possible. The angry emails frightened me a lot more because of their personal nature. There's something completely incongruous about the 'nice' emails. I've seen the phrase 'master of the universe' on other threads. It's exactly that. Patronising and completely out of touch with how my life is. I think maybe because now that there won't be any charges brought against him he thinks nothing happened, it's all brushed under the carpet again, and I will see sense?

I paid for some counselling last week as I felt I was going out of my mind at times, same woman I saw last year for a few sessions. After some convincing from her in the end I phoned Rape Crisis after and spoke to someone, and I am going to be getting counselling and more advice through them. I hope it will help. I feel I've been pretty crap at accessing talking support. Part of me finds it very difficult to admit to myself that maybe it wasn't just selfishness and anger on his part. If I can money wise I think I will try to go every fortnight to see the private counsellor from last year to get support about the divorce itself and leave the rest to RC. It's all so messy. I so need to be ok so I can look after the children, finish the course and get a proper job so I don't have to rely so much on him.

Sounds like he's playing 'Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde' with his emails. You just need to remember that they are another tool he's using to control and frighten you into doing what he wants. A way to keep you wrong-footed. Don't think for a moment that he doesn't get a perverse pleasure out of seeing you frightened or upset. He does. His past behaviour proves that he enjoys it. Just keep telling yourself that it's not a reflection of you, it's a reflection of him.

I'm glad you are going to do counseling. Even if you concentrate the counseling on what you need right now (to get through the legalities) that will also help you to deal with what happened in the past.

Is he not being prosecuted because the police believe there isn't a case or because you decided you just don't want to deal with the fallout? I'm NOT asking for an answer! Just think about it. If it's because you have decided not to, then you need to let him know that you can always change your mind. And he's always thought 'nothing happened' because he doesn't believe what he did was wrong. He just now thinks he's not going to get in trouble for 'nothing'. If it's because the police won't take the case, well, then, you'll just have to move on.

This won't last forever. The wheels of justice may grind slowly, but they do grind. Take every day on its own.

More positive thoughts your way OP.
please remember to screen shot and save everything, no matter how pleasant or unpleasant.

Thanks
Acrossthepond the thing is thankfully I haven't seen him at all since the day he came along to the drop off with his sister in the car. So he can't know how upset I get or not really, I suppose he assumes maybe. I know he is trying to get information through the children because that must be how he knows about the breakfast club and other things that's come out in emails. One of his best friends' girlfriend who I used to meet up with fairly often had been completely quiet since Dec but contacted me last week. She wanted to meet up for lunch and somehow I wonder whether that might be something he's encouraged.

I want absolutely nothing to do with him now. Nothing. I found out by accident (baggage tag) a few weeks ago that he had lied to me about his autumn trip (he went somewhere different from what he'd told us), and now to know he's been picking up women and basically potentially putting my health at risk as well. Complete betrayal. I feel like such a complete mug really, like the way I said nothing with the way he talked to me sometimes at the end of last year and everything else - just so so disgusting. I'm totally heartbroken she's told me but in a way I prefer to know because it makes me feel less soft towards him and less guilty. It sounds bad, but it's true. Yes I hope the 2 different counselling are going to be ok, I need to talk but I hope it's not going to be too much. Quite difficult to know what to do for the best really.

I feel quite anxious about this weekend. The children are going to mother in law overnight over the weekend. It's only their first time overnight away since Christmas time as H has only ever had them daytime. And dc2 keeps asking if I can go with them. The house is going to feel so empty.

I'm really sorry about the foreign shenanigans OP. I guessed as much on the first thread, I remember suggesting it. I feel bad that I didn't take more time to help you get your head round it then, so you wouldn't have had such a shock now.

It's awful to say it but have you had full STI tests?

I think you're doing really well with your counselling, I don't think you've been crap at all. You were very clear earlier in the thread that you couldn't cope with it on top of everything else that was going on, which is entirely understandable. Now you feel you need it so you're accessing it. That's all good. I really hope you find it useful in coming to terms with everything. I have to say I really admire your strength, I think you're dealing with all this amazingly well.

Adorably, he knows you. He knows what and how to upset you. He doesn't have to see you to know he's 'getting to you'. The good thing is that time does pass and as it does he will be able to 'get to you' less and less. Soon his stupid emails will do no more than make you roll your eyes at his attempts to either intimidate you or try and lure you back in. You are beyond his powers of persuasion. He just doesn't know it yet. The main thing is that, no matter how you feel inside, you never let him see it. Either you don't respond at all or if you must, you respond with an 'aggrieved air' as if he's nothing more than a bothersome mosquito buzzing around annoying you. Fake it til you make it.

