At breaking point with parenting; have lost hope of it getting better

[kettlesonnow]

I have posted about this before but not on this board. I don’t know how anybody can help me (so if I seem to be saying no a lot please don’t take that personally) but I need to reach out.

Basically I feel I made an absolutely huge mistake when we decided to have a second child and this haunts me almost daily. I have read threads on this and most seem to be from women with the youngest child aged under one, so things are still shaky. For us, well, we’re nearly three years in and it’s still fucking awful!

My two are five and nearly three. Apart, they are OK … definitely not perfect but manageable.

Together they are unmanageable and I have really tried to follow the advice and read the books and it hasn’t made any difference at all and I’m still miserable.

They work one another up, they won’t leave one another alone, if one is happy and playing quietly the other intervenes to ensure that ends. They become different people around one another and people who in all honesty aren’t very nice. I am frequently mortified by their behaviour to be honest and I’m conscious that makes me tense up and things more likely to go wrong.

I am now at the point where it isn’t advice on parenting I need but how the hell I can survive this without becoming someone I dislike too. I’ve become irritable and tense, impatient and easy to anger. I’m also absolutely filled with regret for the life I could have known. And I know I need to get past this because I can’t do anything about it now, but I just can’t.

It isn’t so much that they argue (they do sometimes) it is more that I don’t really like who they are together. They listen to one another rather than me so behaviour becomes extremely difficult, sometimes bordering on out of control.

Do you think you could have post natal depression OP ? I had it after the second and it lasted for years . I didn't bond and had thoughts I can't even voice on a public forum . It was only looking back that I realised how ill I was . I eventually was put on anti depressants and they made a difference . Could you see a different GP?

Did you look up Dopamine seeking behaviour OP?

I know being off sick is akin to killing someone in school culture, but please take a day off this week and get a same day appt. Tell them you're having a MH crisis if they don't want to give you one. Be clear you're worried about your MH, you're overreacting with your children and losing your temper. When I went on citalopram (sp?) I was shocked that my sense of humour and 'zen' came back (I didn't realise it had gone) along with stopping my intrusive thoughts and general anxiety and depression. The thing is that to a limited extent your mood can impact on theirs, so it helped the wider family as soon as it kicked in.

I had a similar incident to you where I tore up a pirate sword and threw it away. It's so tough, you absolutely can't see the wood for the trees. You need a GP appt.

Thanks. @Contrarymary30 I do think I had PND with ds but not with dd and I can honestly say I love spending time with them as individuals - well, mostly anyway. Dd definitely has her moments but 2/3 is a tricky age and it’s manageable when it’s just her.

DS is no trouble at all on his own. He isn’t perfect, he has various irritating habits (opening drawers I barely even knew we had and rifling through finding long ago items which return to haunt me; I found a baby bottle that I bought around when I had dd the other day!) But again it’s manageable.

This morning was a case in point, they both have those mini Yoto players and had them on loud in the same room, leaping around and laughing. A child listening to music isn’t doing anything wrong but the combination of noise was just too much.

DS goes to bed late; dd wakes early = no me time at all!

I could take time off but the problem is I only work on days DH wfh and so I can’t even just chill and relax at home.

I’m not advocating walloping them our parents never hit us but we really really did not want to make our parents cross. And they are lovely people and brilliant parents. We were the same with ours. Society demands parents be too nicey nicey now. This is the end result.

Ok so how did they do that? Because I would guess the threat was there even if they didn’t actually do it. And if not then do tell me what they did!

You need to make a doctors appointment and get some anti depressants.

But you also need to enforce some boundaries. Two loud Yoto players, one or both goes off and if there are tantrums are taken away until the weekend.

I still want to know where your husband is in all of this. I know you say he’s injured but if he can work full time including working away he can actively parent too and take some of this effort away from you.

FFS yes boundaries and then they ignore the boundaries and you enforce boundaries and they ignore them.

