Rise of fascism... what, if anything, can decent people do?

[MrsBennetsPoorNerves]

Trump's victory is obviously alarming for many of us, but we've seen the rise of the far right in lots of places across Europe to a greater or lesser extent as well. History teaches us that bad things happen when decent people stand by and do nothing . So what, if anything, should those of us who are concerned about the rise of fascism be doing now?

Please note: if you're a Trump fan and don't agree that he is a fascist, this is not the thread to debate that. There are plenty of other threads where we can discuss that point, but this one is aimed at those who already accept that premise. Obviously, I can't stop you posting here, as it's an open forum and I don't get to police it, but I won't be engaging with any posts from Trump apologists on this thread because I don't want irrelevant debate to derail the main discussion.

An echo chamber then?
Nothing political was sorted by ignoring people you disagree with.

What will change things? People being allowed to speak out on issues that concern them without being called thick, racist, bigoted, which just pushes them further to the right.

At one point I considered that the left were able to understand this and give space to everyone for the greater good, but now I realise they can’t, their views are as entrenched as the further right. And this is why I no longer consider myself to be left.

So do you decide your politics based on whether your feelings are being hurt or not, and not based on your values?

It's all about emotions though isn't it? Facts went out the window a long time ago.

Exactly. It's so frustrating to deal with, because you cannot reach people who are acting on emotion. Strong emotions have shut down the prefrontal cortex and have activated the amygdala, so they are impervious to reason. It's responsible for the dumbing down of society.
Politicians know how to reach them emotionally, their primary method being fear, because fear shuts down reason most effectively. They stoke anger for the same reason.

There's a lot of anger because people are working their butts off and are worse off. Trump is very good at channelling those emotions and appealing to the psyche.

For example, he's going to protect women from immigrants. That goes back to the times of segregation when the 'outsider' was seen as a threat to white women.

Trump is just a man capable of delivering the far right vision, he's dangerous because his views have hit a popular note. The same could be said for Hitler and look at how that turned out

The man is already talking about curbing protests at universities if they criticise Israel....same label anti semites...or terrorists he calls them. Dangerous label for a peaceful protester because the truth is right now Israel is committed to genocide and openly admits it. So if you can't speak out about that then where is this free speech that Musk and Donald cry about.

Fact is his views are far from acceptable and in many cases are alarmist and untrue..and the fact that he doesn't like the pressure challenging this and now threatening to shut them down...

All this is far right and step towards facism.

In answer the OPs question..

1. Acknowledgment the existence of far left extremism. Acknowledge the damage they've caused through their abuse, intimidation, threats, violence and their insistence of pushing anti-science and anti-common sense agendas. Root it out, call them all out. Loudly. Shame them and let them and everyone else know that their views are extreme and do not represent left wing ideals.

1. Listen to the people you disagree with. Understand that you may not know where they're coming from but that doesn't make them wrong and you right. Remember that just because something doesn't affect you personally doesn't mean there is no issue. Keep that in mind when you have conversations with people, instead of throwing accusations of bigotry, transphobia and racism etc. Accept that you will need to compromise because those people will have very real concerns, you don't know what's best for them as you haven't walked in their shoes so try not to be so controlling.

1. Accept that people on the left have played a massive part in the polarisation of politics. Massive. Many of us considered ourselves left wing until the left upped sticks and moved to cuckoo cult land. Many of you have actively created this chasm of division between your political stance and everyone else with awful behaviour. Understand that when people say you put them off voting for left wing parties because they're sick of baseless accusations and name calling that it doesn't mean that they're just digging their heels in and voting to spite you, rather that they are just not buying what you're selling. You don't come across the way you think you do.

1. Finally, stop calling everyone you disagree with far right. That will cut the number of far righters down significantly 😆

"So do you decide your politics based on whether your feelings are being hurt or not, and not based on your values?"

