Feeling lost and lonely (ex had an affair and left us - WE ARE MOVING ON!)

[Dee34]

Hopefully, I have done this correctly?!

Old thread here Thread1

Hi All,

This is my first post on these boards, though I have posted my story elsewhere......I just cant seem to stop thinking and mulling over things and searching for answers

Bit of a long story, but to start from the beginning, on Tuesday 28th Dec my ex announced that he was not in love with me anymore (usual cliches about being best friends, love you but etc). This of course sent me into a tailspin as I had just endured an awful xmas at his parents in Scotland that he insisted we go to (dont get on with his folks as they have never helped us out with DS and ex always seemed to avoid confrontation and would never raise any issues directly with them which made for an increasingly tense atmosphere). For background, back in November when I knew I would not be able to hack another xmas there and so I suggested we stay here and have a little family xmas, he told me that I was playing with people emotions by changing my mind and that I could stay here at home if I wanted but he and DS (2.5 years old) were going to Scotland regardless!! I guess I should have sussed that something was a bit iffy but I just brushed it off at the time (by Nov, affair had been going on for a month and actually between Oct - start of affair - and the bombshell in Dec, there was a difference in ex's attitude which I only really pin-pointed in the last few weeks). Anyway, we had a terrible night on the 28th - lots of crying, very emotional etc. I asked him if he was seeing someone else and he said no. I asked him to swear on DS life (childish I know, but said this in the heat of the moment) to which he replied no, he won't swear on his life as he doesn't do that sort of stuff but he held his hands up and promised he was telling the truth. I of course believed him as for me this was all out of the blue..On the Weds, I was quite teary and by lunchtime ex was saying that he was confused, needed some space etc. I said how about he stay in a hotel nearby and come round every day to see DS, take him out etc. I even phoned up several hotels for him to check rates and availability! This was during DS nap and by the time I had gone upstairs to get him, ex had done a spreadsheet and had decided he wanted to go to San Francisco instead. Some fluff about always liking San Fran from work trips (he has been there several times in the past year for genuine work reasons). Again, naïve fool that I was I agreed to him going. We drew up a list of issues that we would both think and work through (usual - lack of sex, though we were trying for baby number 2, arguing, his parents etc) and agreed not to tell any friends or family about what was happening until we knew what was happening ourselves so no one could 'influence' us. So ex went to San Fran and DS and I stayed here (everyone assumed he was here with us during whole period). Anyway, as soon as he was in San Fran his tone and attititude completely changed and he became very distant (he was relaxing and not looking at the issues or given them any thought etc). I finally 'broke' on NYE and asked him what was going on etc and that's when he said he had met someone but that nothing had happened between them, which was actually a lie.

To cut a long story short, he came back on Weds 5th Jan, determined not to work things out. Over the weeks I have learnt that other woman lives and works in San Fran, they met on a work trip in mid Oct last year (in a bar - only kissed - met on the second to last day before he headed back to the UK), had DAILY contact from the time ex returned home, started sleeping together during his next work trip out there in early Dec (a 5 night work trip) and that he was with her all along when he abandoned us over NYE to go to San Fran - he was having a lovely holiday, planning his life with her, whilst I was here like a muppet, trying to get an appointment with a sex therapist (as I obviously had 'issues'!). She is 30 (7 years younger than us) and had moved to San Fran from Nashville in June last year, so seems to me like there were a couple of lonely fools that met over some cocktails? Ex keeps banging on about how she is leaving her life over there (not quite sure what she is giving up bar a job and accommodation compared to what he is gambling with) to be with him, how he loves her so much, never felt like this before about anyone including me - starting to make me a bit sick if I'm honest. If you added up all the days they had actually been together from mid Oct to just before that post xmas trip, it amounts to around 6-7 days actually physically together and they weren't even together 24/7 as he was actually working on these two work trips (have confirmed with a colleague). So it was just hooking up at night and having lots of fresh and exciting nookie? Rest has been built around a deep emotional attachement from their daily calls/text/emails/webcams etc (probaby worse than having random one night stands I think). I think that even now tally of days is around 16 or so when you add on the NYE trip. But that is enough for her to give up her life and job and move here to be with him and he reckons she will be here in 3 months time (until then they will be racking up airmiles). I just dont understand it at all......I guess they are soulmates or star-crossed lovers that were destined to meet?! Everyone keeps telling me that he will one day wake up and see what he has done or that they will break up as soon as she gets here, but the flipside is that they may be together for a long while and that is something that I am now trying to reconcile with - esp as she will effectively be playing stepmum to DS even though ex doesn't really know anything about her bar what she has told him and shown him during their limited time together (of course there is the very real possibility that he is even lying about dates and that this all started way before Oct. I don't know and to be honest, don't care now as all it would prove is that he is more selfish and a bigger cheat and liar than first thought)....

