Father not being given access to children - where do I stand?

[al3555]

Hi,

Bit of background, I (father) had a period of ill mental health a few years ago, married with 3 young children I struggled to balance work and family pressures and had 3 spells in hospital due to this and other family issues.
Fast forward 5 years I'm now stable, in a good job and finalising divorce from the kids mother. She has blocked me seeing the children for the past 3 years and I miss them terribly. I realise the only way I'll get access is through the C100 court process but am worried that my psychological background will stop me from seeing them even though I have been free of any treatment for 3 years and am coping well with life in general.
Have spoken to a couple of other fathers in similar situations and one of the things which comes up is that I'll need a full psychological assessment at a cost of £5000 or more (I don't qualify for legal aid) which I can barely afford. I'm going to be representing myself, I was just wondering if anyone had any thoughts/advice for me, all I want to do is see my children.

Thanks

I wouldn’t worry Op, the absolute worst fathers are granted access by the family courts. And you can force your ex to pay thousands she doesn’t have on reports etc.

Your mental health is not a barrier to seeing your children, even if you were still receiving treatment. I have been hospitalised a number of times as a psychiatric inpatient and there has never been the slightest suggestion that I wasn’t safe to be around my children. If your ex is stating that your mental health is the reason you cannot see them, then it’s up to her to prove that. The court may ask for a psychological assessment but you should be able to access that through the team which previously fealty with you while you were unwell z

Sorry you have had a difficult time with your mental health op, if this were a female posting this posters would be up in arms at her being not allowed access to her children due to mental health difficulties that are now resolved. Its not a very friendly place for men and I wouldn't recommend posting here to be honest some of the posters have been completely hostile.

Imagine if women with serious PND etc were permanently banned from seeing their kids. There'd be outrage!

If it was as simple as that I think you’d be right. If it was a woman who’d been prevented from seeing her kids because of an NMO and they’d been less than completely honest in their thread I think it would be fairly similar.

You dont get NMO's for PND

@MademoiselleTrunchbull

You don't get NMOs for mental health breakdowns, even severe breakdowns. Mental health problems are not a barrier to contact with children. The overwhelming majority of people having serious issues with mental health do not come close to an NMO because they are mot abusive /coercive/violent or any of the other behaviours which eventually and after much damage trigger an NMO

I find your attitude that the wife wasn't working when even if not I paid work they were trying g to raise a family with three young children in the face of behaviour bad enough to earn an NMO very telling. You also assume the house was paid for by the op earnings - we don't know how the house was funded initially or ongoing.

The op was given their answer inthe first posts - he needs to go to the court system and if necessary get the assessment.

There would. And in a world where women regularly kill men, and children and shelters are full of men and their children, and two men die a week at the hands of their female partners, and family annihilation for revenge is something women do, and men live all over the country in fear of their and their children's lives and on and on... then we can flip the sexes and pretend it's the same. Yes, he had MH issues, and it's great he received treatment, but sometimes men with MH issues have the same violence as men without MH issues towards women and children. I know more than one women fleeing for her life from a man with PTSD or a PD or a diagnosed MH issue.

In the world we live in, I knew from the first post, where he didn't mention the NMO, that there would be a drip feed about something like that. Don't put it in the first post because the advice from the support humans will be different.

OP, I'm sure you love your kids. Why not seek advice from a professional family therapist, who you are 100% honest with, about what your CHILDREN need. Not what you want, what they need. They (the eldest 2) will be adults soon and can choose what contact they would like.

Just to clarify a NMO does not have to be any kindof abuse. The NMO is one of the basic orders including things like harassment etc. We currently have a non molestation against someone who wouldn't stop hate mail and threats for 2 years...So does not have to be anything physical or major to get that one. There are other orders for the deeper stuff.

Hate mail, harassment and threats ARE abuse.

And since the OP won't tell us what his behaviour was, is it really a good idea to come on to handmaiden his behaviour away? If it was minor, I'm fairly sure he would have said.

I am shocked at the suggestion that two years of hate mail and threats are not “ major “.

