To not want to be a Muslim

[Lostagain]

Ok so I am a Muslim, have 2 dd and married dh is a convert to Islam....
Anyway from a young age I have had a strong pull towards Christianity or aspects of it. I don't believe Jesus is the son of god, but do believe he will return again etc.
Is it a cultural thing? I was born and brought up in the uk, went to a cofe school for a few years then we went to a inner city which was full of Asians- I am Asian but it was horrible, I hated it. Despite this I still sang on the school choir, certain people were horrified at the time, but my mum supported me. In my teens i went a bit religion mad and started wearing a headscarf etc- didn't last long,
i love Christmas and Easter, I sing hymms when I'm washing up i've been to a few church's in my time, funerals weddings etc and to be honest it's so peaceful there.
I have been to mosques it was ok,actually I couldn't wait to get out of there....Maybe it's a language barrier
I haven't spoken to anyone about this as it is such a big thing -changed my name on mn but sometimes I just don't want to be a Muslim. I want to bring up my children with faith and I struggle to explain the Muslim faith.

I'm sure there is the odd sentence in the above which makes sense :)

Isn't that true of every society? And the reason we have laws.

And individuals have rights within a society's laws as long as they don't contravene those laws.

To different degrees I suppose it may be true. But say sex before marriage is illegal in Islam as the problems of children without fathers, etc are seen as more important then an individual's right to have sex. Or drinking is not allowed as the problems to society caused by drinking are seen as more important as the individuals right to choose what they consume. And the same with other stuff like freedom of speech, in Islam backbiting is illegal,

OP, I 've read the whole post, religiously
I think you are just trying to fit in and maybe if you took religion out of the equation, you wouldn't feel so tormented. It's not shameful to be a second generation immigrant you know.

Laptop

Thank you for your thoughtful comments.

I can't take religion out of it, I believe in god.

tbh I never thought myself a second gen immigrant ( makes me sound like an iPod, so maybe we get better with generations? )

Trying to fit in, maybe. my dad used to live in England shirts, played football and only attended the local mosque twice a year.

lost after my dad passed away, i was going through some of his things and came across some amazing designer clothing that i had never seen him wear. My dad was always in suits and casual smart on weekends - but never saw him in designer. didnt know he had any! I still remember finding such a stylish YSL coat and apparently he used to wear it in his younger days. My mum smiled and said to me "it's not just your generation that is allowed to wear designer you know!"

That is completely off point though. Still remaining off point, I remember being told when someone dies, in islam you must read certain prayers for them at least 100,000 times in a sitting with loads of people around you, so that God may give them heaven!

I used to hate it (i am ashamed to admit) when i used to have to visit someone's house after a death in their household as i knew i would have to sit there for hours reading same prayer over and over again! So i used to make excuses not to have to go!

To my utmost relief, i found out in my late teens that this whole deal with reading things so many times (which is never less than 100,000 i might add) is nothing to do with islam! phew!

:o

I still do that if someone dies, I go give my condolences and leave, tbh because I dont speak any south Asian languages it's kind of difficult at times to sit there and read a million times.

U know what I mean :)

nailak - Are you saying that you didn't legally get married so that your husband can marry a divorcee with children (when he can afford to support two wives & many children) to give them better lives?

"muslim women divorcees around the world, suffering because of famine and war. If the opportunity came for my husband to marry one of them, depending on situation at that time I might encourage him to. Because I want for my sister what I want for myself, and if I was in that situation with no prospects to work or provide for my family, I would expect and want the muslim ummah to care about my life and my honour and my dignity.'

Why can't your DH just give this woman money and help her that way? Why on earth would he have to marry her?

"the Islam i follow saves me from increased self consciousness, increased body anxiety, heightened mental health threats related to objectification and SELF objectification: depression, anorexia nervosa, bulimia, and sexual dysfunction, and increased body shame"

I don't have any of these and neither do my friends, and the majority are not Muslims. What makes you think you would be anorexic or have sexual dysfunction if you weren't Muslim?

Cote d'azur, this is entertaining to no end. You are like my little red devil in tex avery cartoons. Expressing only more eloquently all those things I dare not say.

I've become so totally indifferent to religion that I don't bother anymore. You remind me of me a few years ago!

Lost again, if I may, what comes across in your posts is really that you feel no connection to your "birth" community and are trying to absolve yourself from guilt shedding that aspect of your identity for good blaming it on religion.

If you feel so inclined go ahead and become a Christian but I can't help but think you are just not at ease with your cultural heritage and religion is just a red herring.

I read what you wrote, obviously. And asked you a question: What makes you think you would be anorexic, bulimic, sexually dysfunctional, etc if you weren't a Muslim?

It's like saying "Islam saves me from being a serial killer". There are very few of those, and the rest of us who aren't serial killers aren't Muslim, so no relation between Islam and protection from homicidal urges, it seems.

Similarly, there are very few anorexics/bulimics etc and the rest of us aren't all Muslims, so no relation between these pathological eating disorders and Islam, either.