Throughout all of this, ex has been going on about he need to be happy and how he has acted out of self preservation. And he has variously been unhappy for the last few months, 6 months, 9 months, 15 months, 18 months depending on what mood you catch him in when you speak to him.....unhappy for so long that I didn't notice it and yet only gets the balls to leave once he meets someone else? I can accept that we didn't have a 100% perfect relationship, but we had been together for 11 years and of course share DS so am shocked and hurt that it ended in this way. For his part, ex varies between assuming no guilt and saying that the affair was symptomatic of our relationship to wanting to do 2010 over again and make different choices and regretting going to the US over NYE and for making us go to Scotland over Xmas (apparently, as I made the atmosphere so tense for everyone, this was the last push towards making him decide to leave us.....though he hasn't commented on how his dad did his usual show of drinking 2 bottles of wine on xmas eve and not bothering to get up until gone midday so we were all sat around waiting for him as usual...).

Anyway, since then things have lurched along. He has said some horrid things to me and treated me like a fool at the best of times. I think he is so deeply entrenched in his feelings for the other woman that he has forgotten I am DS mum (again, keep asking myself, how and why can he feel so deeply for someone he has spent barely any time with?). For me, the hardest part now is facing up to the reality that I will no longer see my son every day as we move towards shared access and custody. Also hard is the fact that this other woman will be interacting with DS as and when he is staying with them. I do secretly hope that they both go back to the US (surely to happen if and when they have kids and don't think she will wait around for long as she does seem besotted with ex for some bizzare reason - her FB profile is a pic of them in you guessed it an aiprort!...) and ex only comes back here on his tod to see DS for holidays (selfish I know, but I can indulge a fantasy I guess).

Is he deluded or am I???? He has been focused on work a lot and seems to have lost a lot of his friends and social life - which I had noticed and tried to encourage him to get back up again. I am just heartbroken that he could do this to us - esp the cold and calculating way he abandoned us to go to San Fran to be with her over NYE and the fact that in the last 7 weeks our house has now gone on the market (cant afford it myself) and I am now out looking for any old job to support myself (oh, forgot to say, that I had taken voluntary redundancy from a very well paid job last March with his encouragement! When I called him up on this he said, 'oh well, but you didn't like that job anyway!!!')......
I
Inbetween all the crying and anger, I do feel like I am going crazy........This is playing on my mind a lot now as he has just flown out today to go and see her in San Fran (6 night holiday, so will take their tally up to 21-22 days or so). It pains me that he will be taking her out for meals, whereas I had to practically nag him to death to book a babysitter for our anniversary in Dec ('nagged' him, as I usually arranged everything and was in need of some attention after his work trip - of course, I now know why he wasn't that bothered...). He will be having cosy conversations and intimate chats planning their future for when she moves here and talking about our son.

Does it get better? Does anyone have a crystal ball and can tell me they wont last....??!!

And how can I move on? I have tried the whole no contact thing - which worked for a while, but then I broke and sent him a long message about how he had ruined my life.... . I have read a ton of post affair books (including not just friends) but still struggle to make sense of it all some days. I know that he will definitely not come back as he has said this several times as he no longer loves me and the deep feelings he has for the OW. Trying to be positive but it is so, so hard some days........

Hi Well - hope you are feeling okay today. I agree with Springy about making new snow memories. Glad you had a good time with the DCs. In the old days, ex would have been out building a snowman with DS, but, hey, I was able to do it as well as go sledging (and I dont generally do the cold/snow!), but we had a fab time! I think we get stronger from these experiences, which is one thing as we go through the ringer.....

Re the memories everywhere, I totally get your point and experienced the same. Could you perhaps pack some stuff away? Very early on, I had some bedroom decorations that I packed away, ditto, I had been thinking that this Christmas, I would avoid using some things in case it brought back memories, but in the end, I was fine, so think this will come with time for you. I do still get flashes when I see something and think 'oh, I remember when ex and I bought this or that together', but mostly I dont (dont know why! I think I end up thinking about other things I guess.....). Defo stick with email comms where possible. Hmmmm, Skype - am sure someone else will have better advice than me. Ex asked me about Skype a long time ago, but he originally suggested it back in like Feb or March last year - so literally a couple of months after his bombshell and he wanted to do this when he was over in the US, staying at her apartment.....told him where to go obviously....