Counseling will be a big help, but it's a small step by step 'adventure'. And you are NOT NOT NOT a mug! You are a lovely young woman who has been taken terrible advantage of by an unscrupulous bastard. I was, too. I was trusting, very young, and naive. Now I'm just two out of those three!! I'm older, and a bit wiser. And still trusting. And you know what? There are people out there (by people I mean men) who are honourable and trustworthy. It was a good thing for me to remember when I was working through the heartbreak and disillusionment of one man's deviousness. I emerged from counseling stronger, wiser, but still with an open, loving heart and mind. You will, too.

As far as the 'friend' goes, it's up to you. If you decide to meet her for lunch just bear in mind that anything you say may or will go back to him. If she's an honest friend, she will be willing to earn your trust. If she pries or prods after you tell her you don't want to discuss the situation, she's not a friend.

Try to enjoy your breathing space a bit this weekend. You know the children will be well cared for. Read, see a film, go to a museum. If you feel you need 'crying time', do that (but only a little).

Drop off done, it was basically all between my mother in law and me, the arrangements for this week too. She was so nice to me it breaks my heart. She said she wishes she could see the children more. Not quite sure what is going on H's end, but it sounds like he has maybe told her I don't let him see them more than a day every two weeks. I've told her she could see them or have them stay at hers every two weeks when he had them but it wasn't really up to me to arrange as he chose to have them less than he was given. I hope I've done the right thing telling her. I burst into tears so it wasn't very good. I think it would be good for the children to see her more often. It's not good there's been such a big gap. Dc2 didn't cling to me thank goodness.

Across the weather is lovely here, and I am going to go for a walk. I get quite stressed in crowds at the moment. I have plenty of course work to do after that. It's just the evening really. I guess there's something quite reassuring to know the kids are peacefully tucked up in bed in the next room.

Twinklestein Yes I went for tests at a drop-in clinic the day after she told me. All clear thankfully. The nurse advised to go back in a few weeks for hep and HIV retesting as it was too early to be 100% sure about that yet. All so yuck and humiliating really.- When I first posted I was really quite upset because I sensed things were spiralling out of control but I didn't know how to handle it at all. I remember being so shocked at all the responses really. I am not sure how much I would have taken in about what he did abroad, so please don't worry at all .

It'd crossed my mind because he had plenty of opportunities of course and also he occasionally told me he would have to visit prostitutes or find someone else when I didn't want to do what he wanted, but stupidly I thought he was just saying that as a way of getting me to do what he wanted, not as something he actually did. I always trusted him really and, apart from the threats which I guess maybe are obvious to an outsider I can't think of any signs that he did that. The word sounds so wrong now, but I'm sure he came across as quite doting to people who didn't know us when we were out. It's not like he was constantly leering at other women or making comments. Somehow I thought he probably wouldn't want sex quite so much if he was having some in the week, which in hindsight doesn't make any sense because it was constant when he was off work. Thing is now I have no idea what's what, or how long he'd been doing it, or whether he'd always done it and I just didn't realise. Even if I had realised, and if I had asked, I doubt very much he would have told me. It feels like I can't be sure of anything really, and really what was our relationship about for him? It feels like it was nothing. I find myself going over the good bits of the relationship which I'm embarrassed to say I sometimes miss, and wondering whether even that was real. The fact he was capable of having an intelligent conversation and being affectionate but then to behave like a terrible thug or pig the next day is quite hard to understand. Maybe nauticant is right but it's like one step too far I can take in really. But yes, that's because of stuff like this I ended up phoning rape crisis. I tried to put a lid on things but it's not been entirely possible.

I hope the fortnightly counselling is going to help with my confidence a bit as I don't feel very confident at the moment. I just feel quite exhausted and slipping back into thinking everyone else is better than me at everything, tempted to take the option that won't lead to confrontation. At work experience my boss said after a meeting where she got me to speak about something I'd worked on that the work was excellent but I needed to be more confident. I thought it was really bad (I mean obviously really helpful she told me) she noticed because ultimately I won't get work if I can't sound confident about my own projects. Obviously she doesn't know the shit that's going on, but still it is no excuse. Also for the summer holidays H and I have a house somewhere sunny where I would love to take the children instead of going to my parents. Solicitor confirmed it's mine too so entitled to do that and I have the keys, but because it's abroad H has to know and I've been so worried about saying I want to go it's unreal. A part of me is worried about safety in case he decided to turn up of course, but it's not even that at this stage it's more being assertive in saying it's my house too. Like he is the boss or something, it's terrible. For the children I really need to stand up for myself like a proper adult really, it's quite embarrassing.

Across I never respond to his emails. I'm not supposed to. Only contact and it's pretty monosyllabic, or near enough on my part. But yes, you are right, he probably guesses quite well what I feel like. I won't see the 'friend'. She never responded to my (admittedly bland) happy new year text so now it's a bit late, and also I think things may well be relayed back to him via her boyfriend. Most of my friends were really his friends' girlfriends/wives, and probably fair weather friends to say the truth. I have to find more of my own friends now really.