How to handle a 12-year-old refusing to accept a ‘NO’?

[YellowMellow99]

I’m looking for some advice please. TIA for your help and please be kind. 🙏🏼
Our 12.5 year old DD latched on to the idea of going to an activity this summer that DH (her father) and I deemed age inappropriate. We explained this to her and said no. We said she can choose another activity.
She’s completely refusing to take no for an answer and has been really upset, angry, uncooperative and argumentative.
It’s tempting to give in to her but that’s what DH used to do and look where that got us!
DD is very smart and (like any tween/teen her age) can be quite manipulative to get her way. She refuses to help with anything, unpack her things (we just moved house a month ago), she’s also not looking after her pets. She says she’d do more if we take her to this event but we already said no and explained why. DH and I have a united front. DD is generally lazy as DH used to just do stuff for her and she soon learned that she should ‘just enjoy being a child’. DH came to realise that this was not a good idea and we are trying to change things and get DD take on more responsibilities (at least tidy up after herself and look after some of her pets) but she’s just very demanding, doesn’t do things unless she gets something out of it, and she can be uncooperative and difficult.
I think DH doing everything for her made her quite spoiled and she’s our only child so that probably didn’t help either.
I’m giving all this as a background information.
She said she’ll be miserable and upset while summer and not talk to us, unless we take her to the event.
I had physically and emotionally abusive parents and I always wanted to do my best for my child. She knows I’m always here and she can talk to me any time. DH and I both love her so much.
I’m looking for advice on how to deal with this and how to help her through it. We already explained to her why we said no, she’s not accepting, and we also explained it to her that in life sometimes you just don’t get what you want and you need to be okay with that and that’s what resilience is. I think she might be influenced by others too. She is not allowed on SM and only has WhatsApp for the last month or so.
Thank you!

Tell her that what she's doing it emotional blackmail and it doesn't fly. Tell her actually this is a treat and treats are EARNED, not demanded eith threats (which is what she said by saying she'd be miserable all summer). If she shows she can listen, be an active member of the family and GIVE things like tody up and care for her own Pets, then she can have treats. But otherwise hard no and ask again and the next request is a no, ask again and next request is a no.

What’s the activity?

Stop engaging with her about it. You’ve said no. Every time it’s discussed she’ll think there might be a chance you’ll change your mind. If you change your mind now you will reinforce this terrible behaviour because it works.
Simply tell her you will not be discussing this any further, and change the subject or walk away to hang washing or be busy elsewhere.

Ah OP this sounds tough. I think the only thing to do is to carry on as you are. Keep repeating a simple sentence "we've explained why you can't do that particular activity. Would you like to choose an alternative? Here are some suggestions".

It does sound like she is genuinely gutted not to be able to do this activity (are her friends of the same age allowed to do it?), so I would keep it separate from the other issues (eg caring for her pets) and deal with those separately. Agree on consequences for those behaviours that aren't linked to this activity.

Don't worry OP, if she's a bit spoilt for her age it's not too late to turn it around.

Consistency is definitely key. If you've said 'no' you need to mean 'no', not 'ask me again 500 times and I'll change my mind' which she has learnt works in the past. This will be tough until the event has passed but next time she'll know that when you say no you mean it.

Hopefully some other things crop up between now and then and she'll shut up learn sooner!

You absolutely can’t go back on your decision now. She’s trying to blackmail you with her behaviour.
I’d be saying that her reaction and behaviour just shows she’s not mature enough.
Sounds like past experience has shown her that if she makes enough fuss she gets what she wants.
As you are approaching the teenage years you are right to firm up rules and boundaries. You are parenting.
Agree with a PP around consequences for not doing expected tasks with some positive rewards built in too.

She doesn’t have to accept the no.
You are just going to enforce the no

You’re in authority over her as her parents, don’t forget that, and don’t let her forget it either.

All of the above but if she continues to neglect her pets, they need to go to a better home where consistency will be provided by their owner.

She is relying on you all to do everything to suit her. That is a form of blackmail and emotional abuse, and taking it out on defenceless animals is absolutely unacceptable.

You need to set consequences for this behaviour and damn well stick to it

Pig headedness (refusing to engage with family life or help out) would be met with a landslide of seriously fucked off Mother from me.

Shed be stripped of niceties like phone, play stations or similar. I have four daughters. They know not to lock horns with me.

3 of them are adults and they've grown up fine. We're all good. Kids need to push against something and as a parent you need to push back! Don't take any shit.

What is the activity?