Had the laugh of the week, no, century, yesterday with ex. Had taken some advice on here about setting out some boundaries/agreements with ex (yep, know he will most likely ignore, but in terms of creating my own 'paper trail', think this will help so he can't then accuse me of x, y or z.....same with the school stuff. Have all his emails and reasons for declining invites and then his final email of bascially how he couldn't be bothered as he knew I would do a better job on that etc etc, cant remember the fluffy details now). All couched in very neutral terms and covering general things like finance etc. I did mention one thing which I guess I shouldn't have on reflection as it crosses into them, but had asked (all via email btw) ex if he would explain to DS about the whole concept of half-siblings and him and baby having same dad (I think I am dwelling on the whole idea of ex's reference to new wife's friends and family and how they seem to automatically become DS' as they have a baby on the way now - he has been away loads with her and not asked DS to go, bar the very limp request for DS to go the US/their wedding last year. Get that on some level her family may want to 'integrate' DS as they would obv have a blood relation through new baby, but its just like arrgghhhhh, another thing to sit down and accept. Also, no offence, ex is dumb enough to not even think twice about this, that or he doesn't like to confront certain situations .....). Anyway, just wrote something along the lines of 'hope you will explain the subtleties of the situation to DS as and when and that he will be having a half brother or sister who shares same dad as him. Obviously explaining situation in language he can understand'. Nothing else said about them or asked about them. His response - 'oh yes, good point. When would you suggest I talk to him about that then?'. After I brushed myself down after spluttering my coffee, I composed myself and replied '[Ex], as you may remember, a couple of weeks ago you - quite rightly - told me on my doorstep that your joint pregnancy was nothing to do with me. I agree. I trust that as you agree about talking to DS as and when you deem appropriate, that you will no doubt select the best time to do this'

I left out the bit I really wanted to write about how surely the fail-safe manual they have been following for the last 14 months should have this sort of scenario covered and how of course they have made this decision with DS' best interests in heart along with all the other decisions they have made in the last 14 months.....being very sarky now, btw!

Can see that he is still blinded by the fantasy of living his dream life and having me as his trusty best friend doormat he can dump his sh*t on when he likes and will do all his hard and dirty work (and common sense thinking it seems) for him. Just can't believe the cheek of him....esp as when he told me to basically mind my business, it was when he told me the pregnancy news on my doorstep and I was stood crying in front of him....sheesh, as I was told at that time, wish I had never given him the satisfaction of seeing me crying in front of him about that now. I just dont want to be drawn into the drama/soap opera anymore.

As for everything else, am keeping on detaching. Emails have peaked again as he is picking up that contact is not wanted/returned unless essential - and there has been nothing essential bar the agreement stuff (hence, quite happily ignore his pointless emails about 'should he bring DS' wet trousers home or should he wash them at his?' or other super urgent topics.....can't wait until he is just a distant memory!

What a great upbeat post you have just written. I know its couched in pain underneath, but your attitude and strength are gaining momentum and for once I can feel that you have the measure of your ex and the fact that he will never change - its you who has the opportunity to change and you are doing it!

My (slightly cynical) interpretation of his questions about when to tell your DS about the future is that firstly, by asking you to define 'the right time' means that if it went belly-up, it would be your fault for telling him that was the right time. Secondly this occasion will be one of the first times that he has to own up to what he has done and take the consequences of his behaviour. Woops, he's got nowhere to hide, no-one else to blame. Shame .

Look at it this way, you've picked up the doormat and thrown it away. You're right, you were a convenient target for blame so take heart from the fact that he is struggling with this - sending you emails about the stuff you never give a second thought. Stick with it... ignore, ignore, ignore.

And if it helps you to cope with your responses by writing the reply you would like to send. Write it, read it, delete it. That way its out of your head.

As for their fail-safe manual to a happy life? think they're reading it back to front and upside down!

Oh Dee, your ex does sound a bit in la la land. sounds like you dealt with it tres bien indeed well done! And WELL sorry that you are going through it. It is a horrid time and memories are hard, particularly when for you they are happy ones. Making new memories is the only way, although can be a little bittersweet but they will become more vivid and in time happier.

