Cannot decide if we want our son to attend a private school or not

[Londonhoneycake]

I am 43 and attended a state school, although it was in a fairly middle-class, well-off area. My husband is 47 and went to a private school. We have two boys, aged 9 and 7, and we have started looking ahead at secondary schools for our eldest. We’ve attended open days and open mornings and met with heads of schools, but we’re still unsure whether to send him to a state school or go down the private route.

We aren’t wealthy. We could afford private school fees, but only just, and because of that my husband’s parents have offered to help with the costs. I’m not sure how I feel about that, whereas my husband is very much in favour of it.

I’d really like to hear from parents who weren’t completely sure either. We have good state schools nearby, some within walking distance, and I feel our children would benefit from attending a “normal” local school. My husband strongly wants them to go to a private school, but I’m conflicted because I disapprove of a system that reinforces inequality and gives children advantages purely based on their parents’ or guardians’ wealth.

I want our children to be educated alongside the majority. I also work closely with an education think tank, much of which focuses on strengthening state education, so it would feel quite hypocritical to send my children to private school given the values that underpin my work.

A better education isn't necessarily a private one.
You are still taking about the outcome not the sample. You can't say private schools have better outcomes when you compare this 7% of the population, who have either high intelligence or high income or both, with 93% of the general population who may have one, both or neither of those, and that is before you take attendance into account.

For a study to be reliable you can't control the outcome (although you can spin the results your own ends) you can only control the sample before you start to give you the best chance of rejecting the null hypothesis.

I want my children to be around everyone because only around 7% of the UK population is privately educated…..

@Londonhoneycake Fine. Send them to state school then.

My children and GC have attended a mix of private and state at secondary stage, based on their individual needs.

From my point of view it is swings and roundabouts to some degree, but a generalisation is that in the private schools they were surrounded by an atmosphere where learning was seen as a way of life and pupils got their heads down and got on with it. They had massive advantages in terms of facilities and extra-curricular activities, an example being music where scores and instruments and tuition and choirs and ensembles and orchestras were readily available and something that everyone did (rather than just a small minority), and performance opportunities both local and national abounded.

All of them went to the local sixth for their A-level studies. They fitted in very happily, having been to state primaries, and were very aware that they had had advantages denied some others.

A lot of course depends on the school chosen, whether it be state or private, because they all vary.

If there is a good private school nearby and the funds are there, there are usually advantages.

Just to add that at the private schools they went to the children were no different from any others - they were mixing with others from a variety of backgrounds because of scholarships (which 2 of ours had) and there was no snobbery as far as I could see. A common factor of course was that all parents placed a high value on education, and in the comprehensives that some went to this was not always the case. Teenagers are greatly swayed by there peer group and there were occasions where cool dudes who thought education was crap became the dominant ethos in the gang. (Just to say I have some sympathy with them as a lot of education can feel irrelevant)

What do you think the words "controlling for" mean in this context?

Privately educated individuals in the UK generally earn significantly more than their state-educated peers, with studies showing a substantial salary premium that widens over time, even when controlling for university, subject, and job

That sounds terrible @MyHonestZebra . Schools are so different, and you get good and bad in both sectors. Hockey doesn't seem like a reason to stay. Many schools will offer it, and you can find clubs outside school too if your DC is serious about it.

Can you get your DC's place back at their previous school if they just left? If not, you should definitely move to another school: either state or private. Start looking now, and have plenty of visits to make sure the environment is right. It sounds like your DC is boarding, so if you wanted to continue that then you don't even have geographical constraints! Or else you could change that choice, and look for a day school close to your home: if your DC doesn't like having lots of activities in the evening, then boarding perhaps isn't the right choice. Or you could revisit your choice of sector and try to find a state place, if you feel burnt by your experience.

There's no shame in changing something that hasn't worked. You should be able to move your DC in-year, so don't wait. It's worth losing a term notice if it really isn't working.

The big advantage of paying is that you have choice and can find a school you love and which is great for your DC. If that's not your current school, then you should absolutely change.

Quite apart from the moral issues, I wouldn’t want to have to scrimp and save to be able to afford to go private, and I certainly wouldn’t want to be "indebted" to my parents-in-law. If the state schools where you live are good, I can’t see any point in not using them. (My two DC both went to ordinary state comprehensives in mixed areas and both got into Oxford.)

It’s cost benefit analysis isn’t it. Do I want our family to live a reduced meagre life with no holidays and constant worries about money so my kid possibly hands in a slightly better standard of essay at Oxford?! Err no.

Mine are at private school so I’m in favour for many reasons but it sounds like you can’t afford it and I wouldn’t want my in laws or parents to have that hold over me or financial commitment

Have you looked at state schools which your DC would get into? There are some excellent London state schools, so if you are close to Dulwich College you probably have some good choices. It might be easier to compare specific schools rather than think about it in the abstract.