I actually agree with cote - nailak why not give money? You may be a perfect pious loving Muslim
Lady doing it for your sisters - but the assylum seeker might just want to steal your husband and Put him in further debt since he can't afford 2 wives abd more children If he has debts

In an ideal (unlikely) situation yes by marrying her you give her a sense of family abd security....but I could and would never do it even for extra 'points'

Shane is not a bad thing!!

because it is not just about money is it, that is not all a marriage is about money? there are other benefits like having a father for her kids, a companion, etc.

and i mentioned "depending on the situation at the time" and this would obviously include uf he had enough spare time and income to deal with two families.

As for maybe she would steal my husband etc, like any marriage between two muslims, there would be meetings, background checks etc, i know these are not infallible.

Like I said mustget Islam places the rights of the society above the rights of the individuals. This is one of the cases, it is better for society that women in these situation have the opportunity to marry again, even though it would be hard for first wife to get used to.

Why would she marry a man who was already married(or committed to a woman and his children). Surely there isn't a shortage of unattached males.

"e I said mustget Islam places the rights of the society above the rights of the individuals. This is one of the cases, it is better for society that women in these situation have the opportunity to marry again, even though it would be hard for first wife to get used to."

So basically the man has the right to re marry whether the first wife likes or not. Maybe the woman should be allowed to have two husbands if the first husband is a bit shit at providing financial support. Prehaps in London it would require the income of two husbands to buy a house.

It coud get really interesting if you both the husband and wife hare polymigous. It would be a bit like swinging.

Why does a widow or divorce have to marry a man who is already married. There are plenty of single men. I suppose it might be an issue in countries like Iran or Iraq where lots of men died in a completely pointless and bloody war.

well wrongly there are mysogynistic attitudes amongst some muslim cultures about divorcees.

She doesnt HAVE to be a second wife or a wife at all.

If the husband is shit at financial support, no the woman cant marry again, but she can divorce.

No one said if the first wife like it or not. As a first wife I am saying I would like it. A husband should consult his wife in major decisions that impact their life, and obviously this would be one of them. If he is oppressive and a dictator then this is no different from the leader of a country being oppressive or a dictator. This is not right. This is a decision that should be mutual.

and i was talking about areas devastated by famine or war, somalia, iraq, iran, afgahnistan etc.

They might find themselves more comaptible with a man who has a first wife then unmarried ones they are introduced to etc.

She may initially not consider being a second wife but might get a meeting with a husband that she likes and decide it is something she could consider etc.

and it is not easy in Islam too have two wives. The Quran states to not do this if you cannot be equal, and the punishment for not treating wives equally is being resurrected on judgement day with half your body paralysed, to name just one.

You have to provide for two families, provide accomodation for two familes, do two sets of family shopping, two sets of family days/outings etc, whatever you buy for the first wife you have to buy like for the other, whatever time you spend with one wife you have to with the other.

It is not just financial. right now i think my hsband hasnt got the time to have two families or energy, or patience to deal with two wives or two sets of kids.

The point is it is not as if all the hardship is on the wife and the husband has a free ride.

"sex before marriage is illegal in Islam as the problems of children without fathers, etc are seen as more important then an individual's right to have sex"

Err no. It is illegal because men want their women previously untouched and unseen virgins. Candy in pristine condition in its wrapper, as previously said on this thread.

what didnt you get about backbiting?

here is some info

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

?neither backbite one another. Would one of you like to eat the flesh of his dead brother? You would hate it (so hate backbiting). And fear Allaah. Verily, Allaah is the One Who forgives and accepts repentance, Most Merciful?

[al-Hujuraat 49:12]

It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ?Do you know what gheebah (backbiting) is?? They said, ?Allaah and His Messenger know best.? He said, ?Saying something about your brother that he dislikes.? It was said, ?What if what I say about my brother is true?? He said, ?If what you say is true then you have backbitten about him, and if it is not true, then you have slandered him.?

Narrated by Muslim, 2589

It was narrated that Ibn ?Abbaas said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) passed by two graves and said, ?They are being punished, but they are not being punished for anything that was difficult to avoid. One of them used to walk about spreading malicious gossip (nameemah), and the other used not to take precautions to avoid getting urine on himself when he urinated.? Then he called for a green branch, which he split in two and planted a piece on each grave, and said, ?May their torment be reduced so long as these do not dry out.?

Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 213; Muslim, 292

basically backbiting causes issues, we have all experiences this is our personal lives, so and so said such and such and chinese whispers etc, and it doesnt unite, but causes families and friends to fall out and mistrust each other.

cote how many of the sahabah (companions of the prophet) married previously married women?

and how many wives of the prophet sas where previously married?

culturallly, you are right, which is why I am saying Muslim cultures have an issue with widows and divorcees, zaniyas they can sometimes deal with as long as no one knows about their zina (unlawful sex)

Please tell me its not true. I just read that Mohammed had sex with a nine year old at the age of 53. Yuk!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad%27s_wives