I'm a bit down the ladder at the moment as a result of last week's drama. I've also fallen a little off my distance horse as over w/end DS has just awfully agressive behaviour (for him) and when he got upset was hitting me and spat at me (sounds awful written down but he is lovely boy and whilst lots of character not at all like this). I was 'hey hey, what's all this' and he said 'I'm being daddy' . Of course said no Daddy would never hit mummy and he would be cross with you if you did (all true) but obviously his little brain trying to process. He also was v. mean (out of character) to 11 month old girl we saw socially to the degree I left after 25 mins. He also wet himself for first time in I can't tell you how long. Anyway, should have left it but sent ex an emotional text telling him and then arranged a telephone call with him today which we had where I outlined DS's behaviour and what we should do about it. In my text I had said (stupidly) that I didn't want him to see him this w/end as I wanted to get DS back on the lovely track he was. I know I couldn't do this and was stupid to go there but I wanted him to take it seriously. Anyway, net net he did concede his behaviour was bad, won't happen again, blah blah.

Also a bit upset as met a friend (with whom I used to be v. close and now not so much as her partner is friends with ex) and she asked me if I was OK as I seemed a bit subdued. We don't really talk about ex anymore so I said Oh i had an incident with ex that upset me but I don't want to bore you. she said no go on and I did. she voluntered that 2 people in their circle of friends had spoken to her about ex being aggressive/inappropriate with them in the last week or so so with this she was like gosh he is not in a good place etc (i didn't ask what incidents are but she said nothing to do with DS etc)...she also voluntered some information about the OW (primarily that she has no intention of moving to our city - although she and none of his friends have met her). I didn't ask any questions, she voluntered. Anyway, she texted me afterwards saying she felt she had said too much and could I not reference it to ex or anyone in our circle here. I said of course I won't (and haven't/won't). Then today she called and said she has been worrying since and that she can't talk to me about ex anymore (fair enough) but her reasons were that what I had told her is too 'serious' and that although she didn't think anything would happen to me or DS if it did it would make her feel awful knowing what she did and doing nothing about it so she didn't want to know anything. I was a bit taken about by her reasoning but said sure no problem I can understand that but tbh feel a bit slapped face, not because of what she said per se but because she asked me about it and then drove the conversation to which I didn't ask any probing questions. Anyway, probably being over sensitive but I felt like I was being 'punished' for responding to questions - I am so careful not to dump stuff on her - on anyone really aside from one dumping friend over here who is wonderful and a very close friend....i have felt very 'red faced' all day - literally a bit face burny. Does this make sense. I am just going to suck it up and mentally transfer her to 'social' friend but I guess its made me feel a bit more isolated over here and has led this evening for the old feelings of gosh its so unfair I am left over here and don't have any proper/close/old friends and that so much has been taken from me, including friendships. I know that sounds pathetic but I'm really feeling sadness about DS being my only child, am a bit financially stressed which isn't helping, and no feel like I have to live a soap opera whilst pretending all is well. I am in a ITS NOT FAIR. mode.

so, give me a kick please lovely ladies...

Dolly it sounds to me as if this "friend" spoke to her partner, and got told off, maybe for telling you to much. Or told not to listen to you.
There is no reason for you to feel embarassed, some people are just like this, their natural nosyness overcomes proper discretion, or any boundaries on how involved they want to be.
I would be a little concerned about your exes aggression though. Please keep records, and get advice on what to do if things seem to deteriarate but don't talk to him about it.
I can't remember how old you son is but in my experience kids often get "naughtier" at about 5, and when tired from starting school. However your exes behaviour isn't helping, as they learn more from actions than words.

I think the 'I'm being daddy' comment after ds's behaviour is extremely telling and I would get this incident logged. Poor lamb - bless him

That 'friend' is certainly covering her ass isn't she? GRR I'd take it that you got a nugget of very useful info from her but that, frankly, she is no loss as a 'friend'. You know what they say: when the rubber hits the road you find out who your real friends are. Painful but true. I'm not surprised you felt you had been slapped in the face - I think you were (horrid woman).

I think you were right to withdraw contact in light of ex's behaviour in ds's presence. Take this seriously - it is. (though I would avoid heart2hearts with ex about it tbh)

Thanks Mummy and Springy. Helpful and Springy I know you are right about talking with him. Need to pin that on my mirror. You are right about friends. What I was taken a back about was not the not wanting to talk to me about ex per se (I have several friends who I don't talk about ex to as they are still quasi in his social circle) but the fact she said what you have said is upsetting, its upset me, i've been thinking about it and its too heavy and i have my own family to think about I don't want to be upset by hearing things like that and imagine how I would feel if something happended to you (!?!)....ie your life is so shit its upsetting ME and if ex turned psycho, imagine how I would feel!!

