Right-wing American Pied Piper Charlie Kirk assassinated

[MsAmerica]

I see a thread was started in Chat, but it's obviously more appropriate here. I've been in an American forum where someone wondered if it's of international interest.

Right now it's so early that there's no predicting what will develop, whether it will snowball into something catastrophic. Oddly, after a few hours, it's still not known for sure if they caught the shooter, which is strange, as they supposed knew where the shot came from. I'm already running across some odd conspiracy theories.

Conservative activist Charlie Kirk dies after being shot at Utah Valley University event
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/conservative-activist-charlie-kirk-shot-at-utah-valley-university-event-spokesperson-says

Charlie Kirk assassinated at Utah event
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2025/09/10/charlie-kirk-shot-at-utah-valley-university/86080079007/

Charlie Kirk, a prominent conservative activist and Trump ally, dies after shooting at Utah campus event
www.cnn.com/2025/09/10/politics/charlie-kirk-obituary

It's a fact that Bella Ciao made it onto the America First playlists. It's part of the bigger picture that TR was raised in a conservative, trump supporting, gun loving family. Those are the facts. He wasn't a raving lefty.

Oh for goodness sakes. Why would someone right wing want to assassinate the right's poster boy? There's already quotes in the news from people he was at school with saying he was anti-Trump.

I think I need to leave this thread now. Do those on the left holding up these strawmen and making these silly arguments not realise you are only emboldening the people you disagree with? This is exactly why Charlie Kirk was so influential - because he made the left look stupid.

The analogy with cars doesn't work without accepting that cars are more heavily regulated than guns.

There would be far fewer gun deaths and mass shootings if they were as heavily regulated as cars and:

1. You had to have a licence and pass a test to own a gun.
2. If you had to have insurance.
3. If you had to have extra training and pass additional tests to have the most powerful guns (like HGV drivers)
4. If your licence and right to own a gun was taken away and you risked prison for carrying in a dangerous fashion or while drunk.
5. If police could stop you and ask to see your licence
6. If you were banned from owning guns if you had certain medical conditions (including some mental health conditions)
7. If civilians weren't allowed AR15s and other high powered guns in the same way they aren't allowed to drive F1 cars or monster trucks round the streets of a city.
8. If gun makers were more focussed on safety - building guns that only worked with fingerprint recognition (or something else equivalent to seatbelts and crumple zones) rather than just developing more powerful and deadly weapons.

But 2A proponents and the NRA have not allowed any of that to be put in place because they hide behind a 250 year old document, written at a time when the only gun available was a musket, long rifle or pistol.

Oh for goodness sakes. Why would someone right wing want to assassinate the right's poster boy?

Really? You know that not all right wing people share the same views? Look at Tory and reform in the UK for example.

In the US Nick Fuentes and his America First lot had some radically different views from Charlie Kirk and his Turning Point lot.

Yes of course it was. That doesn't negate its appearance more recently on alt right playlists.

Yea but that appearance says absolutely nothing about the shooters political leanings now does it.

Nor can we assume that it proves he is left wing.

And of course we don't have that fact in isolation.

The Kavanaugh attempted assassination? Some disturbed guy who was not a registered republican or democrat, who bought everything he thought he'd need, including a gun (which he had to practice using because he had no clue), put it in a backpack, flew across the country, rocked up at Kavanaughs house, saw the security and called 911 himself 🙄

I think people are talking about kirk more is because the loudest voices are those just like him. Racist, misogynistic, violent white men 🤷‍♀️
You can see on these threads just how empowered those with racist views have become.
Trump has made hate and violence acceptable, fanning the flames and revelling in the 'legitimacy' incidences like this give him to employ even more hateful tactics.

Epstein who?

OMG! This is how crazy people are.

There was no trans ideology on the bullets. No political ideology.
They were references from online games.

Such stupidity shines a great big spotlight on how these vile people are able to grab and retain followers and power 🤷‍♀️

@BloominNora but then the argument you're making is for stricter gun control when I think most left wing people, especially in the UK, don't think people should be allowed to own guns at all.

The argument against stricter gun control is that they don't trust the government to implement this. If ultimately the second amendment is about reducing the risk of a tyrannical government then it's dangerous to allow the government to control who can and can't own a gun. Given the current state of US politics I can see their point.

