Cannot decide if we want our son to attend a private school or not

[Londonhoneycake]

I am 43 and attended a state school, although it was in a fairly middle-class, well-off area. My husband is 47 and went to a private school. We have two boys, aged 9 and 7, and we have started looking ahead at secondary schools for our eldest. We’ve attended open days and open mornings and met with heads of schools, but we’re still unsure whether to send him to a state school or go down the private route.

We aren’t wealthy. We could afford private school fees, but only just, and because of that my husband’s parents have offered to help with the costs. I’m not sure how I feel about that, whereas my husband is very much in favour of it.

I’d really like to hear from parents who weren’t completely sure either. We have good state schools nearby, some within walking distance, and I feel our children would benefit from attending a “normal” local school. My husband strongly wants them to go to a private school, but I’m conflicted because I disapprove of a system that reinforces inequality and gives children advantages purely based on their parents’ or guardians’ wealth.

I want our children to be educated alongside the majority. I also work closely with an education think tank, much of which focuses on strengthening state education, so it would feel quite hypocritical to send my children to private school given the values that underpin my work.

I’d much rather my kids have an excellent education than inherit 200k at 25.
are you sure your son would even get into DC? I’m on several 11+ boards and it seems a tough one to get into. Haven’t applied for our child as we live too far away.

my personal opinion is that you would be silly not to send your kids to such an amazing school if they manage to get a space. Nothing is more important than a good education.

@nopinkplease That's terribly easy to say when the only state option on offer isn't a failing trust that even Ofsted said wasn't safe, where bullying was rife, where they'd had an arson attack, and a sexual assault in the previous 18 months.

Every parent deals with the circumstances they are presented with.

unless selective you can switch from your preferred secondary to independent almost at any time although unlikely for DC or many in that caliber.

but your first post almost sounds like virtue signaling wanting your child to attend alongside the majority. but will they really? what % locally go to independent (some area's have more than others think those who live in clapham common zone), what % attend state selective grammar, or highly sought after faith? my point is that what is left might not be very representative as a whole.
and those that can afford will not be in state school so wealthy most likely not represented.
I don't know why you think that those who are deprived should be educating your child on empathy.

I think stick to your principles OP and don’t become indebted to your PILs. It would annoy me that your DH and his family are almost fearful of your children going to state secondary like it’s a terrible educational experience - you obviously survived it and are a fully functioning member of society!

It’s tough you’re right but I think he’d be able to get in and we are willing to try at the very least. My nephew on my husbands side has been at DC since year 7 now he’s sitting his Alevels this year and my niece is at JAGS. These are very good schools definitely worth the money I’ve seen in first hand from my nephew and niece.

if my son can get into DC maybe even a scholarship I think there’s around 33-40% off of the fees if he performs very well
in the exams and interview and if that’s the case then we’d certainly be able to afford that. You’re able to get a bursary as well, his teachers at his school think he can, there’s been a few from his school who’ve gotten into DC so we shall see.

A 40% scholarship? Are you sure? Academic scholarships these days are around 10%, a lot of schools have cut scholarships since VAT came in. If he excels at sports or music, you might be able to get more.
If you think your child is scholarship material then you should definitely try and send him to DC. It feels like you care more about your morals and that he is with the “majority” then his education. In reality he is already an extremely privileged child with a privately educated parent, cousins at private school and very wealthy grandparents living in a very nice part of London. Not a judgement just stating the facts.

you only qualify for a bursary if you have a very low income and no help from other family members, which is not the case for you.

agree with this ☝🏻

We are both state educated
live in a good but declining standard grammar school catchment
smart dc who easily got place into grammar but we have opted for private. After much debate back and forth
absolutely no regrets infact the school has exceeded our already high expectations
as others have said - private school is a massive opportunity & now from the “inside” I can see why so many jobs and opportunities are skewed towards the private educated pupils.
im afraid no job I would do would ever make me put my dc life chances second.

State school educated here and a state school teacher. If we could've afforded private for dc then of course we would have done it! The opportunities DC would give your children are endless.

If you can afford to send two children to private secondary school then you ARE wealthy. Very strange that you say you’re not.

We went private initially because DS1’s needs (multiple complex SEN) couldn’t be met in the state sector. We basically had a choice of either going private or me giving up my job to home educate him. After a few years our LA agreed to fund his place in an independent special school. For various reasons DS2 is in private school too - the specific school he is at is by far the best fit for him. It’s been a struggle financially, especially with the VAT, but he has two scholarships and my mum and the school have both helped. We would do it all over again. The choice for him wasn’t private school per se, though - it was that specific school.

We sent DS to private school and we could only just afford it. DS has been constantly resentful of us having less money/ a smaller house etc than his friends. Although I don’t regret sending him, I think his view of other people’s finances is very narrow and he has become quite entitled. We didn’t have the opportunity of a good state school but I think that would have been my preference.

Look at the individual schools and your individual kids.

My siblings and I between us went to a grammar, a comprehensive and private. You would not be able to work out who went to which based on our educational outcomes, jobs or salaries.