I could understand if I was on the phone to her morning noon and night about tales of woe but literallly the only conv about ex in about 5 months...hey ho...anyway, giving it too much headspace....thank you ladies and mumsnet again for the place to vent/process....will not be mentioned it to any RL friends in Oz lest I sound like teenager : )

I don't think it is teenagery tbh. I think you are dealing with some very serious stuff and you are finding out pretty sharpish who has the good sense to deal with it.. with good sense! Your 'friend' - well, it's all about her isn't it? Whether she's coping (wtaf?!?). I have a similar situation in my family at the mo, in that someting monumentally shit has happened - I have been accused of some pretty awful stuff - and members of the family are bemoaning how they aren't coping. No thought of how I may, or may not, be coping - they are nowhere to be seen, too busy lamenting on their beds!! It's all about them! Drop her like a hot brick, and anyone like her Dolly.

Here's your situ: ex has trapped you in a country that isn't yours, literally on the other side of the world, for the forseeable; controls your every move, is obstructive over unnecessary minutiae. Now he has upped the ante by abusing you (1) in front of your son (2). This is serious stuff! This is your liberty, ds's emotional and mental health (not to mention yours..) - plus anything else that he may be throwing into the mix. Serious stuff imo.

Dolly, the advice from everyone here is spot on. I wouldn't worry too much about ex-friends and acquaintances. They will only have heard what they want to hear and people love being part of a drama. They also have no idea of the consequences of idle talk and it sounds as though if she'd a brain she'd be dangerous. She had to tell all to her OH who then panicked and told her to retract. Yeah, whatever...

You have done nothing wrong, but there are others who may use you so only trust those who have stood by you over the last few months. Its none of anyone else's business and the woman's comments to you after your chat are self-serving. Just someone who is out of their depth and doesn't have a clue what you have been going through. Her opinion is meaningless.

However, what you should go on is your own instincts. If you have a gut feeling that things are not in a good place with your ex then its a good indicator of how you should proceed. Just say to yourself 'How bad am I waiting for it to get?'

Its difficult to know what to do and you don't want to be over dramatic. Don't wait for anyone else to tell you how it is. You know how it is and its only your opinion of the situtaion that matters.

And your DS - he's just pushing the boundaraies and being his age. Be firm and loving and you will have nothing to worry about. If you seriously think that your DS is being harmed by your Ex's behaviour, then cease contact.

You can't have this time back again, but you can make sure that whatever time he has with him is positive and that he is safe, emotionally and physically.

Thank you ladies for your wise advice. Not sure if its allowed on Mumsnet but I want to thank each and everyone of you for your care and responses. To quote Tennessee Williams 'the kindness of strangers' is valued, appreciated and will not be forgotten xxx

Sorry not to have replied for so long, am very mentally drained at the moment.

Hope the detachment is still going well Dee. I would say to keep an eye on how it might creep up again - I think you're going to have to keep your boundary in your own mind (as your ex won't) and not deviate from it unless life and death. Let his little fingers burn themselves into a frenzy - you do not have to reply. Bring wet trousers home or wash them at his??? What a chump.

I'm sorry you're going through it at the moment too Dolly. I know in addition to everything else how difficult it is to suddenly be a single parent to a little boy. I have a copy of 'raising boys' back in my ex's country and I think there is a chapter in their for single mothers. Not sure if the author is any cop or if he's a raving lunatic mind you.

The "I'm being daddy" comment is very telling and a shocking indication of what a dreadful role model your ex is for your son. I sometimes feel I have to cajole my ex into caring about the children and am sometimes frightened to point out when I think he's not being a very good dad in case he disappears from their lives. But then I think, well, hang on, is a person so fickle and feckless someone who the kids would really benefit from having in their lives?? I dunno. They never said anything about THIS in the ante natal classes!

I think also some of it is that little boys go through a testosterone surge at about 4 too - maybe yours is starting his now?

Agreed that the 'friend' sounds like someone you would probably be better off without. You are right to move her from 'friend' to 'more of an acquaintance really'. You certainly find out who they are when you go through something like this don't you. Only one person of my ex's nationality has made contact with me since our split, which I find very telling. The rest I assume are either a) hopelessly socially inept or b) insincere and stick-to-their-own types. I don't have time for either.

