How to handle a 12-year-old refusing to accept a ‘NO’?

[YellowMellow99]

I’m looking for some advice please. TIA for your help and please be kind. 🙏🏼
Our 12.5 year old DD latched on to the idea of going to an activity this summer that DH (her father) and I deemed age inappropriate. We explained this to her and said no. We said she can choose another activity.
She’s completely refusing to take no for an answer and has been really upset, angry, uncooperative and argumentative.
It’s tempting to give in to her but that’s what DH used to do and look where that got us!
DD is very smart and (like any tween/teen her age) can be quite manipulative to get her way. She refuses to help with anything, unpack her things (we just moved house a month ago), she’s also not looking after her pets. She says she’d do more if we take her to this event but we already said no and explained why. DH and I have a united front. DD is generally lazy as DH used to just do stuff for her and she soon learned that she should ‘just enjoy being a child’. DH came to realise that this was not a good idea and we are trying to change things and get DD take on more responsibilities (at least tidy up after herself and look after some of her pets) but she’s just very demanding, doesn’t do things unless she gets something out of it, and she can be uncooperative and difficult.
I think DH doing everything for her made her quite spoiled and she’s our only child so that probably didn’t help either.
I’m giving all this as a background information.
She said she’ll be miserable and upset while summer and not talk to us, unless we take her to the event.
I had physically and emotionally abusive parents and I always wanted to do my best for my child. She knows I’m always here and she can talk to me any time. DH and I both love her so much.
I’m looking for advice on how to deal with this and how to help her through it. We already explained to her why we said no, she’s not accepting, and we also explained it to her that in life sometimes you just don’t get what you want and you need to be okay with that and that’s what resilience is. I think she might be influenced by others too. She is not allowed on SM and only has WhatsApp for the last month or so.
Thank you!

@YellowMellow99 tell her she is not a toddler and it doesn't matter how many times she asks, it will always be no.
No means no, yes means yes and there is no maybe.

I was reading this until the last OP post and thought about the power of praise. As a parent of a now adult DS - ADS and ADHD amongst other things - I have had to face the confrontational, and refusal issue over the years. He would literally argue black is white and the first response to anything asked would be negative. This started around 11. It has been hard, but I do not say "NO". I say yes of course you can do that (example for the trip she wants) in X years, that is such a good idea, how lovely. Of course you can have your phone after you pick up clothes, put away the dishes or feed pets - absolutely with pleasure. When DS does what I want I tell him how grateful I am and what a star he is for being so helpful.. This might sound soft, but we do not have confrontation. His response was "ok thank you". By 14 he was helping around the house without prompting,
As an adult he thanks me for doing things for him, and I get I love yous umpteen times a day. Not saying it will work for you but just another perspective from an older Mum.

Rehome her pets that she is not taking care of under the guise of animal cruelty and keep saying no, and the bit about not talking to you, perfect she won't be mentioning it again then, will she. Best of luck, stay strong 💪

What age did she get the Kindle? Before or after her sleep regressed? Reading is a great habit at bedtime but it doesn't need to be on a screen. I would remove the Kindle at bedtime and get paper books for her to read then. Join your local library. You'll be able to see more easily if she has a light on and reading too late. This is also consistent with "no screens after x time".

That wasn't me but I agree and think the poster means eg doing her own laundry, so if not done she has nothing to wear. Also chores relating directly to pocket money, so if not done has no money. Eg tidying room.

This 100% under no circumstances back track.

With pets- if she doesn’t look after them, they go. It’s not okay to lash out on animals by not looking after them.

As for the behaviour, keep up with what you are doing. She needs to learn she’s not getting her own way.

With pets- if she doesn’t look after them, they go. It’s not okay to lash out on animals by not looking after them.

As for the behaviour, keep up with what you are doing. She needs to learn she’s not getting her own way.

With pets- if she doesn’t look after them, they go. It’s not okay to lash out on animals by not looking after them.

As for the behaviour, keep up with what you are doing. She needs to learn she’s not getting her own way.

With pets- if she doesn’t look after them, they go. It’s not okay to lash out on animals by not looking after them.

As for the behaviour, keep up with what you are doing. She needs to learn she’s not getting her own way.

With pets- if she doesn’t look after them, they go. It’s not okay to lash out on animals by not looking after them.

As for the behaviour, keep up with what you are doing. She needs to learn she’s not getting her own way.

It’s important with consequences not to jump in too high-it’s hard to back down. So I’d start with her having to earn her phone time. If she’s rude, she looses an hour.
if you take it for a day, the day is lost. An hour- she has time to
adjust her behaviour and get it back. If she refuses to hand it over- no phone for the next day at all.

As for friends- nope! She earns going out.

No seems to be a big trigger for teens. But also teens are trying assert dominance (normal part of development). Like another person has said consistency is KEY.. She will try and break you.

You just need to stick with your boundary. This will go on and on cause she believes you will cave in. Just don't cave. Deal with your emotional reaction, this is some what triggering something in you, so find a way to cope with it.

Allow her to feel/react the way she wants. A very normal response to not getting what you want as child who is learning boundaries.

I do believe parents now days give in because they can't emotional regulate themselves, and evidently this has a massive impact on their child. Why can't a child get annoyed at not getting what they want? Doesn't mean you give in. Children are allowed to feel raw emotions in order to process situations. Otherwise you'll have grown adults filled with anxiety/worry/depression cause no one is there to rescue them.