I agree with pp that it isn't great to be making major sacrifices for a school unless you have a really good reason to (which doesn't jump out in your posts). But it may also be that your ILs are happy to put the money into a fund up-front, and this is the way they would really like to use their money, if you agree. Only you and your DH can weigh up the specific trade-offs you have, to make the best choice for your family.

That's one school. There are good and bad in each system. Sadly you have found a bad one. I have to say that thankfully that has not been my experience.

I was in a dilemma (there's probably threads on here from 10 years ago about it 😆)

Went state in the end and I'm SO GLAD

• Dd is well rounded and can get on with people from all backgrounds:
• We were able to do state "plus" and have money for optional school trips, clubs and other opportunities plus tutoring if needed.
• we ended up getting divorced and having the commitment of school fees would have been a nightmare
• the teachers at the state school are generally younger overall with loads of energy and so committed. Very different from my memory of my private school teachers.
• pastoral care has been great as being a large comprehensive they have seen it all
• she stayed on there at 6th form and just got an offer from Oxford! So academically things could not have gone better for her
• she has relatively local friends compared to if she'd gone to one of the local private schools with a massive catchment

Also bear in mind OP that posters that have sunk a lot into private schools will generally be VERY POSITIVE about them, because they have to believe it was worth it.

OK, your first post was great. Really glad things have worked well for your DC - and well done to her for her Oxford offer!

But this is silly. State school parents have sunk just as much into their choice as private school parents: their children's education and future! And are clearly just as positive when the choice has gone well 😋

Make the choice that's right for you, OP. Your ILs generosity has given you extra options, and now it's for you to decide. It doesn't affect anyone else at all (and certainly not your work colleagues)

Ok I take your point, but the problem is none of us have a crystal ball to know what the alternative would have been like so inevitably unless things have gone badly we tell ourselves we did the right thing.

State school parents have sunk just as much into their choice as private school parents: their children's education and future!

But not school fees. And some state parents will have children at a school because they are legally obliged to (and don't want to home educate) and it's the school they were allocated. There are lots of engaged state school parents, but there are plenty who are not and will have literally not spent as much time and thought on which school their children go to, let alone money.

My parents were very much involved (PTA, school governor,) but we went to the one state secondary that was available for our rural catchment area. Fortunately, it was a very good school, but there was not much thought or expense sunk into its choice, and we'd have still gone even if it had been terrible.

Also due to my own experience of travelling far to my (private) school that was an important factor for my kids and as we are out of London, private schools would have meant a long day and a longer journey. That might be different in London but I think it makes a big difference to kids every day life.

That was one of DH factors. He was driven to the bus stop then a 40 minute bus ride. The bus was unsupervised and like lord of the flies. His line in sand was our dds being able to walk to school.

We were in a very similar position except that dh went to state grammar rather than private
(not an option where we live). I went to private school for Years 12-13 only so have experience of state and private.

We also have 2 dcs and for us it was a “both” or “neither” decision to go private.

DS got offfered a place at the local wonderful private but ultimately we went for state. He is now year 8 and enjoys it and no regrets really - we are happy for him and also about the enormous amount of £ we are saving and don’t have to worry about other family expenses. DS2 will join him.

I think a big factor for us in the end was not wanting DS to grow up feeling more privileged than he already is. Dh feels strongly that the future will be tough for all our DCs and it’s beneficial to learn to muck along with everyone rather than live a life of advantage. We also didn’t want our DC to have really rich friends. We are well off but not wealthy at all and the opposite of flashy.

Having said all of that we do have a decent (not exemplary) state on our doorstep. If we didn’t, the decision would have been different

To add although the state dc got into is good, there was no guarantee at all he’d get in. So we had to apply for private as an alternative. We then had to make a quick decision in a few days. Was the right one.

Of course. But it would be a shame for the op to be swayed by the current very hostile narrative about private schools into making a different choice than she otherwise would. I notice that a post which was very anti-private has been removed: presumably it wasn't posted in good faith.

It's a choice. With trade-offs. Pushing ones own choice - and pretending that there aren't trade offs - in order to feel good about it does the op a disservice.

Our son is attending a private school for 6th form, in his first year. No one in our family went to private school. We can’t afford it but he is on a scholarship and bursary (they approached us). We have good local schools but the private school is amazing. Classes of about 8 kids, they have to stay and do their homework, facilities are great and the teachers want to be there. My only reservation is, younger kids may find the ‘rich/poor’ thing tricky. We lead very different lives to most of the kids our son mixes with. He has never been singled out but younger kids may do this. Our son already says if he has kids he would send them to private school! Overall it’s a great opportunity but the inequality does niggle me….. but then selfish or not we went with it as it was too good an opportunity to miss.

And it's noticeable that the VERY POSITIVE posts - as well as the bad faith one putting down a possibly fictional private school - have come from state parents not private.

I suppose that hostile narrative is one of the trade offs though, OP.

We also didn’t want our DC to have really rich friends.

@Clearinguptheclutter Why not? Or maybe you regard rich people as ‘the enemy’?
What will you do if your dc make ‘really rich friends’ at university? Try to ban them from being friends?