The kindness of strangers is something I have been making full use of in the last six months. Off the top of my head I can think of the lady in my ex's country who saw me sobbing down the phone to my best friend in a cafe and came over and asked me if I needed a hug, and also the young man on the Waterloo-Reading train before christmas who saw me sobbing whilst texting on the way back to my friends house after having given evidence in the high court all day but before the judgment and offered me a tissue and said he hated to see people upset and asked me all about it - and believe me I let him know in all the gory detail and he was kind enough to nod sympathetically and keep handing tissues. The rest of the carriage must have been agog. Who said that Londoner's weren't friendly? I won't have a word said against them - not on my watch!

Dolly, Dee, Patience, Springy, and all others on this thread - you are among friends xxxx

Who are you calling strange?!

Honestly, us women eh - we are heroes and champions. That's not to say men aren't eh (or some men, to be precise) but hey, it's us I'm celebrating at this precise moment.

Group hug, medals, chocs and bunches of to all of us battling to survive these hideous 'men'. We'll get there! [battle cry]

Hello - hope everyone is well. Quick check-in from me......after a lowish week (lots swirling around in my brain regarding ex, me, DS and various bits of his news), I now feel that I have turned a corner. A huge corner.....not sure why....thinks its the time now, think I have become attuned to him and my respones to him and my various needs (hopefully in the past) to engage with him, think about him etc. I have also been reading the book that Dolly recommended on Runaway Husbands and it has had a huge impact. So much so that I came back to re-read this (and previous) thread and it is like reading the advice for the first time in parts...mainly as I can see so much more clearly now (if that makes sense?!). All the advice on here has been spot on and wonderful support for me - it has really made the difference (hugely!).....

Ex still continues to grate on me - but I now know that I have the 'power' to not let this affect me (or not as much as it used to!). Still expect a wobble or two on the road ahead (esp when DS comes home talking about new baby brother or sister etc), but, at the moment, I couldn't really care less if ex and new wife had a baby every year now - which is a massive change from as short a time as a few weeks ago. I think it's the realisation that actually, I would not want to have another child with this man myself, coupled with the utter farce (in my opinion - am sure that they see it as another way of sealing their deal etc) of the situation. Honestly - my seeting anger ('how could he have a child with someone he has been living with for 3 months', 'how come he is all for starting a new family so soon after ditching the last one', 'how will this affect DS and give him more stability, make him feel secure') has been replaced with a 'oh well' attitude. Am more than happy to leave them to it and my only wish now is that ex starts to get a clue and make sure that his (ex's) relentless quest for happiness takes into account what is best for DS. So, I hope he does some reading about how he can make DS feel more secure/not feel threatened when new baby arrived, but I know* that this is for him to tackle, not me and I cant make him do anything.....will see how things go.

Well/Dolly - how are you both doing? Hope things are getting better.....

• I could go into pages the latest issue he landed me with - short version: DS has been ill, off nursery since last Thurs pm and at home with me from then through to Weds when he was well enough to go back to nursery. Ex's night for access that evening....he calls me 5 times in one hour whilst I am driving. 2 texts and an email also. Obviously, once I have parked up, I worry as DS has been ill and still on antibiotics. Turns out DS is crying for me. Fine, I speak for a bit (though by now, ex is saying 'oh he is fine now'! ). Fine. Go about my evening. Then I get a call at 12.50am on landline - I ignore, then another call on my mobile and again, think 'maybe DS is ill', so I answer. There is a 'crisis' so ex tells me somewhat seriously.....the crisis is that DS is crying for me (I can actually hear him hysterical in the background), saying 'go away Daddy, I want my Mummy now'......I am on speakerphone and ex asks me if he can bring DS home as he cant calm him down! I agree (I know, I know...I would have felt horrible saying no as DS was on speakerphone and also had that need to comfort and soothe him as he was crying like I had never heard before), though whilst still on the phone, he starts to question me about whether DS has been sleeping in my bed (yes, he was, he had a burning temp and as I am working full-time - was WFH am, pm and evening to catch up on my hours whilst looking after DS) and how I have now given DS separation anxiety, even though he skipped off to nursery in the am and was fine and dandy when I waved him goodbye and explained he would be with his dad that night....I ignore. They come round at 1.45am, and on the doorstep, DS is suddenly as bright as a button (with a bit of fake crying that can be spotted a mile away) and ex tells me 'we need to have a chat tomorrow about some things'....I ask 'what' and he replies about DS' anxiety and behaviour!!! Anyway, Thursday comes round and I decide that er, actually, I dont want to talk or email convo about any imagined nonsense from ex, so send a very dry email explaining this and that is that. I also remind him that we are back to communicating via notebook in DS' bag and no texts or non-urgent emails.....Phew, a few weeks/months ago, I would have given ex two barrels in an email with what he came out with on the phone/doorstep (along with a terse reminder about how his various decisions over the last 14 months had caused a whole lot of problems that I just had to suck up and maybe questioning how he thinks he will be able to parent DS when there are worse circumstances than this to contend with), but now.....??? I just dont care. I dont want to enage or talk with him. I am loving having the notebook (though he has yet to write anything in it!) and having that extra bit of distance now.....I dont feel like I have to justify myself (as I used to) and honestly in this whole incident, despite DS being upset, my main regret is that I basically allowed ex to use me to do the hard parenting stuff as he couldn't do it....but feel like he took advantage a bit with DS being ill......definitely marked for future reference to spot...