This is why I am not bothering with books or podcasts as they say the impossible as if it’s easy. ‘You need to get to the moon and then you can find the item.’ How do I get to the moon? ‘Get to the moon and …’

And I’ve told you where my husband is or do you want his office address or something?

You know what I mean. He seems utterly absent. If he’s still working full time why can he do nothing at home?

If he’s working from home can he do pick-ups so you get a bit of time to yourself after school for a day or so?

Yes - I know what you mean, but given I’ve answered it already I don’t really know what you think is to be gained by insisting I answer again when it must be obvious I’m already stressed to the max.

The Yotos were removed. Cue screaming and shouting. And it’s that which I’m posting about. Life just feels an endless round of screams, tears, arguments and conflict.

I’m really sorry you’re struggling. You have to phone the doctors for an appointment today and go. Take your DD with you if you have to.

The Yotos were removed - cue screaming and shouting. Then you have to do this over and over again until they understand that both Yotos are not to be on in the same room.

saying things once and then giving up, or giving a consequence and not following through is likely to be a big part of the problem.

you (and your DH if he really is involved with parenting your dc) need to decide what behaviours are most important to change and how you’re going to do this. Pick your battles but be consistent. Be prepared for the kids to hate it at first. This is the time that’s most challenging but most important to stick to your guns.

Not having boundaries and consistency has got you to the situation that you’re all in today. Change will be hard. Not changing will be even harder in the long run.

i get that you’re running on fumes, but you have a decision to make.

I totally get it OP. I really think that it will help to see a GP because you're not coping . My first 2 were the same , one was tired and went to bed early the other would stay awake until 11 . Then I was up at 5am with number 1 . They didn't get on and wound each other up , it's exhausting.
It's pointless me saying it will pass ,as it will , because you need some help now .

FGS @Muchtoomuchtodo do you think I’m just a bit dim? They don’t realise at some vague unspecified point mum means business, I’ll lose my Yoto. They don’t care. Because they will move on to something else rapidly.

I am still undecided about the doctor. I was really discouraged last time.

Dd is now asleep …

No idea what happened with that stupid gif. Sorry.

Could you afford (and house) an au pair? An au pair is much cheaper than a nanny - because they are not qualified childcare specialists and only work part-time. An au pair could help with school runs, some housework, play with the children on some evenings and weekends to give you a break - though usually not more than 20 hours a week. They can be brilliant but they can also be a bit shit so I appreciate it is not a magic solution.

What happened at the GP last time, if you don't mind me asking? It's really crap of them if they have made you feel you shouldn't ask for help. Sometimes there is a self referral but I think normally only for talking therapies and courses. If it's medication you want to try, or blood tests to see if hormones/thyroid/vitamins etc are all ok then you probably do need to speak to an actual GP. Sometimes the practice nurse can do some of these things and they can be more sympathetic in general.

I also worked in childcare when my kids were little and my OH works FT with a chronic health condition/disability as well. I almost had a breakdown so I do know how you feel. Basically, there just wasn’t enough of me to meet everyone’s needs. All I can say is that now mine are secondary age it’s totally different and life is transformed so it will get better.

You don’t seem to want to make any changes @kettlesonnow. That’s fine if you’re prepared for this to continue and probably get worse as they get bigger, but you’re consistently saying that you do want things to change. You are past the point of a quick fix I’m afraid.

They will eventually start to care if the rules and consequences are applied fairly and consistently.

Getting yourself sorted will help you to be in a place where you’re ready to take on the challenge. Hopefully with your DH’s involvement

@kettlesonnow I think you are fixating a lot on having two/ it being more difficult with two but I suspect your problems are maybe deeper than that? You seem to have a very fixed mindset that things will never improve.

I teach and have young kids (4 and 1) so I get it about work not being a break! You have your youngest starting school soon though so you will have days to yourself. They will get older and more reasonable.