I'd ignore the sulking as much as possible. Absolutely do not give in.

I'd ask her if she still wants her pets. If she does she needs to look after them, it's not their fault you've said no to this event. If she doesn't (or if she says she does, but doesn't look after them) then take them to be rehomed.

Well she has to take no for an answer doesn’t she, she’s not getting her way. I’d most certainly also be drawing a line in the sand about the pets. I’d tell her that if she can’t look after living creatures who rely on her they will be rehomed.

I’ve said this before and it’s probably (most likely) not very popular but lose your shit.

A productive shouting of “no. I said no. It’s not happening, stop asking” shouted loud enough to stop her in her tracks and make her listen. Not unlike an animal would hiss or growl at their own offspring to warn them they’ve crossed a line.

Had to be done a couple of times with mine but it taught them not to be pestering little arseholes and that there’s lines and boundaries they can’t cross.
They’re grown-ish now and have become pretty decent human beings and they don’t think I’m a twat so it must have worked ok.

most 12 year olds are not capable of looking after pets consistently. That’s why adults need to be back up.

you may be better off getting her to do chores that impact herself.

you can’t make her accept your decision. She’s going to kvetch about it. But you do need to not change it

I agree with this. She's trying the 'I'll be a brat if you don't let me do what I want' method, and the problem with this is that, if it works, you end up with a full-time brat. So I agree with the 'lose it once and never mention it again' approach.

I agree with this.

Having someone lose their shit at you is a real life consequence of behaving like a proper little brat. She needs to learn this.

Time is running out on your influence as parents. Use your remaining time wisely.

What dairy reiterated

She's running rings around you, op

What is the activity? Her behavior is wrong but without knowing the context it’s hard to give advice. She may be justified in her outrage if it’s something that is age appropriate and she feels unfairly treated.

Consistency is key. Yes, it should have been done eight years ago but better late than never.

It doesn't matter what the activity is, you've said no and you absolutely have to stick to your guns now.

I personally think she's old enough to be told that you're on to her manipulation and it won't work. But you need to get a lot tougher. If my twelve-year-old refused to do anything there'd be an immediate punishment. If she won't unpack her stuff, her phone gets taken off her for a day for example.

I've managed to drag three children into successful adulthood. You'll get there but you can't equate discipline with abuse. Be careful not to let your past make you a pushover.

The word abusive gets used a lot these days. No one used to say setting rules, and calmly sticking to them was abusive. If anything, indulging/giving into kids and teaching them the world should revolve round their desires was seen as cruel to the child, and to society.
Her being cruel to her pets-at her age! is awful. If she's going to blackmail you by mistreating them, warn her that you will rehome them, as animal cruelty/neglect is a crime, and she is over the age of criminal responsibility. Anytime she refuses to obey any reasonable request, ensure there is a consequence (pocket money, TV, whatever).
I honestly think that part of the reason one of my exes mistreated me was because his parents indulged him, and if he sulked, they gave in. He lost jobs as well because he would argue with bosses, so giving in to your kid could actually have serious effects for her future.

You are the parent
She is the 13 year old child
Read that again… digest it… see what I’m saying?
And what’s the pets? There’s a difference between stick insects, cats & horses.

Absolutely do NOT cave to emotional blackmail.
No more discussion. The answer was no, we are not talking about it anymore.
I would ignore the unpacking and other signs of sulking. Apart from the pets. Refusal to care for them needs consequences.
She has learned over time that being sad and annoying for long enough will get her what she wants.
Honestly I’d have lost my temper ages ago if I was you!

What’s the activity? Does she have any right on her side?

“she’s also not looking after her pets.”

If she can’t take responsibility for her pets, then perhaps you should be looking at getting them re-homed. I’d say that the bolshy behaviour and refusal to take responsibility for her own things and her pets all demonstrate beyond a shadow of doubt that she’s not old enough for the activity, and that she will have to put in a lot more spadework before you will even consider it - but for this year at least, it’s completely off the cards and there’s no point talking about it because you and DH are adamant and there is nothing that will make you change your minds. There must be something else she wants to do, by way of a bit of a carrot - but she needs to know that there’s a huge difference between refusing to tidy your bedroom, and refusing to look after pets that are dependent on you.

I think it matters a lot. For example if it’s something that is age appropriate eg a tennis club or something then it could be a case of overprotective parents and this is not good for a child’s social and emotional development. If it’s something actually inappropriate or dangerous eg wild swimming when she can’t even swim yet then obviously they are correct.