Oh dear.....I did go on for pages and pages with that last bit - sorry!

you are an inspiration ! well done you for getting this far you sound really positive and in control xxx

It is very hard when it is your child crying and tugging at your soft heart strings but isn't he pathetic. Next time tell him it will be good practice for the future...

Also the 'we need' erm no you don't need... Just ignore when he says it, a non committal uh huh as you close the door on him.

Ignore the phone calls/texts and when he comments just an 'oh it wasn't in the book, sorry...' Until he gets the hint. Your DS may be about 15 then though

Just watched Christina Perri singing Who Do You Think You Are on Graham Norton - thought of you lot! I was going to post a link but it isn't available yet - I'll do it tomorrow.

Well done Dee - that book sounds great! Though as you say, things click at the right time eh. so glad he his reaching full turd status in your heart and mind at last you've covered huge territory in only a year - well done girl

It's called Jar of Hearts, apparently

Thanks Springy/Mazza/Xales! - am feeling very positive for some reason.....hope it continues (the man is still living in his own universe where he rules supreme and the world/folk bend to his rules. Madness that I dont want to be associated with really). Never heard that song before......very interesting!

So on a related note - would be great to get some advice on whether I am being unreasonable here and what others in similar situations do....

I have asked ex to bring DS back for 6pm. This is the time he agreed to almost 4 weeks ago, I also wrote in DS' notebook that ex needs to work out his day so that he is leaving his house and on way to mine for 5.40pm....this is because he has a long-standing habit of bringing DS back late each and every time he has him....varies from 15mins to one time 40mins late. And it wasn't due to an emergency, it was because he couldn't get DS into the car/DS was playing up/DS was asking for another story or to play another game. Anyway, comes to 5.50pm and lo and behold an email to say that sorry, DS has had an accident whilst eating his tea and he will need to be changed and then then they will be on their way. Apparently DS is sleepy as he has had such a busy day. Of course if DS has had an accident all fair and good, but not sure I believe him as it of course means that they arrive late here again.....

Need to be cool, calm and collected as this is the first time ex has had DS for long weekend (we are doing every other weekend thing from now on). It just make me grrr that he is blatantly off doing what he wants to do and doesn't really give a fig about eating into my time with DS. Fair enough, by the time they get here, they may only be 30mins late (at a guess), but its the fact that he does this each and every time and especially after I went to the effort to make a (polite) note in DS notebook for ex to not do this (even said please and much appreciated!). Fed up now. I never leave him waiting on our doorstep for more than a minute before I open the door on pick-up and have all of DS' stuff ready. How would he like it if each and every time he came round, I took between 15-30mins to get DS ready and left him (ex) sat in his car all that time? I guess I need to pull back DS return time a bit? Or just put up and shut-up as ex knows this winds me up?

Tell him you'd like ds back late because you will be out having a fabulous time and can't get back any earlier and see what happens.

Telling him to leave by 5.40pm is a bit prescriptive though. He's nothing to do with you any more, you can't be telling him how to organise his life?

Up to a point, you have to suck this shit up tbh. I appreciate that 30 mins late is not too much (except if it destroys ds's bedtime). It may be an idea to bring the return time forward to approx 3 or 4? Then ds can settle in and have his tea in peace, relaxed before bedtime.

Hi Springy - still not back! Yes, I was thinking the same - i.e. ignore him and see if he gets bored of bringing DS back late. The 5.40pm thing was a 'suggestion' as in why dont you have him ready for 5.40pm as you know that it takes 20mins min and sometimes 30mins to get back to mine....then again, when he lived around the corner he always bought him back late, so I do officially give up! Guess there are more important things to worry about!

what I mean is that suggesting times he should leave is quite intimate in a way. as though you are pals, or linked. ie you wouldn't say to ds's headteacher (when he gets one) that he should leave his house at 8am to get into school for a meeting you had arranged with him. Get what I mean? be businesslike, as though you're talking to the bank manager. imo (and ime ) you can never be pally with them again, it just doens't work It's not as if this is a normal breakup and you are dealing with a normal human being!