You don't suggest how DH can help. When is he home from work? Can you divide and rule at the weekends? I'd be putting older one in activites at the weekend as much as possible. Do you have wider family support? Being out the house and around other people always helps me.

You can get to the GP or take a day off even as a teacher.

Hi OP,

I just wanted to come and send you some sympathy as my friend is in a similar situation and I see how difficult it is for her.

Her children are 8 and 11 and they don’t get on at all and my friend also feels at breaking point. They argue constantly, wind each other up endlessly, have physical fights with each other (where injuries occur) and a lot of what my friend has said to me with regards to her feelings is similar to what you are expressing.

She tells me she hates herself when she shouts at them but sometimes she just erupts out of frustration and she will say things she doesn’t mean and it usually ends up with all 3 of them her crying and her feeling absolutely shit about herself. It upsets me so much when she keeps telling me that she’s a bad parent, because she isn’t, she’s just struggling.

Her kids wake up at 05.30am and from the minute their eyes open the stress starts….. she doesn’t get any kind of break, she always feels like she’s on high alert and monitoring their behaviour, she’s exhausted. She’s either trying to keep the kids apart, managing their behaviour or she’s working. She said there’s just no respite and I see it with my own eyes that her life is exactly like that, so I understand when you say you have no time for anything else.

Her husband works Mon-Fri so is available to help more at the weekend but I always get the impression he isn’t affected by their behaviour in the same way my friend is, he seems to be able to detach hinself from it (personally I think he just cant be bothered to deal with it).

But anyway, I’m rambling. I just wanted to say that I feel for you, reading your posts was like having my friend crying on my shoulder, and I know how much it affects her life and emotional state, so I imagine you’re hurting just as much.

If you do choose to go down the route of medication I hope it helps xx

@Allswellthatendswelll there probably is some truth in that and I’ve tried hard to sort of say to myself - well you do have two so make the best of it? - but the intrusive thoughts keep coming.

I think I do compare myself a lot to those around me, most of whom do only have one!

Thanks @PracticallyPeapod , I really hope so. Easter with them both was actually OK - full on but fine. Half term was not fine and I felt very drained and somehow panicked with them both, it’s when they are both on at me or I’m dealing with one and the other just won’t stop talking and then I snap and feel terrible.

@ScaredButUnavoidable you’ve made me laugh as I know you were trying to be supportive but it panicked me more! To be honest, it isn’t so much that the children don’t get on - they actually do. Yes, they bicker and wind one another up but I can also see there’s love there, there’s a bond, but equally as much as they love one another they also are rivals in a sense for time and attention and needs being met.

So it isn’t all bad but I am finding it very difficult. In my calm moments I can see they are normal imperfect children who are sometimes delightful and other times aren’t and while we don’t live in chaos; there are boundaries and expectations and basic rules but equally when you have two very young children in silly moods actually getting them to stick to those boundaries is bloody difficult. This morning for example I separated them because they were being idiots (to be blunt about it) ds was in his room and dd downstairs watching CBeebies so all fine. Then dd comes upstairs and goes straight to ds. Short of locking them up I’m not sure how to avoid this to be honest. It only works if I stay with dd but then I worry it means more and more ds is sent upstairs on his own.

I am hopeful things will improve gradually over the course of next year and be really easing off when dd is four and starts school. But I do think it’s always going to be challenging to an extent with no village and what is increasingly looking like a permanently disabled husband! That’s why I am so vehemently against full time work: it isn’t just the time in work increasing but my general workload of marking and planning. And it also means that when dd does start school I’ll lose my free time which is not going to happen! Plus, less selfishly if I am honest I do not want them in childcare and wraparound five days a week.

@BertieBotts it was actually a locum GP who was a bit ‘well can refer you for counselling if you want’ - very flippant and really not encouraging in terms of opening up! It’s hard though as sometimes I feel OK and other times … I really don’t!

Why did you not take up the offering of counselling? It’s what you need.