I fundamentally disagree because I believe the risk of being shot in America is far higher than the risk of a military coup. And even if there was one I don't think Jim Bob with his rifle in the shed is going to have much chance against a 21st century US military.

@VanessaFence - I think we are in agreement.

The car analogy is patently ridiculous but it is one that is generally raised by 2A proponents so the point is to systematically dismantel it by agreeing and saying you're right - so lets regulate them in the same way rather than arguing that they are different.

Not that it would work as they would just spin another strawman - probably something about cars not being in the constitution or backpeddling to the position that they aren't the same.

The trust issue and nonsense about fighting back against the government can also easily be refuted because, as you say, there is no chance that even an AR15 is going to be much use against military grade tech.

Even if sentiment changed and there was more of a push towards amending 2A, there are so many guns in America now that it would have to start with regulation, an outright ban is totally unfeasible. Another quick way to reduce gun usage would be to tax ammunition!

Almost every single pro gun argument can easily be shown to be flawed. The strongest argument has always been the fall-back that it is in the constitution, but Trump has blown a huge hole in that one now given how much of the constitution he has subverted.

I have always been very much in the anti-gun camp, but with everything happening over there at the minute, I do think that if I lived in the US I would be looking at buying a gun and learning how to use it.

The Purge and Handmaids Tale is starting to look more and more like the future of the US than exaggerated dystopian entertainment.

People are running with it. They don’t know the beliefs of the shooter.

It's super frustrating isn't it. So many people on social media confidently saying he was this or that.. You'd hope at some stage people learn not to believe everything that spreads on social media and just wait for official information (and even then we might never know his beliefs).

Yep, so fast too.

If they had stricter gun laws he might be alive today. It's as simple as that. And the highest fatalities from guns are all in the Red States - Mississipi, Alaska, Tennessee, Texas, Louisiana etc. Where gun laws are very lax.

So many people on social media confidently saying he was this or that

I don't understand why it even matters? If he turned out to be a democrat that doesn't mean democrats support political violence. Same as if he turned out to be a republican. Why do we think one lone lunatic is representative of a political group?

He could claim to be left wing or anti-fascist or whatever but he certainly doesn't align with anything I believe in. People are saying "he looks like one of you lot" when really they should be saying "we want unity and peace and nothing to do with this".

Dribble

Has anyone answered this yet?

Rational the guy was a raving evangelical nut job and took pleasure in tearing apart people live on air. You can't pick and choose what part of Christianity you want....liberty isn't owning a gun....it's utter nonsense. Try debating liberty with the children killed in school shootings....

The guy got shot and his own words a few deaths are worth the liberty of being free to own a gun. From my opinion is that if gun ownership means that people keep repeatably shooting innocent people that my argument is where is the liberty for the victims....

America is lost....it doesn't understand right and wrong.

Just ban the guns, start with an amnesty and then start raiding homes and taking the ones people refuse to give up. It's not rocket science....lives before liberty 🗽

That would definitely go well in a country the size of the USA and given the level of gun ownership and strength of feeling. How many lives would raids like that cost I wonder?

And it would still leave all the remaining guns, of which there would be many, in the hands of exactly the kind of people who you wouldn’t want to have them.

A gun free US is a nice fantasy for some, but it is just that - a fantasy.

And a life without liberty is not much of a life.

Well, the shooter was right wing, and Kirk was not the "right wing poster boy".

His widow is now using his death to threaten violence and spread hate. Maybe he wasn't the picture perfect guy you think he is?

The shooter was brought up in a conservative home.
He had been manipulated in his thoughts by left wing ideology in his educational establishment and online.
His parents didn’t recognise his words and were concerned about them.
Its no different than a child raised in a good home who goes off the tracks because he mixes with the wrong people.

I love the way some Americans view a firearm as some form of right and protection. Is it any wonder why the US police are so ready to open fire on suspects. It must be terrifying for the police considering the level of gun ownership.

The only firearms that people should own are those designated for hunting. Handguns , semi auto weapons, pump action shotguns, high powered rifles ....these should all be banned

To be fair this started with Trump and Mace instantly blaming the left.

I honestly don't believe it...I think you've been manipulated. I think society has become polarised and polluted with distorted views. They should put ban young people from Facebook, twitter, tikTok, Instagram....and teach children to love and understand each other..... accept everyone for what they are....Most teachers do that....gay, trans, straight,white, of colour, of different beliefs....it does matter because children learn to overcome barriers and don't have the same problems that adults do