The same is now true of our own children and across the youngest generation of nieces, nephews and our cousins’ children. Who were educated variously at top private schools including St Paul’s, and S London comprehensives at which some MNers have been known to quail in horror.

Take the P13 from Dulwich to Streatham at the end of the school day and if you close your eyes to the uniforms you will find yourself impressed and horrified in equal measures at both the Dulwich College and Kingsdale students.

Private schools avoid many of the challenges of state schools but they bring others.

For an individual child, if they are at a school where they can do well in GCSEs and A levels, and be supported to value their own education and potential through family values, and are lucky enough to come from a background which provides cultural experiences, extra curricular education and opportunities, I wouldn’t personally overstretch to pay for a school you can’t afford.

My DD is at private but wouldn’t be if it was a stretch. I would rather:

• Pay for extra curricular stuff - great holidays / travel, tutors as needed - than borrow and scrape
• give her a chunk of cash at 25 that could pay for half a flat in london

Also think about other costs especially somewhere like DC. Trips to exciting places, friends who may have expensive holidays, fashion trends etc, social lives. Their social circle will be all over London and those Ubers need paying for. My DS went to the local (good) state school, his friend went to DC. Both at equal level unis. DC definitely had an added level of academic pressure.

I would want what I deemed to provide my child with the best education. I'd put my prejudice aside (either way).

I went to state school and did well ultimately in life, in spite of it, not because of it. My DH went state and has a middling job.

We decided private after visiting the school. No question for me. If I could give my DD the best start on life, it was private. Life is competitive enough. You get one chance. Take it.

So much of this is hypothetical. You don’t know if either of your sons will get in. It doesn’t sound like you have looked at all schools and considered which would suit your sons as individuals. There are some private schools which are not worth the money and some state schools which are exceptional. It’s not as straightforward as private vs state.

It sounds like your main concern is your own principles. Which is fine in the abstract, but while I was uncomfortable in abstract with private school, I realised the local private school was the perfect fit for my DD and the local state options were not. I decided that my principles on education and the State shouldn’t be the final decider in my DD’s happiness and future. I have never regretted putting those aside and sending my DD to the school that suits her best.

It really depends on the state offering. Where we live, the local state schools are poor and the much better ones are out of catchment.

hence we’ve gone the private route. Our child is in private prep (Y6) and will hopefully pass the entrance exams for one of the two local private schools.

has it been worth it so far? Yes and no. IMO you’re paying for a better learning environment, smaller class sizes, attitudes to hard work are often better in private school, behaviour is much better overall with far less disruption. Way more sporting and extra curricula opportunities. However, I think there are brilliant teachers in the state sector (who do a great job under very challenging circumstances) so I don’t think the quality of teaching is necessarily any better, but the learning environment IS and I think that’s what you end up paying for.

in terms of private secondary, again it’s a huge premium to pay and I don’t think you can go into it expecting them to achieve stellar grades, they still have to put in the same hard work as everyone else. But the range of opportunities they get are far superior to state.

It’s not fair, but it’s the way of the world isn’t it? If you want a better service then you have to pay for it. Not that education should be considered a service but that’s what we have.

I would just be mindful of the costs because it’s huge, especially with two kids. Can your parents afford to support you with both? Also the fees get hiked up ever year so it really is a massive commitment that I wouldn’t go into unless you’re 100% sure you can see it through until the end.

“We have very very good schools near us walking distance and direct buses too. We are in south west London, there’s a lot of really good stats schools, we will probably stick with that.“

I would not make my DC commute to eg Dulwich College and be shattered etc and Saturday mandatory sports if you have excellent local options. That would be madness. It’s like buying a handbag just for the brand when you have a much cheaper better quality unbranded one that suits you much better. Once they are mid 20s they will want the inheritance desperately. Think ahead and what their 20 somethings would prefer.

If you have good state schools nearby and can’t easily afford private I would go state. I’d rather have spare money for things like holidays and days out, seems mad to scrimp and save for private school when you have good state ones within walking distance.

No one hires a kid because they went to private school - send your kids to state

@Hiptothisjive Do you mean just because someone went to private school it doesn’t guarantee a job, or the fact they went to private school means no one will hire them as no one wants privately educated employees?

I was a bit like you @Londonhoneycake in that I didn’t like the idea of private education generally, I went to state school and did ok after all. Schooling is so area specific, DC is now at private school mainly due to a lack of halfway decent secondary options and the private school is a lot more diverse than her state primary was (private school is in a city, state primary is in a ‘naice’ suburb where house prices are obscene!)
We are also accepting fee help from DGP, it’s not been an issue at all!

I sent mine to private because it was the nearest school and I went for a visit and really liked it. I didn’t know anyone who’d attended private schools. When I later started working in state schools, I was so glad we had the means to go Private.

Yeah apologies that was clumsy wording on my part. I meant the first one.

Private school is so much more than a few extra clubs, and definitely worth it. Sounds like your ILs have the money ready to go and are happy to spend it.