People always say this in these discussions instead of thinking a little deeper.
If people feel that they don't align with your political stance they're not going to vote your way.
Many on the left have leapt so far left and behave so authoritarian-like. They portray the image that if you disagree with 'the left' on this one point then you're far right (and insert whatever insult, slur or threat here once it's established they you're a Nazi 🙄)...PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO FEEL THIS REPRESENTS THEM. Why would they vote against their interests.

It's so easy to point the finger. Or to accuse people of emotional voting but I think some serious self reflection needs to take place if you genuinely want people to feel less detached from your politics. The left does not portray themselves as the inclusive and kind people they think they do.

That's all very interesting, but it doesn't actually address the issue of emotional voting. Are you saying it's not a thing, while yourself saying it's about perceptions that left wing people are being mean? That absolutely is emotional voting. If you vote based on reason, it's about policy, not your perceptions of whether the voters on team left or team right are nice or not.
I certainly don't see; "But they're not nice, so they don't represent me, as I am a nice person!" as deeper thinking. It's actually quite infantile IMO.

Well America is about to find out what Trump and Musk have in store for Americans.

1. Millions of working Americans are about to lose there jobs.....Musk like an infantile adult child appears to enjoy the prospect of sacking state employees

1. Trump will give the green light for Israel to attack Iran ....

1. Revenge

You watch and I'll be ticking off those pretty quickly and I'm sorry I don't buy this left wing and wing thing because the day politics gets into culture wars then this is the result.... politics is about economics and creating a country that works for all not just a section of society.... healthy, working, educated and prosper

Not at all. No idea where my post gave the impression that feelings come into it? Feelings have no place in politics at all.

I’m very aware that everyone has their own experience of life, their own set of information that they truly believe.
The current polarity of issues (eg gender ideology, immigration etc) very much puts feelings first and foremost, ignoring facts, and paints those whose views clash with the lefty politics authoritarian opinion as nazis, racists and bigots. This is all about feelings and ignores a great many facts.

I believe we are all human and deserve to live our individual lives in the best way that we can. I believe that immigration is essential for the country, but at the same time I can see that others disagree, but that doesn’t make them racist. If I call them that (as the left are so fond of doing) then I’m very aware that it’ll push them to be further entrenched in their views.
You don’t win friends and influence people by dictating how they should think about certain topics, and certainly not by insulting them for thinking it.

Moving forward we should all be trying to find ways to communicate better with each other, accept that there’s room for a wide variety of opinions, and stop the spread of the awful divisiveness that is rotting everything.

The more extreme left and right are both symptoms of the same problem.

Why do you think reform targeted certain seaside towns - not Frinton but Clacton? Why do you think that Farage is in the US rather than representing those that elected him?

Why do you think that in work benefits are all fine and good when they subsidise low wages but think that out of work disability claimants are frauds?

Why do you support capitalist 'geographical relocation of the social resources of capital' ie outsourcing to chase cheap labour or the importation of cheap labour to prop up the care and farming sectors is fine but then blame immigration?

Capitalism can't survive without increasing profit which means outsourcing and importing cheap labour whilst laying off indigenous workers who can't afford to work so cheap (even with in work benefits). But you hate the immigrants not the system.

Clever people can be played. It doesn't make them stupid.

Particularly if all they think about is meaning and the message and feelings are manipulated. But history teaches us that this, combined with economic hardship, can lead to the sanctioning of evil policies.

I hope we all know what the far right and fascists are. It's not about semantics it's about real life policies. You lay all the blame on a certain demographic and want rid of them by whatever means. You start with mass deportation announced by Trump, as Hitler did, but this led to the 'final solution'.

Are Trump supporters OK with this?

I think Gramsci can be reread in the era of social media controlled by people like Musk with clear links to political leaders like Trump.

I asked because you talked about being called bigoted, racist etcetera as a motivating factor for people to move to the right. That would be about emotion, having their feelings hurt and being resentful as a reason to vote a certain way.
I understand your perspective better now. Thanks.

Yes, it also harkens back to the propaganda used to justify slavery.