You say that you both realised you needed a firmer approach to this and this means that your refusal will be a shock for her and a battle for you. If you give in and change your mind you will always do it and this will be a design for life for her as she grows up. You have to teach her that the world is not always going to go her way.
The pets: Give her one week to show that she can feed, clean and love them otherwise they will go to a home that does. Stick to it. Do it. They are living things in need of care and you have a home, family and jobs to maintain already.
The belongings: as long as her furniture is in her room and set up for her this is her choice. If she threatens not to unpack, it's her stuff not yours. Shrug it off.
The event/activity: It's over. You've decided. "Are we still on this? We told you no, it's not going to change and you aren't behaving in a way that will you do you any favours in the future." Then move on.

Just saw a few comments saying the event could be pride related. If it is a pride event, can you go as a family in the future as a compromise for improved behaviour?

OP has explained this very clearly. Parents have said no; DD is being defiant, it doesn’t matter what the event is.

Agreed. Keep the issues separate so she can see a cause an effect rather than you just "punishing her" (even though I know that's not what you're doing.) For example, "if you carry on neglecting your pets, we will find new homes for them." (Just make sure you stick to whatever you tell her.) "I've explained why you can't go and I have made a decision in YOUR best interests. This is the end of the discussion unless you want to ask something new that we haven't discussed yet." etc etc. Good luck!

It takes many years before this to have made no recognised. By now our 12 year old who is ND knows it means no. They get upset but accept it, we explain, they have a meltdown, but eventually they understand. This is what we've always done so it's not a new trauma to deal with .

You’re concerned she’s reading for too long but don’t care she has Chat GPT and WhatsApp and no supervision on her phone? Honestly take away the phone! Give her one hour a day to socialise and delete chat gpt.

This. Also refusing to wait on her hand and foot if her protest includes things like not bringing her laundry down to wash or her room filling up with dirty cups and snack wrappers. So, don't do her washing and, whilst you might have to retrieve the cups, stop buying her snacks - that sort of thing. If it carries on much longet I'd be docking pocket money or withdrawing any extra-curricular activities you pay for etc. You just have to tough it out.

I think your whole mission has been to not wind her up and make sure she is OK. I'm astounded when suggestions are made and the op replies "she would go ballistic if I did that" My son "went ballistic" several times in his early teens. I just ignored him until he had calmed down. You are not doing her any favours by being such a walkover.

Nah, doesn't work, they have then learned what buttons to press. What will you do when they ignore you? Shout louder?
There have to be consequences; if she wants to live in a shit tip, fine. If she won't look after the animals take them away.
Take the privileges away; respect is earned when things start disappearing.

As a secondary school teacher and parent of a very difficult DD back in the day, my comments are based in experience. You must get control of your DD now. If you don't, if you weaken and relent because it's easier to give in you are setting yourselves up for a whole world of pain for a very long time.
I've had parents crying at P-T evenings about their out-of-control child who is now bigger than them, has no respect, no boundaries and the parent has no hope of getting the child 'back'. You can't suddenly make a teenager behave if the building blocks of consequences and respect haven't been built in the younger years. This is where you are.
You and your partner MUST get on the same page. Your DD has clearly been playing you off against each other for some time. That must stop. You need to set boundaries and expectations. And consequences and then follow through. Every single time. You CAN stop her seeing unsuitable friends, you CAN put in rules around phones, you CAN monitor and manage her life better. You CAN say no and not explain your reasons. She is allowed to be upset, to feel big emotions - it's part of growing up. Your job is to help her process them, manage them. Being pandered to is not helping her.
Part of the problem is that you're tending to tread her like a reasonable adult human, who can think and behave rationally. A clever and bright 12 year old is still a child and you need to treat her as one. Not a baby, but a child who needs guidance and help to become a decent human being, someone you're proud of and want to know when they're older.
As others have said, stop explaining and arguing. Say no and mean it. Keep emotion out of, be flat and calm. You are the adult, so be the adult. Many of us had shit childhoods, it doesn't mean we can't be decent parents.
My very difficult and challenging DD pushed back all the way through from a toddler to a teen. But expectations were reinforced, DH and I were on the same page and now she's a delight, someone I like as well as love, and am very happy to have in my life. I know it's tough, but it's your job as a parent to deal in tough love.

The issue is she's not taking no for an answer

No - the issue is that you want her to happily take no for an answer and are trying to coax her or persuade her to do so because you can't deal with the emotions she's displaying.

In order for her to take no for an answer, all you have to do is keep saying no. The event will pass and she won't have gone to it.

On a daily basis, however, you take care of the pets and do the chores. This is because you are afraid of her feelings.

Because you're afraid of her feelings, or unable to cope with seeing her sad/ angry/ performing misery, and because your husband can't cope with arguments/ raised voices (or whatever) you've given your child the idea that her feelings are something big and scary, and not something that she can be aware of and come out the other end of.

This is the opposite of co-regulation. Co-regulation involves sitting (in a broad sense, not necessarily right there on the couch beside them) calmly with the child and letting them know you understand they are sad/ mad/ frustrated BUT you are not going to change your mind regardless of the noise they are making and regardless of how heartfelt the emotions may be. The aim is to teach the child that feelings come and feelings go, but once they've washed over you, you can re-enter your life, and take up where you've left off.

You do not co-regulate by persuading the child to be happy. That bit is completely up to the child.

All you have to do is let them know you understand they have deep feelings. Then you let them know that you expect them to get over those feelings, and that this is desirable. You let them manage this part themselves. If they persist in throwing a tantrum or winding themselves up, you are allowed to tell them you hope and believe that they'll soon feel better, and get on with your own life.

You do not need to hover or explain or engage in any more soothing.

You need to address her not looking after her pets, she has to learn they are living creatures depending on her and that’s a priority. I really wouldn’t give in to her unless you want a world of trouble. My parents did this with one of my siblings and consequently they have suffered in adulthood, not understanding that life is not arranged in their interests. You won’t be doing her any favours.