Sounds like he's doing it on purpose.

I agree about just ignoring him, unless he is unacceptably late.

He's trying to get a reaction from you.

Don't go there.

You might find it settles down by itself Dee,I used to make myself busy and return home at 6pm on the dot eventually ,i got one or 2 phonecalls saying where are you ?Ha ha ha cos he needed a quick turn around to pick up his gf .If i stayed home he would arrive back at half 4 with some excuse or another. and cut short visit .I know its different cos my kids were 4 and 5 and different situation altogether ,but as the months /years go on your life will change and tbh if he is seeing ds regularly without too many ASSHOLE moments then I would just go with it .Eventually he will realise the only contact he has with you is thru ds,and the only real relationship you have with him is a child maintenance standing order .Big hugs you are MEGA !!!!
Dolly hope ur DICKHEAD EX is behaving himself xxxxxx

Hello Lovely Ladies

Well. Quietish here not least as I managed to knock my laptop down flight of stairs so had to get 'new' one. Very expensive mistake and even more annoying as was doing my cleaning (as got rid of cleaners as I'm now unemployed ; ( so felt like a very false economy!! Fortunately my friend was selling hers - lower spec than mine but still its works and not tooooo $$$. Slightly funny story - took old hard drive to some geeky russian bloke to try and regain some data. He was VERY russian and said 'hard drive is corrupted. I not fix. $90 please. After I walked to my car he came after me and said 'may I offer you some advise' - I said yes expecting IT tips and he said 'you pretty lady but your perfume is not good. change it. will be better' ; ) !!!!!

Anyway, all rubbish financially (no job, broken laptop, no house sale and plummeting market and more marketing expenses for house - sigh - can't even talk about it as will panic) but ex being fairly quiet since his mental moment. I think he realised what he had done...either that or he has spoken to lawyers too (I did re where he lives after his outburst as was over it) - net net he has had DS in our City since we got back from UK so no big road trips and has been taking him to his sport etc which is good. Still doing pick-ups in public places though which I will do for a good while I think. My ex FIL very very kindly offered (I had said nothing) to take my shitcan car to his mechanic as he used it when we were away and I think realised how crappy it is. So ex delivers back DS at w/end and we swap my car for FIL. I said - do thank your Dad, it is sweet of him to worry about us in the car (prob a bit passive aggressive now I think of it but actually didn't do on purpose)...he said very snottily..its not that he was just shocked at what bad condition it is in and that you are not maintaining it. This was said with a straight face and no sense of irony or self awareness that 1. when he 'took' our family car this one was dented, rusty, had loose fanbelt etc and we had talked about replacing 2. he f'ing took the family car anyway 3. that until I sell the house i can't replace and 4. kind of hard walking down 60 stairs with instruments and valeting a car when you have a 3/4 year old.....hey ho...

Other than that trying to use not working to 'do' stuff - so far going into do reading at DS nursery once a week, renovated a desk for DS and about to put a shit load of stuff on ebay. So sadly Bali yoga retreat off menu but have done a house swap for a swanky penthouse in the City so can have a cultural single girl about town w/end which should be nice! Have also been doing a bit of stand up paddleboarding - did some paddle board yoga at w/end - yes as difficult as it sounds and mainly me plunging from downward dog into lake (ala dirty dancing but with an old hippy called Wayne instead) and now have a sunburnt backside - hey ho.

Dee - sorry that you ex is being difficult re drop offs and dealing with an upset DS. It does sound like you are dealing with very well indeed. It also strikes me that for someone who is so keen to have as much access as is possible its odd/not so sensible for him to phone you and essentially say that he can't cope. If he didn't see his DS very often you could understand his inability but really...god help him when baby comes along...also horrid conspiracy me thinks hmmmm wonder if it was dear hormonal wife saying oh for goodness sake he wants his mum, call her, I need sleep (sorry if that gives you mental images that you didn't have though darl).

WELL hope you are doing OK on your 'journey'. God I hate that word but you know what I mean. Patience and Springy hellooooooo - Springy - that song was popular over here a few months ago and did think of you all! I am still belting out Beyonce 'best thing I never had' when I need a 'boost'!

Unemployed sunburnt arse Dolly x