I was thinking of lynchings caused by white women feeling 'threatened' by black men.

Gosh, yes. On the head. This x1000

You understand that people on the right, centre and of no particular wing are allowed to oppose facism?

You can even be a member of the Tory party – Prime Minister indeed – and successfully oppose it.

Winston Churchill managed quite well, I seem to remember.

That sounds like blatant blame shifting frankly, and letting the right off the hook altogether.

I don’t want any convicted sex offender to ever be able to immigrate to the UK, and I think any non-UK national who commits a sex offence here should be deported, with no exceptions. Does this make me ‘far right’? I’m intrigued to know.

It seems like women and girls are always the priority of the left, until race/gender identity/another protected characteristic comes in to play, then they sadly slide down the list. Hence the grooming gangs cover up, male transgender sex offenders in women’s prisons, and the way they insist on dragging children into the ‘queer’ movement via horrors like drag queen story time.

And before anyone starts… no, I don’t think women and girls are the priority of the right either.

Of course you're aware that the grooming gangs scandal happened under the Tories. Criminals are usually deported. The Tories put men into women's prisons and the story time crap started under them as well.

And before you start I agree that women and girls have never been a priority on the right.

Labour were in power when the grooming gangs were rife and complaints rejected by police due to fear of racial tensions. The convictions only started happening under the Conservatives, around 2010-2012.

What hook?

The convictions only started happening under the Conservatives, around 2010-2012.

You seem to think you can take us for fools.

The convictions only "started happening" when the then Director of Public Prosecutions made them happen by overturning the CPS's existing guidelines which were hindering prosecutions of child sexual exploitation gangs. That DPP appointed a new chief prosecutor to carry out such prosecutions. That DPP also created a national network of specialist prosecutors to improve prosecution of child abuse and sexual exploitation.

https://fullfact.org/online/starmer-muslim-grooming-prosecution-crime/

He then went into politics – one of the reasons being to be able to tackle sexual exploitation more effectively.

That Director of Public Prosecution's name is Keir Starmer.

But you knew that. It's received enough publicity lately.

Agreeing with the law that rightly bans convicted sex offenders from getting visas to the UK is not a left or right position, so no, it no more makes you "far right" than it makes you "far left".

(And god knows what we'll do if there's another state visit from Trump. I suppose he wasn't criminally convicted, just found in civil court to have committed sexual abuse. But it will be a difficult position that the US puts us in, offering such a man as its head of state who we're required to wine and dine.)

But gaslighting us by trying to credit the Conservatives for Keir Starmer's actions in prosecuting child sex abuse gangs...

I don't care what label you give yourself – "far right", "far left", another label or none at all.

I'll judge by your actions, ta all the same.

I didn’t credit the Conservatives.

PP said: ‘The grooming gang scandal happened under the Tories’

I said: ‘Labour were in power when grooming gangs were rife and complaints rejected by police due to fear of racial tensions. The convictions only started happening under the Conservatives, around 2010-2012.’

Which part of this is a lie, ‘gaslighting’ or any of the other things you’ve accused me of? PP’s statement was wildly untrue, so if you’re concerned about misinformation then maybe correct them?

This thread was to ask about opposing the current rise of facism.

Key is understanding more about this particular movement, so here are a couple of articles about what's going on behind the blustering front-man:

Silicon Valley Whistleblowers Warn Elon Musk ‘Hijacking’ Republicans to Control Entire US Government
Former followers of the ‘Dark Enlightenment’ say a planned ‘neo-reactionary’ hollowing out of government is happening in real time
https://bylinetimes.com/2025/02/07/silicon-valley-whistleblowers-warn-elon-musk-hijacking-republicans-to-control-entire-us-government/

The Billionaires’ Plot for Ending Democracy Is Already in Motion
The Butterfly Revolution: A Roadmap to Corporate Authoritarianism
https://thelostnerve.tumblr.com/post/775295725065125888/the-billionaires-plot-for-ending-democracy-is