Yup. People have very different views to me.

#1 is so staggeringly presumptuous and ignorant

Yes NMOs are most commonly associated with domestic abuse but as part of the system I have also witnessed plenty being issued for continued dangerous behaviour during psychotic episodes, etc. OP was put into a mental hospital for 7 months

Also there are so many PPs getting on his case for not forcing contact with kids during NMO.... How does that even sound like a good idea? (See the timeline he provided in later updates) Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I think that was a respectful choice towards ex wife.

Not saying I think he's right but people are clearly just being hostile and antagonistic.

@sublimeursula Yes agreed lack of details a bit dodge but as he's said it's not domestic abuse are people just assuming he's lying?

Also personally have strong opinions on people always saying (with no good reason or proof in this case) "don't blame mental illness, it was you". Real mental illnesss manifests in ugly, godawful and bloody traumatising ways. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It's like only pretty, not too harmless and inward-facing (retreat/self harm) mental illness is real.

You might be thinking of normal inpatient mental health care, but have heard patients and even staff call high-security psych hospitals "mental hospitals" or worse

Again not saying he's in the right but people seem so sure they know more than they do. I don't think this is the best forum for him to post to get advice

"or worse" = much much worse

You sound very self absorbed OP. You're minimizing the trauma you have put them through. You refuse to be honest about the NMO. The comment about the house, the " they have a four bed house and I'm in a flat" and the " I allowed it" are very telling.

I'd say your ex wife and children are terrified of you and for good reason.

I just don’t see how any of the poor me take the OP is spinning here adds up.

Claims of no abuse but a non molestation order in place for 2 years.

Claims that he can’t afford £5k but he’s giving his ex 60% of his income. Spousal maintenance and child maintenance. But also that he’s always paid maintenance at the CMS rate.

Claims that he’s been seriously ill requiring periods of hospitalisation and unable to work but somehow his ex has managed to not work and stay in a £650k house (that still has a mortgage the OP claims to be paying). Claims that he’s ‘given’ her the house.

And so on.

If you want to see your children, then the first thing to do is to be completely honest with yourself and everyone else about what has actually been happening. Because the yarn you’re spinning us here is full of holes.

Nope, most posters asking this have been asking why, if there has been three years since the order expired, he has not initiated contact during that period.

What has changed now?

Also personally have strong opinions on people always saying (with no good reason or proof in this case) "don't blame mental illness, it was you". Real mental illnesss manifests in ugly, godawful and bloody traumatising ways. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It's like only pretty, not too harmless and inward-facing (retreat/self harm) mental illness is real.

That isn't remotely what people have been saying on this thread. I'm also very familiar with the impacts which serious mental health breakdowns can have on behaviour - it remains the fact that the vast majority of patients do not end up with NMOs and do maintain contact with families throughout treatment.

Lets look at the OP's own claims.

• The OP claims they had a mental health crisis resulting in many months as an in patient.
• They drip feed that there was an NMO in place for two years and we know that typically means at least a year or two of the problem behaviour before an NMO was ordered (so from when the children were very young indeed).
• The OP thirdly stated that for three further years he hasn't tried to re-initiate contact with the children. Why not if its so important?
• They haven't taken out the suggested psyche assessment because its expensive but at the same time are ostensibly earning well to maintain two households independently
• He has declined to say what the NMO was for simply saying it wasn't abuse. Considering the high bar for an NMO that creates more questions than it answers.

Now what does a man with a prior NMO taken out by his own family do for advice? Well the obvious place to go to ask how he can get contact without spending money is a forum topic used extensively by victims of male abuse isn't it? Not a mental health forum or the professional advice recommended but a here.

And right on cue you can guarantee that the handmaidens will all be along to say "poor menz, women wouldn't have to put up with this", suggest that harrassment isn't abuse and comparing NMO levels of behaviour to PND.

What is the reason for the non molestation order?

If that reason still exists then you are not going to get contact.

I'd hate to be a man with serious MH problems. I can understand why suicide is now the main cause of death for men.